*** Official City vs PSG Chumps Lge Match Thread***

[Hazy2]

Haha this has become like a chat with my uncle who is 88. Have a good day boys.

[patrickblue]

We can exaggerate the extent to which chances are missed because of the lack of a striker. One incident was telling, however. In the second half Walker made a run towards the byline and put in a perfect low cross between defenders and goalkeeper. There wasnt a single City player within ten yards to steer it in.

In fairness, Jesus was on and playing as no 9 at that point.
It was really late in the game and we were just playing it out at that point, so not a lot of urgency to get at them.
I really don't think anyone was remotely expecting Walker to do that.

[PeterParker]

We can exaggerate the extent to which chances are missed because of the lack of a striker. One incident was telling, however. In the second half Walker made a run towards the byline and put in a perfect low cross between defenders and goalkeeper. There wasnt a single City player within ten yards to steer it in.

In fairness, Jesus was on and playing as no 9 at that point.
It was really late in the game and we were just playing it out at that point, so not a lot of urgency to get at them.
I really don't think anyone was remotely expecting Walker to do that.

We are lacking a striker, I think this is an issue we miss with teams like Palace, however, as a big critic of us in the past with this, it seems we are starting to come back in big games. With the criminals twice, now with PSG. Still, super early days with this, but clearly there is an improvement.

Also, scrapping the away goal rule will help us a lot in the knockout stages.

[johnny crossan]

City’s collective brilliance outshines the need for a superstar like Messi

Manchester City, Bernardo Silva, Joao Cancelo, Gabriel Jesus
By Daniel Taylor 5h ago 35

There aren’t so many occasions these days when Lionel Messi, as used to be his way, makes it difficult to believe there can ever be enough superlatives in existence to cover what he does on a football pitch.

As much as we might not want to admit it, he no longer tortures opponents in a way that makes you suspect he must belong to a different orbit. You can watch him now without the thought occurring that maybe he is just temporarily on this planet.

Still, though, he is capable of moments that make you wonder how much fun it would have been if all that eye contact with Manchester City last year had led to him coming to play in the Premier League.

One of those moments came in City’s 2-1 defeat of his Paris Saint-Germain side at the Etihad Stadium last night when the six-time Ballon d’Or winner stopped dawdling — and, boy, he really does like a stroll these days — to remind his audience about the precious magic in his feet.

As Messi received the ball in midfield, there were two City players nearby and the nearest, Oleksandr Zinchenko, was quick to challenge him. Not quick enough, though. Messi wriggled clear. Raheem Sterling was next and an instinctive cheer went up as Messi, being Messi, slipped the ball through his legs.

There is nothing more patronising for a footballer at this level than succumbing to a nutmeg and, briefly, the mind went back to the time James Milner made the mistake — silly boy — of diving into a challenge on Messi during a City visit to Barcelona’s Nou Camp in 2015.

Remember that one? The nutmeg from Messi left Milner on his backside and, high in the stands, then-Bayern Munich coach Pep Guardiola was watching as a fan. He had his head in his hands, shaking with laughter at the impudence of his former player.

These days, at age 34, Messi tends to spend even more of his time walking through games. It has always been part of his routine, but more now than ever.

There were only sporadic flashes of his brilliance during City’s latest Champions League assignment and even fewer occasions when colleague Neymar seemed too bothered about affirming his status as one of the sport’s genuine A-listers. Their PSG team-mate Kylian Mbappe may have scored the opening goal but the overall impression was that he had no intention of doing all the running on their behalf.

Mauricio Pochettino is too streetwise to say it, perhaps, but there must be times when the man who inspired so much hard graft from Tottenham Hotspur’s players wishes his PSG front three looked as dynamic on grass as they do on paper.

The good still outweighs the bad, of course, when each of these players is capable of troubling even the most accomplished defences.

Yet it contrasts with the approach that Guardiola has invoked at City, whereby the first rule is to run harder than your opponents and the club have never seemed too obsessed, apart from the early stages of the Abu Dhabi era more than a decade ago, about collecting superstars in the way Real Madrid once did with their galacticos and PSG do now.

Lionel Messi, Neymar, Kylian Mbappe, Paris Saint-Germain
Lionel Messi (centre) helped set up Kylian Mbappe’s opener on Wednesday but had a largely subdued night at the Etihad Stadium (Photo: Marc Atkins/Getty Images)
Maybe it would have been different if Cristiano Ronaldo had accepted City’s invitation to join them in the summer rather than using it as a bargaining tool to negotiate his reunion with Manchester United.

At other times, City have given serious consideration to signing Messi and reuniting Guardiola with the player who helped him make Barcelona possibly the most beautifully constructed club side we have ever seen.

Is there any regret on Guardiola’s part — or that of the multiple former Barcelona executives who are now in charge at City — that it never happened?

It does not seem that way. And, besides, the champions of England are not doing too badly, bearing in mind they were missing Kevin De Bruyne, Phil Foden and Jack Grealish for this 2-1 defeat of PSG, and might have won with a lot more to spare had it not been for some superb goalkeeping and last-ditch defending, Ilkay Gundogan’s shot thudding off the post, and various other moments of misfortune.

The beauty of this City side, in short, is that it is a collective.

They play with a spirit of togetherness. They pass the ball as exquisitely in defence as they do further up the pitch. They collect trophies without having the egos of some teams. They can never be accused of a lack of effort and, in the process, they adhere to some of the core principles that Pochettino had with Spurs but not, it seems, PSG — out-pass your opponents. Outwork them, too. Treat giving the ball away as a sin. And if that does happen, win it back as quickly as possible.

Watching from the stand behind Guardiola’s dugout, one of the more notable parts of Wednesday evening was how the demographic of City’s supporters is gradually changing. The Etihad, more than ever, is becoming a place of interest to visitors from overseas. All sorts of languages can be heard. But it tends to be Guardiola, not any of his players, who is seen around the world as the superstar of this team.

Take a poll among City fans to find their outstanding performer this season and who would be the leading contenders? Joao Cancelo would be one, Bernardo Silva another. Kyle Walker, possibly. Nobody in the crowd, though, was pleading with these three to pass them a personal souvenir of the night.

At the final whistle, there were groups of fans who had wandered down to the front of the stands. They held up homemade banners pleading for their heroes to give them their shirts. Even in the parts of the ground that had been filled with City supporters, the requests seemed mostly for the players of PSG, rather than those from the winning home side.

Here, though, was the hard evidence that a bunch of supremely talented footballers do not necessarily have to be household names or Ballon d’Or contenders for their team to be successful. Nobody passed the ball with more authority than Rodri. Riyad Mahrez carried more menace than any of PSG’s attackers. Gundogan played as though insulted by the suggestion that De Bruyne’s absence might be crucial.

There was the moment when Cancelo clipped the ball to one side of Angel Di Maria, one of PSG’s substitutes, then ran around the other side to collect his own pass. City’s players treated Mbappe’s goal early in the second half as a personal affront and simply set about turning the game back in their favour.

As for Sterling, his contribution mattered more ultimately than the player who had slipped the ball through his legs in the opening half.

Sterling’s goal was his 23rd in the Champions League, which is as many as Frank Lampard accumulated during his career and leaves only two English players — Wayne Rooney, with 30, and Paul Scholes on 24 — who have scored more in this competition.

Messi, to put that into context, has 27 goals against English opponents alone.

His total in the Champions League is a mind-boggling 123 — more than Rooney, Scholes, Lampard and Sterling combined — and it feels a little sad to see the evidence that his powers might be starting to wane.

There were still occasions when he reminded us of his ability to evade opponents, his understanding of space and his gorgeous weight of pass. It just didn’t feel like all those other Champions League nights when he has faced English teams with Barcelona and there was an anguished hush every time he collected the ball in a dangerous position.

In the next couple of years, he will discover that, even for the greatest sportsmen, age becomes the toughest opponent.

Until then, he will always have the ability to make spectators quicken their step on the way to the ground but maybe it is easier now to understand why City, enjoying the view from the top of their qualifying group, were never too distraught that Project Messi didn’t come to anything.

[Mase]

So glad we didn’t get Messi. It’s likely Pep would have got more out of him than Poch is doing now, but he looks a shell of his former self. He genuinely looks completely heartbroken he’s having to play for PSG.

[Mase]

I’ve just watched the video of the grown adult running on the pitch at full time to try to get to Messi. Embarrassing.

[PeterParker]

I’ve just watched the video of the grown adult running on the pitch at full time to try to get to Messi. Embarrassing.

Did you see that kid also going on the pitch, but went at Bernie instead of Messi, Neymar and Mbappe?
That kid will go far in life.

[Mase]

I’ve just watched the video of the grown adult running on the pitch at full time to try to get to Messi. Embarrassing.

Did you see that kid also going on the pitch, but went at Bernie instead of Messi, Neymar and Mbappe?
That kid will go far in life.

I did. I wonder what the parents tell the kid? “Just fuckin run on the pitch! Do it now! We’ll be separated but fuck it, you’re 10 years old now so you need to make your own way in life!”

[sheblue]

So glad we didn’t get Messi. It’s likely Pep would have got more out of him than Poch is doing now, but he looks a shell of his former self. He genuinely looks completely heartbroken he’s having to play for PSG.

Too busy counting all his money to give a fuck about football, let alone PSG.
I was always against him coming to city. And boy am I glad he is with his mercenary mates in Paris milking PSG.

[london blue 2]

I’ve just watched the video of the grown adult running on the pitch at full time to try to get to Messi. Embarrassing.

Did you see that kid also going on the pitch, but went at Bernie instead of Messi, Neymar and Mbappe?
That kid will go far in life.

I did. I wonder what the parents tell the kid? “Just fuckin run on the pitch! Do it now! We’ll be separated but fuck it, you’re 10 years old now so you need to make your own way in life!”

My view too. Clearly under instruction to run on and chance it. You can take the piss and get away with it and all the other little girls and boys who follow the rules get fuck all. Great parenting

[Mase]

I’ve just watched the video of the grown adult running on the pitch at full time to try to get to Messi. Embarrassing.

Did you see that kid also going on the pitch, but went at Bernie instead of Messi, Neymar and Mbappe?
That kid will go far in life.

I did. I wonder what the parents tell the kid? “Just fuckin run on the pitch! Do it now! We’ll be separated but fuck it, you’re 10 years old now so you need to make your own way in life!”

My view too. Clearly under instruction to run on and chance it. You can take the piss and get away with it and all the other little girls and boys who follow the rules get fuck all. Great parenting

If my little girl ran on to the pitch I’d be worried sick about where the stewards would take them. What if some randomer comes over and says, “yeah sorry that’s my kid. I’ll sort them out”. Fuckin stupid thing to force your kid to do.

[Dimples]

Every time I watch Neymar play I keep thinking that he would have been happier being a ladyboy.

[Beefymcfc]

This result papers over what will ultimately cost us the PL and CL this season.
We need a clinical goal scoring center forward.

Don't forget, PSG played with 8.5 players as Messi and Neymar did not try a leg. Mbappe put in a half arsed effort.

If they were playing with 11 they would have won because we were not clinical in front of goal. Once Jesus came on we were better as we had a focal point for attacks but he is not the answer. Neither is Foden, KDB or Grealish.

We need a center forward asap if we want to be in with a good shout to win the PL/CL this season.

I agree, we do need a CF but I’d we play like that, or like many times this season, we don’t need one to win things, just to complement them.

[Beefymcfc]

City’s collective brilliance outshines the need for a superstar like Messi

Manchester City, Bernardo Silva, Joao Cancelo, Gabriel Jesus
By Daniel Taylor 5h ago 35

There aren’t so many occasions these days when Lionel Messi, as used to be his way, makes it difficult to believe there can ever be enough superlatives in existence to cover what he does on a football pitch.

As much as we might not want to admit it, he no longer tortures opponents in a way that makes you suspect he must belong to a different orbit. You can watch him now without the thought occurring that maybe he is just temporarily on this planet.

Still, though, he is capable of moments that make you wonder how much fun it would have been if all that eye contact with Manchester City last year had led to him coming to play in the Premier League.

One of those moments came in City’s 2-1 defeat of his Paris Saint-Germain side at the Etihad Stadium last night when the six-time Ballon d’Or winner stopped dawdling — and, boy, he really does like a stroll these days — to remind his audience about the precious magic in his feet.

As Messi received the ball in midfield, there were two City players nearby and the nearest, Oleksandr Zinchenko, was quick to challenge him. Not quick enough, though. Messi wriggled clear. Raheem Sterling was next and an instinctive cheer went up as Messi, being Messi, slipped the ball through his legs.

There is nothing more patronising for a footballer at this level than succumbing to a nutmeg and, briefly, the mind went back to the time James Milner made the mistake — silly boy — of diving into a challenge on Messi during a City visit to Barcelona’s Nou Camp in 2015.

Remember that one? The nutmeg from Messi left Milner on his backside and, high in the stands, then-Bayern Munich coach Pep Guardiola was watching as a fan. He had his head in his hands, shaking with laughter at the impudence of his former player.

These days, at age 34, Messi tends to spend even more of his time walking through games. It has always been part of his routine, but more now than ever.

There were only sporadic flashes of his brilliance during City’s latest Champions League assignment and even fewer occasions when colleague Neymar seemed too bothered about affirming his status as one of the sport’s genuine A-listers. Their PSG team-mate Kylian Mbappe may have scored the opening goal but the overall impression was that he had no intention of doing all the running on their behalf.

Mauricio Pochettino is too streetwise to say it, perhaps, but there must be times when the man who inspired so much hard graft from Tottenham Hotspur’s players wishes his PSG front three looked as dynamic on grass as they do on paper.

The good still outweighs the bad, of course, when each of these players is capable of troubling even the most accomplished defences.

Yet it contrasts with the approach that Guardiola has invoked at City, whereby the first rule is to run harder than your opponents and the club have never seemed too obsessed, apart from the early stages of the Abu Dhabi era more than a decade ago, about collecting superstars in the way Real Madrid once did with their galacticos and PSG do now.

Lionel Messi, Neymar, Kylian Mbappe, Paris Saint-Germain
Lionel Messi (centre) helped set up Kylian Mbappe’s opener on Wednesday but had a largely subdued night at the Etihad Stadium (Photo: Marc Atkins/Getty Images)
Maybe it would have been different if Cristiano Ronaldo had accepted City’s invitation to join them in the summer rather than using it as a bargaining tool to negotiate his reunion with Manchester United.

At other times, City have given serious consideration to signing Messi and reuniting Guardiola with the player who helped him make Barcelona possibly the most beautifully constructed club side we have ever seen.

Is there any regret on Guardiola’s part — or that of the multiple former Barcelona executives who are now in charge at City — that it never happened?

It does not seem that way. And, besides, the champions of England are not doing too badly, bearing in mind they were missing Kevin De Bruyne, Phil Foden and Jack Grealish for this 2-1 defeat of PSG, and might have won with a lot more to spare had it not been for some superb goalkeeping and last-ditch defending, Ilkay Gundogan’s shot thudding off the post, and various other moments of misfortune.

The beauty of this City side, in short, is that it is a collective.

They play with a spirit of togetherness. They pass the ball as exquisitely in defence as they do further up the pitch. They collect trophies without having the egos of some teams. They can never be accused of a lack of effort and, in the process, they adhere to some of the core principles that Pochettino had with Spurs but not, it seems, PSG — out-pass your opponents. Outwork them, too. Treat giving the ball away as a sin. And if that does happen, win it back as quickly as possible.

Watching from the stand behind Guardiola’s dugout, one of the more notable parts of Wednesday evening was how the demographic of City’s supporters is gradually changing. The Etihad, more than ever, is becoming a place of interest to visitors from overseas. All sorts of languages can be heard. But it tends to be Guardiola, not any of his players, who is seen around the world as the superstar of this team.

Take a poll among City fans to find their outstanding performer this season and who would be the leading contenders? Joao Cancelo would be one, Bernardo Silva another. Kyle Walker, possibly. Nobody in the crowd, though, was pleading with these three to pass them a personal souvenir of the night.

At the final whistle, there were groups of fans who had wandered down to the front of the stands. They held up homemade banners pleading for their heroes to give them their shirts. Even in the parts of the ground that had been filled with City supporters, the requests seemed mostly for the players of PSG, rather than those from the winning home side.

Here, though, was the hard evidence that a bunch of supremely talented footballers do not necessarily have to be household names or Ballon d’Or contenders for their team to be successful. Nobody passed the ball with more authority than Rodri. Riyad Mahrez carried more menace than any of PSG’s attackers. Gundogan played as though insulted by the suggestion that De Bruyne’s absence might be crucial.

There was the moment when Cancelo clipped the ball to one side of Angel Di Maria, one of PSG’s substitutes, then ran around the other side to collect his own pass. City’s players treated Mbappe’s goal early in the second half as a personal affront and simply set about turning the game back in their favour.

As for Sterling, his contribution mattered more ultimately than the player who had slipped the ball through his legs in the opening half.

Sterling’s goal was his 23rd in the Champions League, which is as many as Frank Lampard accumulated during his career and leaves only two English players — Wayne Rooney, with 30, and Paul Scholes on 24 — who have scored more in this competition.

Messi, to put that into context, has 27 goals against English opponents alone.

His total in the Champions League is a mind-boggling 123 — more than Rooney, Scholes, Lampard and Sterling combined — and it feels a little sad to see the evidence that his powers might be starting to wane.

There were still occasions when he reminded us of his ability to evade opponents, his understanding of space and his gorgeous weight of pass. It just didn’t feel like all those other Champions League nights when he has faced English teams with Barcelona and there was an anguished hush every time he collected the ball in a dangerous position.

In the next couple of years, he will discover that, even for the greatest sportsmen, age becomes the toughest opponent.

Until then, he will always have the ability to make spectators quicken their step on the way to the ground but maybe it is easier now to understand why City, enjoying the view from the top of their qualifying group, were never too distraught that Project Messi didn’t come to anything.

Was that the same opinion after the previous game or was the superstar front 3 of PSG the way forward?

[johnny crossan]

City’s collective brilliance outshines the need for a superstar like Messi

Manchester City, Bernardo Silva, Joao Cancelo, Gabriel Jesus
By Daniel Taylor 5h ago 35 .... .

Was that the same opinion after the previous game or was the superstar front 3 of PSG the way forward?

As you say, Danny boy is infinitely malleable - you know his story if we had lost

[Mase]

Video of Messi just strolling around with his head down before our first goal

https://mobile.twitter.com/Javier_EPP/status/1463680752885944323?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1463680752885944323%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-3949668192417960623.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html

[johnny crossan]

(especially for Bear)
PSG’s shape collapsed, with and without the ball.
City switching the play made them pay



By Michael Cox Nov 25, 2021
By this stage, everyone knows the drill with Paris Saint-Germain.

Neymar, Kylian Mbappe and Lionel Messi know the drill. Opposition managers and players know the drill. And Mauricio Pochettino knows the drill so well that he’s seemingly tempted to leave a team leading Ligue 1 by 11 points for a shambolic Manchester United side.

PSG’s front three offered nothing without possession in their 2-1 defeat to Manchester City last night, and eventually, that cost them. They got away with it in September’s reverse fixture, when City dominated at the Parc des Princes but lost 2-0. Here, Pep Guardiola’s side deserved their win.

The frustrating thing about PSG is that they start matches by tricking you into thinking things have changed. In the first couple of minutes at the Etihad, they looked tight and compact, with Messi and Neymar presumably having been instructed to defend inside, preventing Rodri from receiving easy passes but leaving the full-backs free — Kyle Walker, below, has sensed his early freedom.



But by the end of the first half, PSG’s shape had collapsed, with the ball as well as without it.

Three minutes before half-time, Ander Herrera scuffs a clearance down the right touchline, and as the camera pans forward, it becomes clear that PSG’s all-star front three are all walking back towards play from the opposite flank, none of them offering any kind of target for Herrera.



Of course, that becomes an issue defensively too.

Here, with Ilkay Gundogan in possession — and Neymar half-heartedly chasing back — PSG’s usual defensive shape is clear. It’s four defenders and three narrow midfielders, with little hope of being able to protect the wide areas.

City only have two players within that block of seven dark-blue shirts, and are instead focused on creating overloads out wide. Gundogan chooses a pass to Bernardo Silva to his right here, but over on the City left, Joao Cancelo and Raheem Sterling have an overload against Achraf Hakimi.



Eventually, City switch the play back towards that side, and Rodri plays an ambitious ball inside Hakimi, expecting a run to the byline from Cancelo, whereas the Portuguese full-back wanted a simpler ball to feet.

That was a lesson — City needed to be a little more patient and focus on switching the ball between the flanks.



They had, after all, spent the first half doing the right things. Their favoured pass was Cancelo turning inside from left-back and hitting long diagonal passes out to Riyad Mahrez, who held width well down the right flank. They played this pass five times.



Their preferred way of getting in behind, meanwhile, was with a player — usually Bernardo — making a run into the channel as PSG left-back Nuno Mendes was dragged out towards Mahrez.

This run is usually made by Kevin De Bruyne, who didn’t play last night after testing positive for COVID-19, but Bernardo made the same movements effectively.

It’s also worthwhile pointing out that Bernardo was actually playing as City’s notional centre-forward here, but spent much of the game drifting into wider positions to expose PSG down the flanks. This ball into the box was cleared — and, in fairness, centre-backs Marquinhos and Presnel Kimpembe defended their penalty area excellently throughout the game.




But they couldn’t do anything when City crossed deep to the far post — and that’s where the two goals came from.

Interestingly, this is how PSG lost the 2020 Champions League final, where they outplayed Bayern Munich but conceded the only goal when Joshua Kimmich crossed deep for Kingsley Coman to head home.

City’s goals last night were a little more complex than that one, but essentially the same thing.

The first goal started from Cancelo, City’s chief switcher of play, in his regular narrow full-back position. When he passes sideways to Rodri…


…it’s clear City have an overload on the far side. Neymar, highlighted, isn’t anywhere close to tracking Walker — who has become a master of holding his position for the majority of the game and then suddenly making one well-timed forward run to provide a crucial attacking contribution.


Maybe Neymar can’t be expected to track this run anyway — and the more pertinent aspect is that Rodri, the player for whom PSG’s wide attackers seemed to have most responsibility for closing down in the opening minutes, was completely free to play this pass. Indeed, Rodri dictated the game, playing 95 passes, more than any other player.

Walker, meanwhile, arrives at the right time on the blindside of PSG’s defenders and volleys the ball across goal for Sterling to turn it into the net. This is, incidentally, the type of goal Guardiola’s Barcelona used to score regularly, with Dani Alves making the well-timed sprints forward from right-back.



The second goal was similar. Again, PSG are defending with a four and a three — after the introduction of Angel Di Maria for Idrissa Gueye, they were arguably even less effective at protecting their defence. This time, the crucial pass was played from right to left, with Mahrez checking inside and floating the ball across to Bernardo at the far post…



…and his cushioned pass fell to Gabriel Jesus to score the winner.


All this was roughly what we expected beforehand, with the caveat that PSG’s attackers weren’t even using their positional freedom to regularly cause problems on the break — for which City must take credit, as their counter-attacking was highly effective.

RB Leipzig’s 5-0 thrashing of Club Bruges meant PSG sealed their place in the knockout phase even in defeat last night, but the French side’s group-stage performances have been hugely underwhelming: outplayed twice by City, just about defeating Leipzig 3-2 the first time around and then drawing the return 2-2, and dropping points away to Bruges.

For them to win this season’s Champions League, something has to change.

The major change might be the identity of their manager.