Players v Sporting - Assessment

[john@staustell]

Although the press have conveniently forgotten that hardly any of these players will take the field at Spuds in 3 weeks, this match has surely put to bed one or two things - most notably this insane notion that Mancini doesn't have to buy because we have decent academy players, past or present. Although I admit I realised when Nimely and co came on it was time for bed, I had seen enough to judge the players on view. Another interesting debate is how totally shambolic and disorganised the defenders were as a group, without the much-maligned Kolo Touré! In short only Ireland, Bridge and possibly Vieira deserve to be anywhere near the first team on this show. Although we'll give Komps and Lescott the benefit of the doubt due to the rubbish to right, left, behind and front of them.

Hart - usual lousy kicking including hitting the forward's head. Better than Given? Not on your nelly! Arrogant rather than commanding.

Richards - usual disappearing act for the first goal and heaven knows what he was doing for the second. Sorry Micah, Boateng it is.

Kompany - all his many fans may wonder what happened to him and whether he really is a league-winning CB.

Lescott - no glaring errors but lost in a disorganised back line

CunningHAM (as per the Fonz/American version) - Young, academy but no quicker than Garrido. Cruel to say it, but hopeless, with a number of errors.

Johnson, A - anonymous

Vieira - got stuck in, fouled a lot, juggled the ball a lot in bizarre directions

Ireland - looked lively and sharp, but in 2 excellent positions forward, fluffed the final ball. Better than previous though.

Zabaleta - Given the runaround by a lively Sporting midfield - bring back Barry, DeJong or Yaya!!

Bellamy - ran around a lot, missed an early chance or 2

Jo - occasion flashes followed by the usual dire play

Subs -
Bridge - looked more classy than anything else we could offer

Ned - lost except for contributing robustly to the arguments between our defenders

[colonel_muck]

Ireland looked absolutely class on highlights. we cannot let this man leave. simple as. everyone else looked average. and joe hart could have saved the first. massively over-rated due to the land he was born in.

[CitizenYank]

Now I can't judge Citeh by what I saw two weeks ago, because that wasn't a game:
but (outside of the Academy Players) has it occurred to anyone yesterday, they might have been
jogging along???

[john@staustell]

Think your a bit harsh there on Johnson and Jo to be honest.

Have to be harsh if we're talking about challenging for the League mate. I suppose AJ put in some effort, but can you see Jo being in a top 4 side? He does combine flashes of good stuff with rubbish very well. There is no in between! Real Sociedad for him.

I suspect this tour will finally confirm for Bobby who will be leaving. Not Ireland's biggest fan but he did look as if he wants to stay last night, and that he can still cut it.

[david yearsley]

Just seen highlights on the O.S and I´m going to put a positive spin on things

First real workout pre season as last weeks game was pure exibition stuff - our opponents were match fit
Second string team which ended up with basically our youth team out there at the end - Sporting were at full strength
Should have been 2 up in ten mins - with Carlitos we would have been - Hart made no attempt for the second and gave it up rather than risk injury or a red
Carrico would have been sent off for the Jo foul in a normal game so they would have been down to 10
Ireland showed some lovely touches and neat passing particularly early doors
Even Jo showed glimpses of what he is capable of!!
The new kit looked good!

We will up it another notch tomorrow and that´s how pre-season works - slowly building up to full throttle (and with a full squad available)

[BobKowalski]

Only saw the highlights but as pre season games are (in my view) there to get players match fit and match sharp as well as try out players in different positions and other madcap ideas assessing them a waste of time. Dismissing Joe Hart's form and performances last season in preference for a friendly in the US is especially dumb. I have no preference for either Given or Hart as both are good keepers but lets hope that the management team take a more balanced and long term view on their relative merits than snap judgements that not only change from game to game but every15 minutes during the game itself "Oh that was good. Must start for me...No thats shit. Bench it is...well played getting back into it and...no ffs sell him..."

More fucking mood swings than a bi-polar convention

[john@staustell]

It was an assessment on what was in front of us. And 'highlights' is a bit of a give-away. I'm sure others who saw the unedited version will have seen that Hart has improved, but not close to Given's standard. That you CAN see from one friendly, if you have eyes!

[mcfc1632]

Put this in another thread, better placed here:

My summary was:

1/ Enjoyed first 15mins - was pleased to see the tempo / effort from both teams - thought "...this could be a good match..."

2/ In the end Jo showed just how good he is - he was given a platform to impress, and well...... despite some effort he does not even have the basics for a PL striker

3/ Felt for the young lad given a chance at LB (Cunningham) - he had a mare and this was his big chance - and Bridge was ineffective when he came on - shows LB needs sorting still and no surprise the first goal cam from there

4/ Now I am admittedley an anti-Micah poster and was dismayed to see him start with the armband on. After 20mins though I was wondering if this had been a masterstroke by Mancini as Micah was impressing more than he had in the last 2 years put together - defending and going forward...

But after that brief spell of effort we saw the same old same old - as examples:
a) For the 1st goal - he lost the person he should be marking and made a piss poor effort to jump for the ball (the scorer was a slight chap who should not be able to get free headers)
b) He was not responsible directly for the 2nd goal - but god I hate to watch him 'just stand there and watch' - what happens if there is a second play - perhaps a rebaound from the GK - well he is not there 'cos he isn't arsed to get back just in case
c) After the 1st goal he seemed to lose motivation - more and more occaisions of him just jogging about - you could see a break down our right when he was not in the picture - even when the play had been held up by there attacker for quite a while and any defender even 'half-trying' would have been back helping - simply would get totally exposed in PL (again...)

5/ AJ had his most ineffective performance I have seen for quite a while - no lack of effort but he was trying to play as M/F as well as winger and got found out with lots of poor passing - giving the ball away often

6/ Stevie had a platform to impress as well - and I did love some of his touches - but he did not really take this chance - OMG (only a pre-season friendly) but it shows the need for the M/F players we have bought - big problem last season was how Tevez et al were not getting MF service and had to always become the MF to get the ball - Bellers was doing that before hald tie had been reached

7/....the commentators gave a good example of the sort of shit that is gonna be spouted by commentators about our spending every time we are less than 'top drawer'

[brite blu sky]

sorry guys this is way ott for a reaction.

some of you will probably say this is an excuse, but Sporting have been playing pre-season games for a while and were at match speed. If you dont take that into account i cant see how you can understand that game. i watched the full 90 mins and it was obvious City were way off the pace, knew it and were trying to do their best to just hold it together. If anything for me it showed how without decent protection in front of the CB's we could not get any kind of grip on our own game. Someone faster or fitter playing Zabbas role would have changed the whole dynamic of that encounter and even poor Cunningham would not have been left isolated and hung out to dry. That is the only thing i am reading into that game.. we suffered more than we needed because the DM's couldn't get near getting a grip, but as they are not fit it is not really fair to go on about it. Cant see Zabs and Vieira being our first choices for that though. ireland played well, some spark and determination there.. if Jo could return a ball without stopping i thought Stevie would have opened up some chances at some point.

[mcfc1632]

I really understand the '...only a pre-season game etc....' - but I am not sure that most of the 'over-reaction' is actually that

This is not a normal team getting together for a normal 'practice' workout - some cozy little get-together

This is a major squad - of which quite a few of the individuals will get only get so much opportunity to impress and push their case for inclusion etc....

They have been taken away into the best possible 5 star +++ environment for developing fitness etc

....... in some regards - despite being a pre-season friendly - it was disappointing

[Grob]

Considering most of these players are fighting for a place in the team, the effort on show was pretty lacking. The only fellas who actually looked interested were the young players. Have the older ones simply surrendered??

I thought Jo was absolutly bobbins as a front player. Completely ineffective and had no idea how to bring players into the game. Hopeless.

Richards is a liability defensivly. He switched off time and time again.

Vieria was just awful.

Zabs out of his depth in midfield.

Cunningham out of his depth completely.

The fact that those 5 were so poor impacted on the others. Has Kolorov, Barry, Yaya, Boateng, and Adebayor been playing, im pretty certain we would have been much much better than that.

[BobKowalski]

I really understand the '...only a pre-season game etc....' - but I am not sure that most of the 'over-reaction' is actually that

This is not a normal team getting together for a normal 'practice' workout - some cozy little get-together

This is a major squad - of which quite a few of the individuals will get only get so much opportunity to impress and push their case for inclusion etc....

They have been taken away into the best possible 5 star +++ environment for developing fitness etc

....... in some regards - despite being a pre-season friendly - it was disappointing

Is an over reaction in that its just one game and an opening game at that. For example what do you think the purpose of the game was?. To win it? To impress Mancini? To impress the fans? To build match fitness and make sure everyone is match sharp for when it matters namely the opening games of the season? What the watching public want out of it and want the players want out of it and what the management team want out of it are not necessarily the same thing. Its an over reaction because (again) we are judging on a snapshot and not a sequence of games or form or with the advantage of seeing the players in training.

But then we always seem to judge on an instant snapshot. Hart is now crap because he didn't have a great game. Which completely ignores all of last season which is completely insane. Yet some people with Ireland are happy to ignore all of last season because he showed a few good touches in one game. Which is also completely insane. There is no perspective and very little thought behind it. Its people slumped in front of the telly going "ffs thats bobbins" and then venting on a forum.

I said a while back that unless we were winning the opening game at Spurs by at least 3 goals by half time and playing Barca football whilst doing it there would be trouble. I was wrong. I forgot about not winning our pre season friendlies by at least 3 clear goals by half time and playing Barca football.

Talking of Barca since we beat them at home in a pre season friendly last year they must have had a poor season. Anyone know how they got on?

[john@staustell]

I think if players paid tens of thousands a week are playing in any game, friendly or not, they deserve to have their performances discussed - if they play well they will be complimented and if they play crap they will be told - goes with the wages. Obviously there are many diferent opinions and reasons for whatever, but you cannot remove it from discussion because it is a friendly. That's why we are here. It's as if we are not allowed to express any opinion because it is a meaningless tournament. Meaningless maybe, but a tournament none the less.

Our first team would've walked this, fit or not, friendly or not, pre-season or not, tired or not. It just showed that many of our other players couldn't and didn't!

[Green & Blue]

Pre season or not it was really nice to see the lads take a jog in the new kit.Anyone else notice Paddy Vieiras new boots

[Kladze]

One team with the fitness levels of a decent pub team against a team ready to play its first competition match in the Europa league.

I can't believe anyone is even trying to make an assessment tbh.

[Florida Blue]

Think your a bit harsh there on Johnson and Jo to be honest.

Agreed, he was the ONLY one in the midfield with a true attacking mindset. Stevie looked more out of place (position) and does not seem to compliment AJ (and vice versa), Vieira - not much to say, Zabba holding. Johnson was easy for Sporting to neutralize.

[mcfc1632]

I really understand the '...only a pre-season game etc....' - but I am not sure that most of the 'over-reaction' is actually that

This is not a normal team getting together for a normal 'practice' workout - some cozy little get-together

This is a major squad - of which quite a few of the individuals will get only get so much opportunity to impress and push their case for inclusion etc....

They have been taken away into the best possible 5 star +++ environment for developing fitness etc

....... in some regards - despite being a pre-season friendly - it was disappointing

Is an over reaction in that its just one game and an opening game at that. For example what do you think the purpose of the game was?. To win it? To impress Mancini? To impress the fans? To build match fitness and make sure everyone is match sharp for when it matters namely the opening games of the season? What the watching public want out of it and want the players want out of it and what the management team want out of it are not necessarily the same thing. Its an over reaction because (again) we are judging on a snapshot and not a sequence of games or form or with the advantage of seeing the players in training.

But then we always seem to judge on an instant snapshot. Hart is now crap because he didn't have a great game. Which completely ignores all of last season which is completely insane. Yet some people with Ireland are happy to ignore all of last season because he showed a few good touches in one game. Which is also completely insane. There is no perspective and very little thought behind it. Its people slumped in front of the telly going "ffs thats bobbins" and then venting on a forum.

I said a while back that unless we were winning the opening game at Spurs by at least 3 goals by half time and playing Barca football whilst doing it there would be trouble. I was wrong. I forgot about not winning our pre season friendlies by at least 3 clear goals by half time and playing Barca football.

Talking of Barca since we beat them at home in a pre season friendly last year they must have had a poor season. Anyone know how they got on?

Now come on - you make a statement like that and suggest others are over-reacting - think you need a bit of perspective

....re the point of the game - thought it was clear in my earlier assessment post that my disappointment was that some players who should be gagging to press their claims did not - seems an entirely valid point to me and lacking any over-reaction at all

....in your concern that people criticise Mancini - which I do not - you need to be careful to read what is written and not just what you are waiting to jump on

Anyway - why can CITY fans not discuss a CITY performance - there is no big slagging of - noone is predicting the end of the world - I personally expect us to win th PL this season

But there is a big picture here and as I posted earlier:

"... mind you after all the tremendous work by Cook's team to market CITY so well in NY - you can bet he must have been gutted that the playing staff could not do a bit to help...."

And yes I do think that is a valid point and not an over-reaction

[cityPinoy_fc]

People shouldn't take this result seriously yes we played below premiere league level but its preseason where fitness and trying different stuff is being addressed first and foremost. what i hated about the game is that we barely showed any pride and professionalism. come on i don't expect us to win every game but show some competitiveness.

[Alioune DVToure]

Thought: Where is Ecuador's Phil Collins?

[BobKowalski]

I really understand the '...only a pre-season game etc....' - but I am not sure that most of the 'over-reaction' is actually that

This is not a normal team getting together for a normal 'practice' workout - some cozy little get-together

This is a major squad - of which quite a few of the individuals will get only get so much opportunity to impress and push their case for inclusion etc....

They have been taken away into the best possible 5 star +++ environment for developing fitness etc

....... in some regards - despite being a pre-season friendly - it was disappointing

Is an over reaction in that its just one game and an opening game at that. For example what do you think the purpose of the game was?. To win it? To impress Mancini? To impress the fans? To build match fitness and make sure everyone is match sharp for when it matters namely the opening games of the season? What the watching public want out of it and want the players want out of it and what the management team want out of it are not necessarily the same thing. Its an over reaction because (again) we are judging on a snapshot and not a sequence of games or form or with the advantage of seeing the players in training.

But then we always seem to judge on an instant snapshot. Hart is now crap because he didn't have a great game. Which completely ignores all of last season which is completely insane. Yet some people with Ireland are happy to ignore all of last season because he showed a few good touches in one game. Which is also completely insane. There is no perspective and very little thought behind it. Its people slumped in front of the telly going "ffs thats bobbins" and then venting on a forum.

I said a while back that unless we were winning the opening game at Spurs by at least 3 goals by half time and playing Barca football whilst doing it there would be trouble. I was wrong. I forgot about not winning our pre season friendlies by at least 3 clear goals by half time and playing Barca football.

Talking of Barca since we beat them at home in a pre season friendly last year they must have had a poor season. Anyone know how they got on?

Now come on - you make a statement like that and suggest others are over-reacting - think you need a bit of perspective...

Ok that made me chuckle.

Actually even though I was quoting your post I did wander off onto points not raised by yourself so apologies for that.

Players looking to impress Mancini well maybe but that will only happen over the course of the pre season including training and games. Besides I don't think Jo banging in a hatrick in the opening friendly is likely to wipe the slate clean or erase how he has performed/behaved over the last two years. Mancini and the club seem more focussed on attitude and mentality this year and that as much as anything else will determine players fate.

And who said no one can discuss a City performance or City players? Its not the discussions I have a problem with. Its the dumb conclusions people make based on watching a friendly at 2 in the morning with zero idea of where the players are in the fitness cycle or how committed they were asked to be (and judging from the way Hart pulled out of his challenge for the 2nd goal not very) or how hard they were asked to exert themselves in view of the heat and humidity. This is not to exempt them from critique. The defence was caught napping for the 2nd goal. Beller should have done better with his second chance. Hart should have been stronger in parrying the first goal. As I only saw the highlights I can't comment much more than that but I assume there was more to be critical about which is fine. As long as we don't start making sweeping statements and generalisations based on one lousy 90 minutes of friendly action. Its like Taggart watching Rooney in the WC and muttering to the missus "..the lad is gash. I'll sell him for 2 bob in the summer and get someone else in". You have to imagine the empty whisky bottles and the faded armchair but you get the drift.

As for the club wanting a better result in the game well I am sure they did but I see no point in screwing up the planned pre season fitness routine or risking the bigger names getting injured in an attempt to win a meaningless game in order to win a few PR brownie points. Bigger picture is the first and foremost the Premier League.