We need a new Keeper

[dazby]

Strikers win points, keepers save points. Except for the keeper that scored. He won points. Oh and keepers that get assists. They win points too.

PBL is correct. It's just a matter of semantics.

[Pretty Boy Lee]

Rubbish. If we are wining 1-0 and Hart makes a great save in the last minute say like at Villa the year we won the league then we don't win the league as we would have only got 1 point not 3 so you are wrong.

You made my argument in your 1st sentence but were too silly to even see it.

[Pretty Boy Lee]

Also, tell me hart didn't win us a point at spurs away in the cup winning season! Tell rags that shmeichel never won them points. Of course keepers win points.

Perfect example. We didn't get points plural at the lane. Why is that again?

[Nigels Tackle]

Also, tell me hart didn't win us a point at spurs away in the cup winning season! Tell rags that shmeichel never won them points. Of course keepers win points.

Perfect example. We didn't get points plural at the lane. Why is that again?

maybe we should drop joe and play an extra outfield player?

[Pretty Boy Lee]

maybe we should drop joe and play an extra outfield player?

Maybe you should get rid of savings accounts and put it all on black?

[Bridge'srightfoot]

Also, tell me hart didn't win us a point at spurs away in the cup winning season! Tell rags that shmeichel never won them points. Of course keepers win points.

Perfect example. We didn't get points plural at the lane. Why is that again?

I'm not quite sure what point you are trying to make here. Joe Hart won us a point by making several outstanding saves in that game.
It seems you are being a tad pedantic. A keeper can't score the winning goal (normally) but he's part of the team and part of winning is ensuring you outscore your opponents and a keeper is key in that. So can defenders not win points either? Does Fernandinho not win us points because he doesn't score often? Can he only be said to have won us points against Arsenal?

Saying a keeper can't win you points because it relies on the strikers scoring is like saying strikers can't win you points because it relies on the defence keeping out the other team.

What's your overall point though? That keepers can't win us points so it doesn't matter who we have in net?

[Pretty Boy Lee]

I'm not quite sure what point you are trying to make here. Joe Hart won us a point by making several outstanding saves in that game. It seems you are being a tad pedantic. A keeper can't score the winning goal (normally) but he's part of the team and part of winning is ensuring you outscore your opponents and a keeper is key in that. So can defenders not win points either? Does Fernandinho not win us points because he doesn't score often? Can he only be said to have won us points against Arsenal? Saying a keeper can't win you points because it relies on the strikers scoring is like saying strikers can't win you points because it relies on the defence keeping out the other team. What's your overall point though? That keepers can't win us points so it doesn't matter who we have in net?

Not at all, keeper can preserve what you have, I just don't like seeing arguments about te keeper based on nonsense. I love hart and think he's saved us loads of times. I merely pointed out an obvious fact and a bunch of people argued a load of shite that made no sense. I've no hardcore agendA, just got a bunch of crap thrown my way.

[Sister of fu]

I'm not quite sure what point you are trying to make here. Joe Hart won us a point by making several outstanding saves in that game. It seems you are being a tad pedantic. A keeper can't score the winning goal (normally) but he's part of the team and part of winning is ensuring you outscore your opponents and a keeper is key in that. So can defenders not win points either? Does Fernandinho not win us points because he doesn't score often? Can he only be said to have won us points against Arsenal? Saying a keeper can't win you points because it relies on the strikers scoring is like saying strikers can't win you points because it relies on the defence keeping out the other team. What's your overall point though? That keepers can't win us points so it doesn't matter who we have in net?

Not at all, keeper can preserve what you have, I just don't like seeing arguments about te keeper based on nonsense. I love hart and think he's saved us loads of times. I merely pointed out an obvious fact and a bunch of people argued a load of shite that made no sense. I've no hardcore agendA, just got a bunch of crap thrown my way.

No one has argued a load of shite though, we have made valied points. Without Hart we would not have won the league which is a fact. I just don't get what you are trying to say and I don't think I'm alone in that.

[Pretty Boy Lee]

No one has argued a load of shite though, we have made valied points. Without Hart we would not have won the league which is a fact. I just don't get what you are trying to say and I don't think I'm alone in that.

I've said it 46 times now so chances are this isn't going to work.

I never said hart didn't contribute either.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

No one has argued a load of shite though, we have made valied points. Without Hart we would not have won the league which is a fact. I just don't get what you are trying to say and I don't think I'm alone in that.

I've said it 46 times now so chances are this isn't going to work.

I never said hart didn't contribute either.

I don't think anyone's throwing crap your way.
I know what you said but I don't understand it still. It's all getting very technical, technically a keeper can't usually score the winning goal although it's not that uncommon for them to get assists but the same could be said of defenders. Doesn't mean they don't win you games.

For example i'd say Tim Krul won Newcastle the points more than any other Newcastle player against Spurs away. Sure it was Remy who scored the goal but had it not been for Krul making several outstanding saves they wouldn't have won.
I'm not getting on your back at all I'm just not quite sure what you're saying.

[Cocacolajojo1]

It all seems a bit semantic to me. I think everyone is saying More ore less the same thing but are using different words.

[john@staustell]

It all seems a bit semantic to me. I think everyone is saying More ore less the same thing but are using different words.

semantics [sɪˈmæntɪks]
n (functioning as singular)
1. (Linguistics) the branch of linguistics that deals with the study of meaning, changes in meaning, and the principles that govern the relationship between sentences or words and their meanings
2. (Philosophy / Logic) the study of the relationships between signs and symbols and what they represent
3. (Philosophy / Logic) Logic
a. the study of interpretations of a formal theory
b. the study of the relationship between the structure of a theory and its subject matter
c. (of a formal theory) the principles that determine the truth or falsehood of sentences within the theory, and the references of its terms
semanticist

[Cocacolajojo1]

[url="http://www.easyfreesmileys.com/skype-emoticons.html"]"http://www.easyfreesmileys.com/skype-emoticons.html"[/url]

semantics [sɪˈmæntɪks]
n (functioning as singular)
1. (Linguistics) the branch of linguistics that deals with the study of meaning, changes in meaning, and the principles that govern the relationship between sentences or words and their meanings
2. (Philosophy / Logic) the study of the relationships between signs and symbols and what they represent
3. (Philosophy / Logic) Logic
a. the study of interpretations of a formal theory
b. the study of the relationship between the structure of a theory and its subject matter
c. (of a formal theory) the principles that determine the truth or falsehood of sentences within the theory, and the references of its terms
semanticist

I'm gonna go with one and two thank you. What did I win?

[Foreverinbluedreams]

Saved us the points? Won us the points? I dunno, but well played Joe.

[Florida Blue]

I think, and I am going to think I get what PBL is saying....

Pantilimon's role when he played all those games was to not make mistakes. When looking at results, like him or not, he did not make those howlers and he did not hurt us in the least bit. He wasn't, and should never be, asked to win us games when he plays, just don't make the mistakes that will cost us points.

Hart on the other hand is the one who is counted on to make that clutch save late in a match, or make the hard saves when the team is not scoring to win us games. That is where a keeper can win or save you points. That was the Joe Hart of 2011-12, that was not the Joe Hart we had last year or earlier this season. I think it is the Joe Hart we are seeing the last couple of matches.

City could easily finish top four with Costel Pantilimon as our #1 keeper, I do not believe we could win the league without Joe Hart being our number 1. I agree we may have needed a better backup earlier this year, but I now believe Joe is righting himself and Costel is a solid enough deputy, who has gained invaluable experience at the top level in England.

[Hutch's Shoulder]

We need new keeper ..... Maybe we have one in a rejuvenated Hart? (still need to work on the distribution tho Joe ;-) )

[Beefymcfc]

The reason I stayed out of this debate is largely down to what we've seen today. I think we've already got 2 great keepers and one that is still growing in the role. At 26 he's still not the finished article and with him being English, that just makes it all the better for me.

[Slim]

I think, and I am going to think I get what PBL is saying....

You'd be the first.

[Blue Since 76]

There won't be any stats on this, but how far were the successful passes? I noticed in Pant's first game that the centre halves went either side of the penalty area, allowing him to just roll the ball out. Since then teams have pushed up, so there was little chance to do it yesterday, meaning he was hitting it long, which affects the chance of being successful.

Mignolet was able to pass the ball out most times, as we only had Negredo trying to close their back 4 down. If your having to lump a high ball into the centre circle, Yaya would have trouble finding a City player more than 50% of the time. It's certainly something Hart needs to improve on, but we have to give him a chance to find a City player

Not sure what Hart's stats are for today, but I'd guess pretty high since he was able to roll the ball out most of the time and that should have raised his season to date average.

He still needs to improve on getting the ball forward more quickly from corners etc, but the rest of the players need to give him an option to throw/kick the ball to.

[Herb]

We need new keeper ..... Maybe we have one in a rejuvenated Hart? (still need to work on the distribution tho Joe ;-) )

I'm sort of with you there HS, I had Joe down as man of the match today because he made some great stops but it was his kind of game as there were few corners for him to deal with and palace fell back into defence rather than pushing up in the main whenever Joe had the ball, so distribution was easily made to the back line if wanted.
A confident display showing the best of his talents and, IMHO, he deserved the plaudits.