Tom Cleverley

[david yearsley]

When he plays for England, he's an England player, not a United one. Some people need to get over themselves.

When they play as consistently well for England as they do for rags I will mate

[Bridge'srightfoot]

If he played so well last season why didn't he get in th squad? It's an insult to clubs like Blackburn and Wigan that these players only get capped when they move/go back to United

What does last season matter? It is current form. Look it is not like there are a lot of exciting other options, and based on recent performance, give him a shot, can't be any worse off.

If he was as good last season in a shite Wigan squad surely that warrants a call up more than playing well in a top team like united?

What point are you making? Perhaps his performances last year along with his great start this year have warranted a call up. Have you actually watched him play this season? Or do you think he's no good because of who he plays for.

[Beefymcfc]

How many games did he play last season and how many of them were sub/subbed appearances?

I just don't think Taggart has a choice but to play him at the moment. He's looking decent in a very attack minded team at the moment, let's wait-out and see what happens when they get some real opposition. I'm all in favour of giving praise where praise is due, regardless of shirt colour, but he hasn't proved anything yet, athough the Rag's do rate him highly.

[moomey]

Evidence so far this season is gleaned against two powder puff midfields (Spurs and Arse) and us at the CS where we couldnt be bothered. U*ited always look good when their two CM's are given space to look up and ping it quickly to the flanks where they then overload. They are so succesful because almost all teams cede this space and drop deep thus creating a "fait accompli". In this scenario Cleverley looks good - but Anderson has also looked good and he is undeniably s*te so proving this isn't a fair representation. I thought that against WBA the rags and Cleverley looked v ordinary as they were well matched most of the match.

Look at the two games at Wembley (us and Barca) where they were bullied and pressed hard by superior midfileds - they then look the ordinary group they are and Cleverley will not make a diffence against a high pressing side.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

Evidence so far this season is glea) and us at the CS where we couldnt be bothered. U*ited always look good when their two CM's are given space to look up and ping it quickly to the flanks where they then overload. They are so succesful because almost all teams cede this space and drop deep thus creating a "fait accompli". In this scenario Cleverley looks good - but Anderson has also lookedned against two powder puff midfields (Spurs and Arse good and he is undeniably s*te so proving this isn't a fair representation. I thought that against WBA the rags and Cleverley looked v ordinary as they were well matched most of the match.

Look at the two games at Wembley (us and Barca) where they were bullied and pressed hard by superior midfileds - they then look the ordinary group they are and Cleverley will not make a diffence against a high pressing side.

Funny how Nasri plays well against Spurs and he's world class, Cleverley does the same and it's because they have a 'powderpuff' midfield.

[moomey]

I never said that Nasri is WC - this thread is about Cleverley I thought?

If you ask me to comment I'd say Nasri is far more proven premiership class than Cleverley. United huffed and puffed for an hour against spurs wheras we were at em from the start.

[ant london]

No disrespect Bridgesrightfoot as football is all about opinions and you may turn out to be pseudo-Nostradamus and me actual-Ignoramus but this thread is the latest of a series of your recent posts which makes me suspect that you really do know almost nothing about football. Incredible stuff

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I never said that Nasri is WC - this thread is about Cleverley I thought?

If you ask me to comment I'd say Nasri is far more proven premiership class than Cleverley. United huffed and puffed for an hour against spurs wheras we were at em from the start.

I'm not saying Cleverley is anywhere near as good as Nasri. It's just the hypocracy of some fans. He's a very decent prospect, that's all there is to it really.

[Beefymcfc]

I never said that Nasri is WC - this thread is about Cleverley I thought?

If you ask me to comment I'd say Nasri is far more proven premiership class than Cleverley. United huffed and puffed for an hour against spurs wheras we were at em from the start.

I'm not saying Cleverley is anywhere near as good as Nasri. It's just the hypocracy of some fans. He's a very decent prospect, that's all there is to it really.

Nasri is massively better than Cleverley and even snubbed them to come to us, which is always a bonus. Nasri knew where the future lies.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I never said that Nasri is WC - this thread is about Cleverley I thought?

If you ask me to comment I'd say Nasri is far more proven premiership class than Cleverley. United huffed and puffed for an hour against spurs wheras we were at em from the start.

I'm not saying Cleverley is anywhere near as good as Nasri. It's just the hypocracy of some fans. He's a very decent prospect, that's all there is to it really.

Nasri is massively better than Cleverley and even snubbed them to come to us, which is always a bonus. Nasri knew where the future lies.

My point wasn't about Nasri. It's about how when we beat Spurs, everyone goes on about how world class we were ( which we were) but when United do, it's because they have a 'powder puff' midfield.

[ant london]

when we beat Spurs, everyone goes on about how world class we were ( which we were) but when United do, it's because they have a 'powder puff' midfield.

what about when one of Tottenham's own players says something similar then???

Younes Kaboul has made Manchester City his favourites for the Premier League title ahead of holders Manchester United.

The Tottenham defender has felt the wrath of both sides, who lead the table with maximum points after three games, with United currently edging top spot on goal difference.

The Manchester rivals have set the tone with emphatic opening victories, most notably United's ruthless 8-2 demolition of Arsenal,while City tore Spurs apart at White Hart Lane.

"City can be a great success. I could even imagine them achieving the same run as Arsenal, when the Gunners were champions and remained undefeated all season long."

United cruised to a 3-0 home win over Harry Redknapp's men, but City triumphed 5-1 in North London, and Kaboul believes it will be the blue half who are celebrating come May 2012.

"We played two big teams for our first two matches in the Premier League," Kaboul told France Football.

"It was very difficult, above all the last match against City. I even found City more impressive than Manchester United. I felt more difficulties against them at home than I did at Old Trafford.

"City can be a great success. I could even imagine them achieving the same run as Arsenal, when the Gunners were champions and remained undefeated all season long.

"Indeed, I could bet some money on that team for the title."

[Bridge'srightfoot]

when we beat Spurs, everyone goes on about how world class we were ( which we were) but when United do, it's because they have a 'powder puff' midfield.

what about when one of Tottenham's own players says something similar then???

Younes Kaboul has made Manchester City his favourites for the Premier League title ahead of holders Manchester United.

The Tottenham defender has felt the wrath of both sides, who lead the table with maximum points after three games, with United currently edging top spot on goal difference.

The Manchester rivals have set the tone with emphatic opening victories, most notably United's ruthless 8-2 demolition of Arsenal,while City tore Spurs apart at White Hart Lane.

"City can be a great success. I could even imagine them achieving the same run as Arsenal, when the Gunners were champions and remained undefeated all season long."

United cruised to a 3-0 home win over Harry Redknapp's men, but City triumphed 5-1 in North London, and Kaboul believes it will be the blue half who are celebrating come May 2012.

"We played two big teams for our first two matches in the Premier League," Kaboul told France Football.

"It was very difficult, above all the last match against City. I even found City more impressive than Manchester United. I felt more difficulties against them at home than I did at Old Trafford.

"City can be a great success. I could even imagine them achieving the same run as Arsenal, when the Gunners were champions and remained undefeated all season long.

"Indeed, I could bet some money on that team for the title."

Again, it wasn't really the point i'm making. It feels like a lot of people in this thread were writing the lad off simply because he's a United player. Anyone who's seen him play a few times can recognize this lad has quality.

[Beefymcfc]

I never said that Nasri is WC - this thread is about Cleverley I thought?

If you ask me to comment I'd say Nasri is far more proven premiership class than Cleverley. United huffed and puffed for an hour against spurs wheras we were at em from the start.

I'm not saying Cleverley is anywhere near as good as Nasri. It's just the hypocracy of some fans. He's a very decent prospect, that's all there is to it really.

Nasri is massively better than Cleverley and even snubbed them to come to us, which is always a bonus. Nasri knew where the future lies.

My point wasn't about Nasri. It's about how when we beat Spurs, everyone goes on about how world class we were ( which we were) but when United do, it's because they have a 'powder puff' midfield.

I honestly feel that Droylsden would've given the Rags a better game, the whole Arsenal team looked disjointed and uninterested. Let's look at it another way, Taggart beat Spurs 3-0 at home where it was very even until the last 20 (I'd say that Spurs were the better team until then apart from their shooting boots) whereas we beat them 5-1 away from home and got serious praise from their own players. This is the only way people can make comparisons so far so it is understandable how people can rate one against the other.

[ant london]

I'm not writing him off.....I think he's talented. I also don't think most on here are disputing that. What they are questioning is the stupidly premature deification (...maybe one for you to look up) of the lad, notably in advance of some proven established players from other clubs.

And what people I think are taking issue with is you attempting to support said media bollocks with the defense that "you're all wearing blue tinted specs and can't see he's a "genius" because he's a red".

And that my friend (allied to your other missives re Hargreaves and Dzeko) is what makes you sound like a spastic

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I'm not writing him off.....I think he's talented. I also don't think most on here are disputing that. What they are questioning is the stupidly premature deification (...maybe one for you to look up) of the lad, notably in advance of some proven established players from other clubs.

And what people I think are taking issue with is you attempting to support said media bollocks with the defense that "you're all wearing blue tinted specs and can't see he's a "genius" because he's a red".

And that my friend (allied to your other missives re Hargreaves and Dzeko) is what makes you sound like a spastic

Again, can you not post without trying to sound all clever and patronizing? Do you get your kicks from it or something?

Which 'proven' players should have been selected ahead of him? Go on then.

[Wooders]

I cannot stand the way that playing for the rags means you get an instant england cap - granted - a lot of them deserve one, but cleverly?
and smalling ahead of micah is a fucking joke

I also hate this fornight of internationals just when the prem gets started

argghh

international football.
SHITE

[simon12]

What's it all about and when will he be rumbled for being the obvioulsy average player that he is?

From Wigan to England via a Red shirt - you coudn't make it up. Wait until the derby and Dejong does him...

i agree 100%.

he will get found out, 2 months ago he was in and out of 21s team during championships and all of a sudden hes in senior squad?? [highlight]Also smalling ahead of richards at right back[/highlight]??hes only played about 10 games there in his career its a joke.

Cleverly did nothing at wigan last season barely got a game, was always been taken off and now hes a world beater, it wont last...

That is a complete disgrace. I don't know what Richards has done to piss Capello off but there's no way on earth Smalling is a better right back than him, nor is he in better form. Complete joke.

Sorry but I`m all for it. He can`t get injured if he`s not playing...Top shout Fabio.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I cannot stand the way that playing for the rags means you get an instant england cap - granted - a lot of them deserve one, but cleverly?
and smalling ahead of micah is a fucking joke

I also hate this fornight of internationals just when the prem gets started

argghh

international football.
SHITE

Again, he didn't even play, he simply got called up because he played well last season and so far this season. I'm all for pushing through younger players into the England fold. Who should have been called up ahead of him?

[Tokyo Blue]

Again, he didn't even play, he simply got called up because he played well last season and so far this season.

So why was he not called up last season if he played so well? To that I can only answer either a) he didn't play that well, or b) it was Wigan and now he has only been called up cos he's got a red shirt on.

cleverley is clearly not "shit" but is he really England material?

I'm all for pushing through younger players into the England fold. Who should have been called up ahead of him?

Mark Davies at Bolton. I doubt Capello knows who Bolton are, let alone who plays for them, but you can bet your arse that Davies'll get a call up if united sign him in the January window. Perhaps he picked the wrong Davies last season, eh.

On a tangent, I have to say that I find it slightly uncomfortable that a drunken Scotsman has got so much influence on who is picked for the England team.

[moomey]

OK folks - lot's of interesting opinions in response to my initial post (usual meandering off topic and personal insults lol!)

My final word on Cleverley is this:-

- Good prospect - yes
- Proven premiership top performer - no
- England's future - not yet proven
- Media overhype on very little evidence - indisputable!

As I stated before I'd be keen to see how he deals with much less time and space when a high pressing, hard tackling midfield sits on him (e.g. us at the Semi)