Rangers Have Been Thrown Out Of The SPL

[Dameerto]

I dont get all this talk of them wanting to be In the English Leagues .Unless Ive missed something I havent heard any clubs say they want In ? , They dont even want to be part of GB Olympics Fuck Em ...

Rangers were making noises a season or two ago, sounding out opinion about them joining the English leagues (they obviously knew this was coming and wanted some way out).

[Dunnylad]

If they are going to end up in Div 3 or the Highland League, they'd be better off opting into the English pyramid, long term it would be a better option financially, once they worked their way through Evostick & conference north etc

[halnone]

If they are going to end up in Div 3 or the Highland League, they'd be better off opting into the English pyramid, long term it would be a better option financially, once they worked their way through Evostick & conference north etc

I don't think they should be in the English pyramid, but if they were, it would be great if instead of moving up, they got relegated.

[ross.mcfc]

Thing Ross is the only proper Rangers fan on here

You will be hearing from my lawyers in the morning.

A very complex saga. I can quite understand why there is so much misinformation out there as no one outside Scotland really cares but I live in Glasgow and there is enough twists and turns in this saga to consume a 24 hour news station up here. Sadly from what I have read in the Scottish/British media to which most people will have read the info on is so out of touch with the current events. This story for me has shown just how out of the loop the main stream media are.

Take the title of this thread for example. Rangers were not thrown out of the SPL. They were liquidated and cease to exist. The Sevco company which bought the assests of the old club and were going to apply as a new club were rejected.

It has also highlighted the murky and some what disgraceful behaviour of the people who run Scottish Football from the chairmen of SPL clubs to the governing bodies who run Scottish Football. The SPL chairmen who voted 10/1 in favor of this decision and spouted on and on about 'sporting integrity' would have voted the Sevco back into the leauge 12/0 if it had been left to them.

The fans of the other clubs quite rightly did not buy seasons tickets of their clubs mainly because if you have been watching a league for 20 years which has shown to be corrupt then why even bother if the guilty party are allowed to walk straight back in. The loss of seasons ticket revenue over several years more than counter acts the two away visits (and for half of the league one visit) that Rangers fans make.

Now these cowards who were all for sporting intregrity but not to much it seems are threatening to kill the smaller teams in the system if they do not allow Sevco into Div 1, by threatening to offer a SPL 2 which they would allow Sevco in and invite the bigger SFL clubs into their stable. Cutting off any chance sort of promotion to these side. Quite a few sides in the SPL of late have played in the lower leagues in recent years so basically killing off the whole reason that you may suppourt a smaller team.

The scaremongering from the SPL/SFA and the main media about Rangers starting in Div 3 is quite embaressing. Clubs will go bust, the game will die ect ect. First of all I have no idea I was living through a golden period of Scottish football. Moreover,

No club went bust when Sky first left Scottish football.
No club went bust when Sentanta went to the wall.
No club went bust when they were relegated from the SPL and were deprived of Rangers tv/fan revenue.

If Rangers are sent into Div 3, SPL teams will just have to cut their cloth accordingly. If a club goes bust because they dont have Rangers then I suggest that they deserve it. Scottish football has been dying on it's arse for a very long time. Drastic change is required and I hope this is the catalyst. I genuinely believe some good can come out of this situation. Already without Rangers, Celtic have lost their joint veto on any new league propasals. Hopefully a more democratic SPL will arise which allows other clubs to flourish. For example, many of the clubs have long demanded a SPL2 which would allow them not to fear relegation and concentrate on youth development. This was voted down by the Old Firm so it did not happen. Almost every Scottish football fans wants a biggger league and put a stop to the mundane playing the same teams 4 times a year but that would have meants Celtic and Rangers pot being reduced.

If Uniteds new float doesnt work and they go into a financial spiral which leads to administration then liquidation how would you feel if the new company was just parachuated into the Championship because of the money they could offer the league.

A business that ignores the wish of it's customers will soon not have a business. Sevco not going to the 3rd division will do a lot more damage to the game than parachuting a new club into the higher levels of the system.

Every non fan of the new Sevco thinks they should have to start at the bottom like every other club would. The vast majority of Rangers fans want them to start in Div3 as it gives them a fresh start free of the ills of the past. There is also a very good argument that it would be very hard for the new club to get out of Div 1 on it's first attempt. League starts in 4 weeks and they have six players, no tv revenue, fans not trusting the new owner. I dont doubt if Rangers finished 3rd in Div 1 that the SPL would reconstruct the league overnight to 16 teams.

The game up here has seen to be an omnishamble which is highly corrupt. It is highly upsetting as you wont find another country which cares so much for the game despite being utterly terrible at it.

One last point that you will not read about anywhere in the media. The SFL due to this will 1 spot open in the league. This normally means clubs from the Junior or Highland league systems some of whom have attendances which are higher than teams in Div1 can apply to join the SFL. Many never bother as they make more money playing in a regional league aganist local rivals than playing in Div3. However both Linlithgow Rose and Spartans were promised they would be allowed to fight it out for the next open slot. It is in the rule books that if you want to apply for the SFL you must have three years of financial records as an operating as a football club. Sevco do not have this. If the SFL league which starts in 4 weeks wave Sevco through they will be subjected to a legal battle from both of these clubs.

[feedthegreek]

according to a guy on talkshite this morning, rangers fans have only bought 250 season tickets so far, probably cos they dont know what division their gonna be in. and only have 6 players on their books of which some of those will leave, not a good situation at all.

[ross.mcfc]

If they are going to end up in Div 3 or the Highland League, they'd be better off opting into the English pyramid, long term it would be a better option financially, once they worked their way through Evostick & conference north etc

Where would that end. Ajax and Copenhagen moving to Germany? Porto and Sporting to Spain? It would lead to the death of all of these smaller countries footballing leagues.

[ross.mcfc]

The makers of GoalRef and Hawk-Eye goal-line technology have told Rangers they can't use the system next season.

Apparently it doesn't work with goal posts made from jumpers.

The better punchline I've heard is

They cant use it in Scotland as the SFA keep moving the goal posts.

[ross.mcfc]

according to a guy on talkshite this morning, rangers fans have only bought 250 season tickets so far, probably cos they dont know what division their gonna be in. and only have 6 players on their books of which some of those will leave, not a good situation at all.

This is another good point. The SPL/SFA are blackmailing the SFL to allow them into the Div1.

They are placing a hell of alot of faith in this current Sevcos owner coming through for them. Rangers fans do not trust this man and quite rightly too. How on earth will he pay the wages without ticket income, no tv deal and not even a member as yet of the SFA. They do own Ibrox and the new training complex which cost one million a month to keep running.

I predict that this Sevco will go to the wall also and at some point in the near future there will be no form of Rangers playing in any league. A fan owned Rangers will rise from the ashes and only then will they move forward.

[ross.mcfc]

Well I think they should just fuckign delete the whole fuckign Sweaty league altogether....its a bag of wank and noone outside of Scotland gives 2 fucks.

That is my pennies worth.

Whilst I will never defend the overall standard of the football here. I can give you one reason why you should care.

This is a test case. You dont think our rivals across the road who are also eyeballed up to debt arent looking at this and thinking twice about their actions of late. Not one person could claim there finances are sound. What has happened in Scotland is not unusual in terms of business going on. Banks trying to live the dream with no fear of getting caught knowing fine well they wont get punished because they deem themselves to important to punish. It's capitalism gone bad. People are getting rather tired of it and eventually these people like Murray, Fred the Shred and the Glazers will have to answer for their crimes.

[carolina-blue]

Great posts Ross , Really interesting stuff ,Thanx

[twosips]

If they are going to end up in Div 3 or the Highland League, they'd be better off opting into the English pyramid, long term it would be a better option financially, once they worked their way through Evostick & conference north etc

Where would that end. Ajax and Copenhagen moving to Germany? Porto and Sporting to Spain? It would lead to the death of all of these smaller countries footballing leagues.

I love over the top posts like that. Wobble your head. The dutch and portugese leagues are significantly stronger than the Scottish ones. Two huge countries with a massive european and world pedigree, with profitable domestic games. Why would they ever be want to do the same as the Scottish league, which is pretty piss poor and irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

[ross.mcfc]

I love over the top posts like that. Wobble your head. The dutch and portugese leagues are significantly stronger than the Scottish ones. Two huge countries with a massive european and world pedigree, with profitable domestic games. Why would they ever be want to do the same as the Scottish league, which is pretty piss poor and irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

I am not comparing the standard of football.

Apart from the odd team every twenty years, neither Holland and Portugal make any impact in the CL and are largely proving grounds for players to move onto La Liga or the Premiership. These clubs cannot compete financially regardless of their history or global brand. It is worth noting that Wigan recieved more money from Sky for merely making up the numbers in the Premiership than the entire Scottish league did last year. If Ajax were given a chance to jump ship to the Bundesliga they would do it in a heart beat as realistically it is the only way they would be able to compete at the same level as the top sides.

Where do you want to draw the line, Lille and PSG are closer to London than the clubs in the North East.

I love the Premiership and for entertainment it cannot be rivalled but I love football more and strong domestic leagues are the life blood of football. You start inviting other clubs into your league then you start closing promotion and relegation and then it will just become a closed shop for only the rich.

[Socrates]

Gretna played in the English pyramid for years so there is direct precedent. It has no impact on other nations as they are nations. There are no international boundaries involved here.

[Dunnylad]

Where would that end. Ajax and Copenhagen moving to Germany? Porto and Sporting to Spain? It would lead to the death of all of these smaller countries footballing leagues.

Do you think they actually care about that? If a European League is created, do you think anyone will care to the teams & leagues left behind? No, because football at the higher level is driven by money & at the moment the English Premier League is a very attractive prospect.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

http://www.teamtalk.com/news/2483/78973 ... d-Division

So they start in third division.

You know what, and some people are going to hate me for saying this, this could be the best thing ever to happen for Scottish football. Longmuir was saying elsewhere that it would be extremely detrimental for Scottish football if Rangers were voted to start in third division. Well wake the fuck up and smell the coffee.... there is now Glasgow Rangers anymore. There is some silly thing Rangers Newco but that's different thing. Also, Old Firm clubs haven't been living within means trying to chase ghosts (=European success). Well the roots for any financially succesfull club will always be in domestic league and European games should be treated as extra.

Also I feel this might actually make Scottish league competitive in long term. Sure Celtic will walk the title but they will have to cut their budget because of no Old Firm games and actually start paying attention to rest of the league. Elsewhere there will be people who have been Rangers fans whpo actually start paying attention to their local team.

Financially the Old Firm game and interest on it has created vacuum on top of the league that simply nwasn't healthy anymore. If Scottish football now look to the future trying to rebuild financially stable and competitive league rather than harping on about missing Old Firm games they might actually turn into interesting league.

[Beefymcfc]

I've been listening to this with interest, more to how the SFL/SPL deal with it and I have to say that they are a complete shambles. If a club goes bust then there is only one place they can go, to the bottom, but in this case they've even got that wrong. Has been said, to join the league a club has to have 3 years figures yet this looks like it's been waived to serve a somewhat spurious purpose. Like Ross says, what about the clubs who have those 3 years accounts and want to join the league?

One thing they all go on about is when the Newco go to the away games and how clubs who usually get 300 and odd fans cope. Well, if the Newco get fans attending (this is not a given at present) the away games then I think they'll do just fine. Imagine that club now getting 2300 fans for that one game and imagine the revenue it will produce for the club and their wider community, it will be a massive boost.

The SFL have done exactly what the SPL tried to do, bend the rules to serve their own needs. Possibly having a new Rangers and their support visiting all of their grounds whilst moving back to the top is a win for all concerned. Obviously a decision had to be made but again they chose one of money rather than integrity. Funny 'Old' game really.

[Blue Since 76]

As Frankie Boyle said yesterday, every other Saturday, a small town in Scotland is going to discover what is was like when Vikjngs arrived.

What's more interesting in this is what happens to HMRC's case as they reckon a lot of English clubs were doing the same thing and were told to stop by the tax man. If HMRC is proved correct that this is illegal, there will be a lot of clubs facing a huge hike in wage costs, plus a big tax bill, plus fines. Heard something recently that Liverpool could be in for about £300m. And the tax office don't accept payback at a pound a week...

[ant london]

As Frankie Boyle said yesterday, every other Saturday, a small town in Scotland is going to discover what is was like when Vikjngs arrived.

What's more interesting in this is what happens to HMRC's case as they reckon a lot of English clubs were doing the same thing and were told to stop by the tax man. If HMRC is proved correct that this is illegal, there will be a lot of clubs facing a huge hike in wage costs, plus a big tax bill, plus fines. Heard something recently that Liverpool could be in for about £300m. And the tax office don't accept payback at a pound a week...

That is, from everything I've heard via work-related sources, absolutely correct. Before Fenway Sports bought Liverpool that was one of the big potential gremlins re LFC which put off some potential investors

[ross.mcfc]

As Frankie Boyle said yesterday, every other Saturday, a small town in Scotland is going to discover what is was like when Vikjngs arrived.

What's more interesting in this is what happens to HMRC's case as they reckon a lot of English clubs were doing the same thing and were told to stop by the tax man. If HMRC is proved correct that this is illegal, there will be a lot of clubs facing a huge hike in wage costs, plus a big tax bill, plus fines. Heard something recently that Liverpool could be in for about £300m. And the tax office don't accept payback at a pound a week...

Frankie Boyles Twitter feed yesterday was very funny.

I wasnt aware of that rumour about Liverpool but I have been convinced for a few months now that they will have to go into administration in the next few years. No CL cash and it will continue to be like that for a number of years, an old stadium that doesnt give them the extra revenue required and they have been spending like there no tomorrow for the past five years. The owners are certainly not putting that amount of cash in.

Like I said earlier in this thread, This is a test case. Football clubs have been getting away with ripping each other off by going into admin to easily for a number of years now. How many times have Pompy escaped paying their debts to local companies.

Rangers are being made pay their football debt as the money they got finishing second will be distributed among the SPL clubs still owed money and at least that is a step in the right direction. City settled for the CVA meaning we got 30k for the 300,000 they owed us but thats peanuts to us but could be the difference between one SPL side going bust. We were in a situation where Rangers were able to buy the 3rd best teams best player, play him against Hearts and finish above them in the league, despite never paying for him!

[Michigan Blue]

I've been listening to this with interest, more to how the SFL/SPL deal with it and I have to say that they are a complete shambles. If a club goes bust then there is only one place they can go, to the bottom, but in this case they've even got that wrong. Has been said, to join the league a club has to have 3 years figures yet this looks like it's been waived to serve a somewhat spurious purpose. Like Ross says, what about the clubs who have those 3 years accounts and want to join the league?

The SFL have done exactly what the SPL tried to do, bend the rules to serve their own needs. Possibly having a new Rangers and their support visiting all of their grounds whilst moving back to the top is a win for all concerned. Obviously a decision had to be made but again they chose one of money rather than integrity. Funny 'Old' game really.

I've read that the three years of audited accounts was not an iron-clad SFL requirement. Rumours were also circling that if there was an open application for the 3rd division vacancy, Spartans and potentially others would not submit a bid against Sevco. And I don't believe any of the non-league sides made statements coming out against yesterday's vote.

Of course the other hidden danger is that they buy up the likes of Cowdenbeath and take their league spot the way Airdrie did to Clydebank.

So no the SFL didn't go by the books (one club did actually vote against the allowing them in full stop) but this vote was put to them and on the whole I think you have to give the clubs credit. They were pragmatic but didn't cave to the threats and false promises of the SFA and SPL. They saw the carrot of an expanded SPL and promotion playoffs for what it was, a cynical ploy to gerrymander one club into the top division as soon as possible, just months after Neil Doncaster was calling for a 10-team SPL. And they may still have to soundly reject the temptation of an Newco-included SPL2 if the SFA ignores the wishes of their member clubs and goes into a full-scale mode of naked corruption.

Like others I've been watching this unfold wondering how the PL and FA would handle a Newco if one of England's "flagship" clubs went to the wall and were liquidated. It's unnerving to imagine there are clubs that the league & association considers "commercially necessary". If the day ever came where similar threats, blackmail, grifting, and scaremongering were being peddled by the heads of the game in England because, say, the Rags went bust, I would have to seriously consider why I followed such a league.

One thing is for sure in Scotland, whatever commercial value a post-Rangers SPL might have had has been destroyed by the very men charged with promoting the league, who in recent weeks have not passed up a single opportunity to tell the world how little value their product has without Old Firm games.