Premier league reality

[lets all have a disco]

Im gonna stop going on about being a realist and let it flow then on Sunday see what the general feeling is.

Keep my powder dry and save the posts about being a cheese munching surrender monkey.

epic climbdown. The quitter, unquits? fuck me...come on now!

Was it over in Wales or not?

cheers

I cant be arsed fucking going on about it anymore all you get back is what if we do that,what if we manage to nail Arsenal 7-0,what if Neville has taken a bung to lose,what if there was a fix from the Duncan Edwards deal back in the day,what if we manage to win all 7 and smash the rags,blah fucking blah.
I dont think we will win the league and yes we lost it in Wales but as i sit here i await to be found totally wrong and watch City go on some marvelous run to end of the season that hasnt exactly been showing itself for a few months now.

[Beefymcfc]

Im gonna stop going on about being a realist and let it flow then on Sunday see what the general feeling is.

Keep my powder dry and save the posts about being a cheese munching surrender monkey.

epic climbdown. The quitter, unquits? fuck me...come on now!

Was it over in Wales or not?

cheers

I cant be arsed fucking going on about it anymore all you get back is what if we do that,what if we manage to nail Arsenal 7-0,what if Neville has taken a bung to lose,what if there was a fix from the Duncan Edwards deal back in the day,what if we manage to win all 7 and smash the rags,blah fucking blah.
I dont think we will win the league and yes we lost it in Wales but as i sit here i await to be found totally wrong and watch City go on some marvelous run to end of the season that hasnt exactly been showing itself for a few months now.

Come on pal, keep your pecker up. I'm quite enjoying people falling apart - you, Carl, Doomy, it's quite entertaining ;-)

For me though, even when we were top I hd my misgivings and thought something would go wrong. I said whilst going through Jan, Feb and March that if we were still close then at least we'd give ourselves a fighting chance, which we still have. However, it's a huge mountain to climb and I don't hold out for us catching them up, but I do live in hope.

Whatever happens from here-on in, unless we fall apart, I'd class this season as a very good season and another that we can build on; another progressive one if you may. We've most certainly qualified for the CL season-on-season which is something not many other teams have accomplished. We'll be wiser and stronger going into next season and although there's no certainty's I'm pretty sure we're going to be challenging again. And I'll be there once more, for the start of it anyway. Hopefully I'll be back to see the closing stages, which will be a welcome relief.

[Swales4ever]

I can't believe some of the stuff I am reading, it defies credibility. To think there are City fans who actually think it is reasonable to take on the rest of English football and over the course of a full season, do something that no other team has ever done in the modern age...shows that some City fans have no clue, no inkling and no idea of what ids needed to win the Premier League.

It isn't about just what we do, we are competition and it is also about what our competitors do. How they react to us. It is not about simply taking on and beating the like of the rags, who went through this very same process from 1986 until they first became successful in 1993. If not convinced by that, take a long look at Chelsea, they started buying big as far back as 1995 and they finally got to the top in 2005.

The rag's journey is also an interesting one to compare because like us, Taggart went for a rebuild. But unlike us, he did it with the backing of the club, the media and the fans. It was only at one point after a number of seasons that he was considered for the sack.

Maybe a boring chapter and verse is needed about the rags journey and its failures over years.

Did they have 15 Billion in the bank when they were fuckin around.

How old are you?

Pretty endless funds yes.

Old enough to remember a guys called Knighton & Edwards who fucked them up financially.They did not have access to limitless funds from what I remember.Was a kid at the time though so not 100% sure what went on but they were not mega rich like we are now

They were mega rich enough to constantly break all sorts of transfer records (Pallister, Keane, Hughes etc)

also and more meaningfully, as wisely stressed by Sir John, he (Slur) had unconditioned backing from inside (Club and fans) and outside (media) which, in turn, means full possibility to attract the best available on the market. while ADUG have been forced to get second strings/bad apples at inflated wages until Mancini attracted Yaya and Dave.
a stupid little thing that too many genuine Blues appear not able to get.

[Socrates]

That's the point; our team has been built up from a relegation squad, not a top 6 squad which needed tweaking.

We have effectively turned over four teams in the space of a few years. Sven had to build a top half team from a relegation team. Hughes had to tutn over some of those players to build a top 6 challenging team from a middling team. Bob had to turn over some more players to go from a top 6 team to a top 4 team & then more changes to go from a team which was elated to get top four, to a team which takes top 4 for granted & will be dissapointed if it doesn't get top 1.

It used to be possible to do that back in the 70's when it was a level playing field, but since the Sky money & the Champion's League cash, not only has nobody done anything like that in a short spell but they haven't even had a sniff of doing it.

Spurs, Chelsea, Arsenal were all involved at te top level for years, as were Liverpool.

When Ferguson took over the rags, he had the equivalent spending power we have now & spent it. Then struggled for years.

City have moved mountains, irrespective of the money spent & next season, a couple of new faces will move us up another level.

Nobody can ever guarantee to win a title (most on here would have had Barca nailed on), & that's how it should be: always.

All you can expect each season is a decent challenge & HOPE to come out on top. Anything else would make football boring.

Not often I agree with you Ted but you are 100% spot on.

[Fesan]

I said before the season that improvement on third spot would satisfy me this season. I intend to stick by that. I think oppinions on here would be very different, and most people prett happy with the record breaking season we've had if we had delivered a more even performance. Swap the mauling of tottenham and united for two well played draws and turn the swansea away to a win + everton away to a draw and i think most people would say we've had a great season.

If we finish 2nd we will prob have gone out of CL with 10 points (first time it happens in like 5 years) and come second in the PL with as many points as would have won it any other year.

We have had some bad luck, and prob lost a few points because of that. Then again so have united (vidic out for the season among others). To win the league you need skill, experience AND luck. United have beaten us at the last two, so we would have to be alot more skillfull than them and we almost have.

Only thing that worries me is Mancinis lack of a plan b when teams have obv. Figured out how to handle our offence. Can't blame it on not having wingers, should be able to figure out another way with the team we've got!

[Rag_hater]

I can't believe some of the stuff I am reading, it defies credibility. To think there are City fans who actually think it is reasonable to take on the rest of English football and over the course of a full season, do something that no other team has ever done in the modern age...shows that some City fans have no clue, no inkling and no idea of what ids needed to win the Premier League.

It isn't about just what we do, we are competition and it is also about what our competitors do. How they react to us. It is not about simply taking on and beating the like of the rags, who went through this very same process from 1986 until they first became successful in 1993. If not convinced by that, take a long look at Chelsea, they started buying big as far back as 1995 and they finally got to the top in 2005.

The rag's journey is also an interesting one to compare because like us, Taggart went for a rebuild. But unlike us, he did it with the backing of the club, the media and the fans. It was only at one point after a number of seasons that he was considered for the sack.

Maybe a boring chapter and verse is needed about the rags journey and its failures over years.

Did they have 15 Billion in the bank when they were fuckin around.

How old are you?

Pretty endless funds yes.

Old enough to remember a guys called Knighton & Edwards who fucked them up financially.They did not have access to limitless funds from what I remember.Was a kid at the time though so not 100% sure what went on but they were not mega rich like we are now

Compared to other teams at the time they were EXACTLY like we are now but without restictions, in fact the players they signed (to add to an already mega expensive title challenging squad built by Ron Atkinson etc) would be the modern day equivalent of signing Gerrard, Lampard, Owen, Terry, Ferdinand, Bale, Ashley Cole, and about ten others all at their peak at modern day prices.

They already had Bryan Robson, who would cost £60 million & demand at least £250k pw if he was around today.

They signed EVERY top player available. In those days there weren't many overseas players so the top market players were British.

Bruce & Pallister were the two most sought after CB's in the country, wanted by every top club. Imagine a bidding war between the top 6 for two players today & how much it would then cost to buy them ? Imagine if Chelsea, rags, Liverpool etc had al been in for Lescott, how much he would of cost us, then double it. Then Paul Ince, Neil Webb, Danny Wallace, Mike Phelan ALL of the most highly rated up & coming England midfield. Once again, everyone wanted them but only one club could buy them.

Today, each would cost much more than Milner etc.

McClair from Celtic, Scotland's top striker, Hughes, Bayern Munich's top striker, on loan from Barcelona, Denis Irwin, the most sought after fullback, Paul Parker, another of England's top defenders, Roy Keane, the highest rated young midfielder in the country.
There were no Modric type bargains knocking about from abroad at that time, these were the top players available & Utd signed fucking ALL of them. They already had a top side which had almost won the league & added all those players and more besides.

Ferguson signed that lot & lost five one to our side with a bunch of kids in it.

For me going on about the rags spending power seems to be a bit of sour grapes.Didn't we buy the first million pound player in Francis.When we bought Law we set a record and there was something about Lee aswell.Big Mal splashed the cash aswell.Seems to me the cunts spent it better than us.And to say they broke records to buy who were regarded as the best well thats normal is it not.If we had chance ti buy Messi I dont think it being a record should be a factor.
Who give them this money to buy these players if they borrowed it well it the people who loaned it them who are the fuckers.

[Mingchester Mingy]

Listening to Keys and Gray yesterday, Keys was quickly reading through the papers before a break and mentioned the piece on Mancini possibly being sacked. Gray, who was totally surprised and with a sneering laug said 'You what, you've got to be joking ain't ya' before cutting to a break. Afterwards he was taken aback by how it had been reported and how City fans were of the opinion that Mancini should go.

Just thought I'd share.

The media gets everyone worked up. Its why I dont pay it any mind. Mancini wont be sacked this year. Im not the biggest Bob fan in the world, but he will get a couple of years to prove his worth I think.

[blues2win]

You can't just look at finishing second and say it's not too bad. A lot depends on how we finish the season. Last season we finished strongly winning the FA Cup semi final against the rags (and the final of course) and cruising ultimately to a very creditable third place. It augured well for the start of the next season. Sure enough we started like a house on fire. I don't think any of us expected the team to continue like that and rack up 100 points or more. Still with the best will in the world our form in 2012 has been very disaapointing. A lot of mediocre performances and too many outright bad ones. We've been knocked out of 3 cups and we've blown a 5 point lead in the title race.

If our challenge for the title continues to fall feebly away it does not suggest we're poised to race out of the blocks next season. On the contrary there are questions marks about the squad and Mancini's tactics all over the place; Tevez on his bike, Dzeko a big disappointment, Mario hasn't grown up, Johnson's inconsistent, No pace or width or indeed sign of a plan B when things go wrong, Can we play without Silva on form, De Jong one dimensional, Kolarov too slow, Savic a mistake etc. Of course there are positives too; Aguero looks a really good player,Vinnie and Lescott have been pretty solid and Micah's greatly improved, Joe's looking really good etc. It's not all bad by a long chalk.


For Mancini a lot rests on the last few games. If we pull ourselves together and put up a fight for the title he can probably survive coming second ( as well as disappointing ADUG with our Champion's League debut) but if we continue as we have been recently and the rags win comfortably then ADUG will surely try to prise Mourinho from Real Madrid. In my view you can hardly blame them.

[brite blu sky]

John,
It takes most teams years to build as you have to slowly improve your players. However, we've been able to buy pretty much anyone. Yes there a few who still wouldn't come but they wouldn't come to our rivals either.

People keep saying is that all we need to do in summer is replace about 10 of the squad with world class players but it's not like that. No other team has 25 internationals yet because we only have 24 it's used as an excuse for failure.

Would you swap our current 25 for any other 25 in the league? Unless you'd swap for the rags then either we've under achieved or they've over achieved. If the squads are roughly equal, then a handful of points over the course of a season would be a reasonable margin. However, I think our squad is much better than the rags therefore to finish behind them will be a failure on the club's part. You can lay that blame wherever you want, but it's still failure.

There's also a constant message that even if we don't win it this year we will next year and we'll go on to rule the premier league for the foreseeable. Seem to remember the same thing being said last May and Arsenal have been saying it for almost a decade. Maybe it'll happen next year but it's just as likely it won't.

One message coming out of the media at the start of the season was buying a load of good players doesn't get you a team. Well although it was sour grapes from the media about the money City have... there is still truth in it. When you say a failure due to better players you are ignoring the fact that a team has to emerge from those players. How does that happen, how long does it take, what has to happen for a team to be forged. How is it added to without upsetting the balance.
Interesting that you cite the special Me Me Me one to illustrate your point but by doing so also illustrate that it takes time and not just acquiring the players.

It is sad to see this team struggling after such a blistering start, but it was almost inevitable as they get to grips with who they are. Now they need to end the season on form and that's about it, someone mentioned it in this thread and it is very important. Anything else is a bonus, but it isn't over till it is.

[carl_feedthegoat]

You can't just look at finishing second and say it's not too bad. A lot depends on how we finish the season. Last season we finished strongly winning the FA Cup semi final against the rags (and the final of course) and cruising ultimately to a very creditable third place. It augured well for the start of the next season. Sure enough we started like a house on fire. I don't think any of us expected the team to continue like that and rack up 100 points or more. Still with the best will in the world our form in 2012 has been very disaapointing. A lot of mediocre performances and too many outright bad ones. We've been knocked out of 3 cups and we've blown a 5 point lead in the title race.

If our challenge for the title continues to fall feebly away it does not suggest we're poised to race out of the blocks next season. On the contrary there are questions marks about the squad and Mancini's tactics all over the place; Tevez on his bike, Dzeko a big disappointment, Mario hasn't grown up, Johnson's inconsistent, No pace or width or indeed sign of a plan B when things go wrong, Can we play without Silva on form, De Jong one dimensional, Kolarov too slow, Savic a mistake etc. Of course there are positives too; Aguero looks a really good player,Vinnie and Lescott have been pretty solid and Micah's greatly improved, Joe's looking really good etc. It's not all bad by a long chalk.


For Mancini a lot rests on the last few games. If we pull ourselves together and put up a fight for the title he can probably survive coming second ( as well as disappointing ADUG with our Champion's League debut) but if we continue as we have been recently and the rags win comfortably then ADUG will surely try to prise Mourinho from Real Madrid. In my view you can hardly blame them.

Well put and basically its what I have been saying prior to the Sunderland match.....which was a shambles..now its Arsenal in a must win match.