Rangers Have Been Thrown Out Of The SPL

[ross.mcfc]

I've been listening to this with interest, more to how the SFL/SPL deal with it and I have to say that they are a complete shambles. If a club goes bust then there is only one place they can go, to the bottom, but in this case they've even got that wrong. Has been said, to join the league a club has to have 3 years figures yet this looks like it's been waived to serve a somewhat spurious purpose. Like Ross says, what about the clubs who have those 3 years accounts and want to join the league?

One thing they all go on about is when the Newco go to the away games and how clubs who usually get 300 and odd fans cope. Well, if the Newco get fans attending (this is not a given at present) the away games then I think they'll do just fine. Imagine that club now getting 2300 fans for that one game and imagine the revenue it will produce for the club and their wider community, it will be a massive boost.

The SFL have done exactly what the SPL tried to do, bend the rules to serve their own needs. Possibly having a new Rangers and their support visiting all of their grounds whilst moving back to the top is a win for all concerned. Obviously a decision had to be made but again they chose one of money rather than integrity. Funny 'Old' game really.

The point I made was a valid one, but in this situation I dont think the SFL had any other option. The league starts in three weeks, a SFL cup tournament starts in two. It would be highly unfair to ask a side from outside the SFA to put a proposal together, and then start in a league they had never budgeted for in three weeks time. With league reconstruction highly likey to happen in the next year or two these teams can bide their time and come in prepared. Like I said, These sides get much bigger crowds playing local rivals than they would traveling 2/3 hours for away games just to get thrashed.

In my opinion the SFL played a blinder and have showed that the SPL/SFA are fools who run sadly run our game. They should never have been put in this postition but refused to buckle under the severe pressure put on them to bend the rules. For once in Scotland, negativety didnt win.

It's a good point regarding the smaller clubs making a tidy profit also. There will be a tv deal put in place somewhere also.

It is worth noting that Rangers have the second best ground in the SFL3. The Glasgow derby next year could still have 50 thousand at it. Though I highly suspect it will be full of other fans having a day out laughting at Rangers. I for one cannot wait for Queens Park v Rangers.

[BlueinBosnia]

Does anyone reckon it's worth a cheeky tenner on Rangers to be drawn against Celtic in both Scottish Cups next season (any round)? Anyone know what odds would be offered?

[ross.mcfc]

One thing is for sure in Scotland, whatever commercial value a post-Rangers SPL might have had has been destroyed by the very men charged with promoting the league, who in recent weeks have not passed up a single opportunity to tell the world how little value their product has without Old Firm games.

The SPL board are meeting on Monday and hopefully they will sack Doncaster on the spot. Regans days it seems from the comments after yesterdays meeting are also numbered.

Do you remember the guy who owned Ratners the Jewlellers who in an interview said that he couldnt understand why people would buy such tat? They were out of business in a year. Well that is exactly what those two morons did. They also tried to go against 90% of all Scottish football fans wishes by attempting to keep Rangers out of SFL3. A company that ignores it's customers will soon have no business at all.

Doncaster signed off on the new Sky deal that kicks in this year. It made the SPL the 12th best tv deal in Europe. The SPL is the 7th best suppourted league in Europe. Higher than Holland, Portugal and Belgium. Per head of population, more people in Scotland attend football matches than any other country in Europe. Yet he signed off on a deal that gives the entire league a figure less than Wigan get for treading water in the Premiership.

[ross.mcfc]

Does anyone reckon it's worth a cheeky tenner on Rangers to be drawn against Celtic in both Scottish Cups next season (any round)? Anyone know what odds would be offered?

It's a cert.

There is also talk to bringing back the old Glasgow cup.

[ross.mcfc]

http://www.teamtalk.com/news/2483/7897331/Gers-voted-into-Third-Division

So they start in third division.

You know what, and some people are going to hate me for saying this, this could be the best thing ever to happen for Scottish football. Longmuir was saying elsewhere that it would be extremely detrimental for Scottish football if Rangers were voted to start in third division. Well wake the fuck up and smell the coffee.... there is now Glasgow Rangers anymore. There is some silly thing Rangers Newco but that's different thing. Also, Old Firm clubs haven't been living within means trying to chase ghosts (=European success). Well the roots for any financially succesfull club will always be in domestic league and European games should be treated as extra.

Also I feel this might actually make Scottish league competitive in long term. Sure Celtic will walk the title but they will have to cut their budget because of no Old Firm games and actually start paying attention to rest of the league. Elsewhere there will be people who have been Rangers fans whpo actually start paying attention to their local team.

Financially the Old Firm game and interest on it has created vacuum on top of the league that simply nwasn't healthy anymore. If Scottish football now look to the future trying to rebuild financially stable and competitive league rather than harping on about missing Old Firm games they might actually turn into interesting league.

I agree, I think there are hard times ahead but I really believe that some good will come out of this.

We have to move away from the current SPL model where everything suits Celtic and Rangers. It has killed out game and drove thousands off the gate reciepts at almost ever other team in the league. The thing that has annoyed me the most for the clammer to get Rangers in Div 1 is the idea that that model was working.

There was a time say ten years ago. When I had a season ticket for City, the weeks I wasnt down in Manchester I would be at a Scottish game. I have Celtic/Rangers season ticket holders on both sides of my family so would go along when there was a seat free. I would go to watch my local side Livingston and I would go to Aberdeen games with my mates. Two years ago I was living on Easter Road next door to the Hibs stadium and it didnt even cross my mind to go to a game. £25+ to watch that crap play the same sides making up the numbers.

Both Hearts and Hibs have fan bases to pack their stadium week in week out but due to them having no chance of ever winning the league they are lucky to get more than 10 thousand a week. Aberdeen who always had a chance to win the league till the mid 90's crowds have gone for 17/18 thousand to 6 or 7. I reckon the Edinburgh clubs, Aberdeen and Dundee United have a fan base bigger than quite a few clubs that have been in the Premiership in recent years.

The league needs to be made bigger to 16/18 teams. Stop playing each other four times a year. This will the established clubs to concentrate on developing youth players without the fear of being relegated.

A tv deal has to be set up that shows the right games. This current deal makes Scottish football much worse than it really is. Every week it's something like Rangers away to Inverness, Celtic away to St Mirren. Show some proper games. Show the Edinburgh derby, Show Aberdeen vrs Dundee United, Show the local derbys. Show Celtic and Rangers playing at home infront of 50 thousand people and not playing in a ground with three sides and a fisherman behind the goals at Inverness.

[ross.mcfc]

Elsewhere there will be people who have been Rangers fans whpo actually start paying attention to their local team.

Thats not going to happen but what I have found is that people who have walked away from our other clubs are now going back now they have been listened too. The clubs are now up against it and people will now have to start turning up at the gate.

My local side is now Partick Thistle. City is my side and I could never care enough about any other club to actaully suppourt but I really care about the Scottish game. It's all very well for me to be banging on about the state of the game and how things need to change and I do nothing about it. The clubs who have taken a brave choice in face of scaremongering and against their own financial interests to do the right thing deserve backing. So when I return to Glasgow I will be buying a Thistle season ticket.

Good job it's only £150 for a student

I am highly encouraged to read that today's Dundee derby pre season friendly is a complete sell out. That could potientially be an SPL game next year. Dundee United biggest gate last year was not against Celtic or Rangers but Aberdeen. There is life outside tafka Rangers and Celtic. Just our own media ran in the west coast refuse to acknowledge it. For to long they have been in the pocket of David Murray and now they are clinging on to a dead corpse desperatly trying to revive it. Finally, thanks to fan power, excellent blogs and message boards which have provided me with the whole picture in this saga the truth has finally been outed and the litte guy has won.

These same factions of our media which you can see on SSN and listen to on Talksport have been doing telling us with self interest at heart in the past few months.

Rangers will never go bust.
Rangers will get voted back into the SPL
It will be div 1 for Rangers.
Even this morning they are saying Rangers will get voted into the SPL on Monday morning.

Now the same people are telling us Scottish football will die without Rangers and they will be wrong yet again.

[Moonchesteri]

Thanks for your good posts and all the info ross. Been interesting to read them

[Dunnylad]

Do you remember the guy who owned Ratners the Jewlellers who in an interview said that he couldnt understand why people would buy such tat?

Gerald Ratner - he described the jewellery as shit

Thankfully the teams, owners, fans have all seen that some degree of FairPlay happens. The question about a newco in England - well based on ex-league club experiences it seems that they make it up as they go along! E.g. Darlington newco were placed in the pyramid much lower than Chester newco - possibly as the latter had access to the council owned old ground, although there was some concern about the number of fans who'd turn up to away crowds - so if Liverpool ended up as a newco, some bollocks about safety levels might see them parachuted not too far from the top

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

I love over the top posts like that. Wobble your head. The dutch and portugese leagues are significantly stronger than the Scottish ones. Two huge countries with a massive european and world pedigree, with profitable domestic games. Why would they ever be want to do the same as the Scottish league, which is pretty piss poor and irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

I am not comparing the standard of football.

Apart from the odd team every twenty years, neither Holland and Portugal make any impact in the CL and are largely proving grounds for players to move onto La Liga or the Premiership. These clubs cannot compete financially regardless of their history or global brand. It is worth noting that Wigan recieved more money from Sky for merely making up the numbers in the Premiership than the entire Scottish league did last year. If Ajax were given a chance to jump ship to the Bundesliga they would do it in a heart beat as realistically it is the only way they would be able to compete at the same level as the top sides.

Where do you want to draw the line, Lille and PSG are closer to London than the clubs in the North East.

I love the Premiership and for entertainment it cannot be rivalled but I love football more and strong domestic leagues are the life blood of football. You start inviting other clubs into your league then you start closing promotion and relegation and then it will just become a closed shop for only the rich.

Top top post. Well done.

[Beefymcfc]

Does anybody think that Rangers will be back to the top before they are supposed to? Fair enough, they start in the 3rd but what we are hearing is the restructuring of the Scottish leagues, back to 2 leagues meaning that Rangers should/will be back in the top division within 2 years.

Maybe this will be the making of Scottish Football, shame it took this to do it.

PS. What's happening to Ally McCoist?

[Nigels Tackle]

Does anybody think that Rangers will be back to the top before they are supposed to? Fair enough, they start in the 3rd but what we are hearing is the restructuring of the Scottish leagues, back to 2 leagues meaning that Rangers should/will be back in the top division within 2 years.

Maybe this will be the making of Scottish Football, shame it took this to do it.

PS. What's happening to Ally McCoist?

is he still banging sue barker?

[ross.mcfc]

Does anybody think that Rangers will be back to the top before they are supposed to? Fair enough, they start in the 3rd but what we are hearing is the restructuring of the Scottish leagues, back to 2 leagues meaning that Rangers should/will be back in the top division within 2 years.

Maybe this will be the making of Scottish Football, shame it took this to do it.

PS. What's happening to Ally McCoist?

As someone who is 100% behind them having to start in in Div 3, I have no problem what so ever with them being back under a league reconstruction as long as they dont skip leagues. The Scottish league really needs reconstructed. Far to many teams in the SFL are just going through the motions whilst a whole host of clubs outside the system have better set ups.

Ross County and Inverness will both be in the SPL next season. Both clubs have climbed up the through the leagues and they werent even in the system 15 years ago. Livingston were in div 3 when they were called Meadowbank, moved and have gone all the way to Europe and then all the way back before settling as a professional side in Div 1.

A top league of 16 and a league below of 16/18 sides is required. The rest need to be split into regional style leagues and NFL style play offs to who gets into the Div 1. I dont want any team to go bust and disapear but to many sides are just there making up the numbers with no incentive to progress.

[ross.mcfc]

There in my mind is still a great deal of doubt if the newco will even start the season and an even bigger one if they will even finish it.

They were accepted into SFL under the conditions they showed they were linked to Rangers. Otherwise the newco would have failed to gain acceptance to the league.

The club that was liquidated still has outstanding footballing debts to pay in the region of 5 million pound, it also have a transfer embargo hanging over it. By accepting the links to Rangers the newco have their hands tied behind their back. They will have no tv deal and reduced ticket income. Green is in this to make a quick buck and there is no chance he can pay off the debts and still make a profit.

Add to this, He bought Ibrox and Murray Park. Both world class facilities but these things dont run by themselves. It cost 1.5m a month just to keep those two assets operating.

They currently have six full time pro's on the books and thats that. They at present cant sign anyone. It's easy to say just play the kids but all the good ones have already jumped ship. The 3rd division standard is awful, however it is full of journey men ex pro's who will see the newco as a cup final everytime they play them. Rangers record of bringing on youth players was not the best in the first place and as any CIty fan will know players who perform well at u19 level by no means go onto become good pro's at any level. It would be incredibly unfair on a bunch of 18 year olds with no league experience to stick them in front of 20/30 thousand every week and expect them to walk the league.

At this stage it is impossible to see how this one will work out, but I think it is very niave at present to suggest this current newco will just walk the 3rd division. If I was a sports TV channel I would be snapping up the rights to the SFL3 and making a behind the scence weekly proggrame out of this. They can even use the the title from the book written about us.

'down amongst the dead men'

[BlueinBosnia]

They were accepted into SFL under the conditions they showed they were linked to Rangers. Otherwise the newco would have failed to gain acceptance to the league.

The club that was liquidated still has outstanding footballing debts to pay in the region of 5 million pound, it also have a transfer embargo hanging over it. By accepting the links to Rangers the newco have their hands tied behind their back.

Are the 'ties' they needed to show the SFL footballing or legal/financial/administrative ones? If the former, could this be used against them for any form of debt reclaim?

[ross.mcfc]

They were accepted into SFL under the conditions they showed they were linked to Rangers. Otherwise the newco would have failed to gain acceptance to the league.

The club that was liquidated still has outstanding footballing debts to pay in the region of 5 million pound, it also have a transfer embargo hanging over it. By accepting the links to Rangers the newco have their hands tied behind their back.

Are the 'ties' they needed to show the SFL footballing or legal/financial/administrative ones? If the former, could this be used against them for any form of debt reclaim?

Yep - The later.

I believe he is meeting with UEFA today in a bid to come to a reconstruction of the debt owed to the European clubs.

[ronk]

Leeds still haven't made it back to the prem, despite strong attendances.

[Esky]

]

I love over the top posts like that. Wobble your head. The dutch and portugese leagues are significantly stronger than the Scottish ones. Two huge countries with a massive european and world pedigree, with profitable domestic games. Why would they ever be want to do the same as the Scottish league, which is pretty piss poor and irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

I am not comparing the standard of football.

Apart from the odd team every twenty years, neither Holland and Portugal make any impact in the CL and are largely proving grounds for players to move onto La Liga or the Premiership. These clubs cannot compete financially regardless of their history or global brand. It is worth noting that Wigan recieved more money from Sky for merely making up the numbers in the Premiership than the entire Scottish league did last year. If Ajax were given a chance to jump ship to the Bundesliga they would do it in a heart beat as realistically it is the only way they would be able to compete at the same level as the top sides.

Where do you want to draw the line, Lille and PSG are closer to London than the clubs in the North East.

I love the Premiership and for entertainment it cannot be rivalled but I love football more and strong domestic leagues are the life blood of football. You start inviting other clubs into your league then you start closing promotion and relegation and then it will just become a closed shop for only the rich.

That's a great post.

As per the bold, I agree. I do find one thing somewhat hypocritical, though. Any time someone suggests the Old Firm come to England, it's shut down immediately. Similarly, the (stupid) idea of a European Super League is always slammed because it creates that same financially-driven closed shop. This happens on the same board, though, where there's thread after thread about how our club could avoid FFP. Even if FFP is poorly thought out, without it, City, Chelsea and United will win uncontested, year after year and year.

Not a personal point at all, just a general observation of the board.

[The Italian Job]

And who will win with FFP? West Ham? Everton? At least without FFP Clubs still have a chance to buy themselves into the elite like we did.