Yaya Toure v Colin Bell

[patrickblue]

I´d choose Yaya.

Bell was obviously a phenomenal player in his day but the overall standard of play has improved a lot since those days.

I was looking for this comment.

If Colin Bell was in the modern game, he would have access to modern training techniques, equipment, physio, pitches like carpet and the professional game we enjoy today. He'd have more money resulting in an easier lifestyle and kick a lighter ball that's scientifically designed to fly through the air quicker and boots that feel light as a feather.

If we're comparing them, imagine the player he'd be in today's game with access to all that.

It should also be taken into consideration, when people talk about the game being slower etc in those days, that if you took our full squad now, trimmed it down by nearly half to the numbers involved then, allowed only one substitute, stuck them on awful pitches, with the equipment you mention, plus the different refs & the physical nature of the game, some of them wouldn't be able to play at all. Those who did, would be running a lot slower by this time of the year, Aguero etc would be injured half the time & Yaya Toure would probably be in hospital on a respirator.

A different kind of fitness & toughness was required to do what they did.

You're absolutely spot on. I remember my dad saying what a load of big girls they were in the sixties and seventies because they didn't have to play with a wet through laced up leather ball that would give you concussion if you you tried to head it.

[patrickblue]

Mind you, Colin's autobiography was bloody awful.

[getdressedmctavish]

Ha, some great points here. I think you are seriously deluded on this one Ted. You've only got to see our results in the league to know how often Colin failed to change games. Alternatively, watch him playing at international level for a view of crab football at its best. Agree about the tackling, mind. Imagine Ya Ya with Norman Hunter biting his legs,lol.But Bell was running past a bunch of puddins half the time. Ya Ya is leaving physically honed athletes in his wake.And can you really imagine Colin scoring Ya Ya's goal v Cardiff with his left foot after a 60 yard run, remind me , I cant remember that one, Ted,lol

[Socrates]

Ha, some great points here. I think you are seriously deluded on this one Ted. You've only got to see our results in the league to know how often Colin failed to change games. Alternatively, watch him playing at international level for a view of crab football at its best. Agree about the tackling, mind. Imagine Ya Ya with Norman Hunter biting his legs,lol.But Bell was running past a bunch of puddins half the time. Ya Ya is leaving physically honed athletes in his wake.And can you really imagine Colin scoring Ya Ya's goal v Cardiff with his left foot after a 60 yard run, remind me , I cant remember that one, Ted,lol

Now, now. It's not on trying to smash apart an old man's delusions. Especially when I agree with them! We may have blue tinted specs but Bell was a class apart from those around him and we will remember him that way forever.

[zuricity]

Ha, some great points here. I think you are seriously deluded on this one Ted. You've only got to see our results in the league to know how often Colin failed to change games. Alternatively, watch him playing at international level for a view of crab football at its best. Agree about the tackling, mind. Imagine Ya Ya with Norman Hunter biting his legs,lol.But Bell was running past a bunch of puddins half the time. Ya Ya is leaving physically honed athletes in his wake.And can you really imagine Colin scoring Ya Ya's goal v Cardiff with his left foot after a 60 yard run, remind me , I cant remember that one, Ted,lol

I think Norman Mard arse , hit them from behind cos they can't see me coming and then run away as quickly as possible Hunter.
Norman who wouldn't say boo to a goose when playing away from home. Norman would be wearing his brown trousers against Yaya.

Yaya would easily nail that cheat.

[Rag_hater]

This team we have now with Sergio,David ,Yaya ,Vincent and all the others is the best team and bunch of individuals we have ever had.

[bayblue]

This team we have now with Sergio,David ,Yaya ,Vincent and all the others is the best team and bunch of individuals we have ever had.

No doubt about it.
So, who else from our history would get into today's team?
I think Colin Bell for Fernandinho, Dave Watson for Lescott/Nastasic/Demichaelis, maybe Glynn Pardoe for Clichy/Kolarov, just maybe Joe Corrigan at his very best from Hart. Anyone else? Any shouts for Kinkladze, Lee, Bernarbia??

[Blue Since 76]

Heard an interview with Joe Royle last night who was praising Bell, especially for his athleticism.

I never saw the real Bell play - I probably saw a few games when he tried to come back, although I was only 7 when he left. But I suspect the best players from any era would be the best players now, despite the increase in pace.

The four minute mile may be slow by today's standards, but there's no reason to assume Bannister wouldn't be able to go any faster with modern sports science and equipment. Da Vinci couldn't work out how to make a helicopter fly, but that doesn't make him an idiot.

The same would apply to footballers - better pitches, balls, diet, training etc and Pele, Eusebio, Bell, Law etc would be the modern day Messi or Aguero.

In terms of Yaya, from what I've heard, I suspect Yaya can do things that Bell couldn't. However, Bell did a lot of things that Yaya can't or won't. And since money is no object, why wouldn't we just have both?

[Rag_hater]

This team we have now with Sergio,David ,Yaya ,Vincent and all the others is the best team and bunch of individuals we have ever had.

No doubt about it.
So, who else from our history would get into today's team?
I think Colin Bell for Fernandinho, Dave Watson for Lescott/Nastasic/Demichaelis, maybe Glynn Pardoe for Clichy/Kolarov, just maybe Joe Corrigan at his very best from Hart. Anyone else? Any shouts for Kinkladze, Lee, Bernarbia??

Out of those you have said I think what we have at the minute is better,maybe Dunne for Joleon but I would have to hear arguments from both camps or their mums.

[Hutch's Shoulder]

Andy Hinchcliffe, Trevor Francis, Bert, Dave Watson, not much from the 1980-2010 period though.

[Rag_hater]

[youtube]nHX8kloT0as[/youtube]


Can't tackle.
My arse he can't

[Ted Hughes]

[youtube]nHX8kloT0as[/youtube]


Can't tackle.
My arse he can't

Of course Yaya can tackle. He doesn't do it very often, but he certainly can. He can also run the length of the pitch to help out the defence. as he did on one occasion v Watford. Doesn't do it that often though.

Bell did.

Yaya is very good at most things & fantastic at some. Bell was better than him at most things, including tackling.

[Slim]

Heard an interview with Joe Royle last night who was praising Bell, especially for his athleticism.

I never saw the real Bell play - I probably saw a few games when he tried to come back, although I was only 7 when he left. But I suspect the best players from any era would be the best players now, despite the increase in pace.

The four minute mile may be slow by today's standards, but there's no reason to assume Bannister wouldn't be able to go any faster with modern sports science and equipment. Da Vinci couldn't work out how to make a helicopter fly, but that doesn't make him an idiot.

The same would apply to footballers - better pitches, balls, diet, training etc and Pele, Eusebio, Bell, Law etc would be the modern day Messi or Aguero.

In terms of Yaya, from what I've heard, I suspect Yaya can do things that Bell couldn't. However, Bell did a lot of things that Yaya can't or won't. And since money is no object, why wouldn't we just have both?

How about the real greatest player to have ever lived?

Fuck Pele, Maradona and Bell, imagine this guy in today's game...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfredo_Di_St%C3%A9fano

[Ted Hughes]

This team we have now with Sergio,David ,Yaya ,Vincent and all the others is the best team and bunch of individuals we have ever had.

No doubt about it.
So, who else from our history would get into today's team?
I think Colin Bell for Fernandinho, Dave Watson for Lescott/Nastasic/Demichaelis, maybe Glynn Pardoe for Clichy/Kolarov, just maybe Joe Corrigan at his very best from Hart. Anyone else? Any shouts for Kinkladze, Lee, Bernarbia??

Well we don't even really know which 11 we would have now out of the present squad, it is 20 odd players we are talking about really.

With modern training methods/equipment etc, Bell Lee Summerbee, Doyle, Pardoe, Oakes would all be good enough to be in the squad. Doyle Pardoe Oakes would be ahead of anyone in their roles bar Vinny imo. Bell would be the first name on the team sheet. Lee would get in ahead of anyone but Aguero & that would be close if he'd come through today rather than in the 60s.

Lee in the modern game, would be like Rooney but better imo.

Tueart Barnes Hartford Watson would all be good eough to get in the present squad. Paul power probably would tbf even though he's not spoken of in glowing terms, he would be a real asset, like Milner.

Lake easily. Hinchcliffe imo was better than Clichy or Kolarov & would be perfect for this football.

It would be down to personal preference rather than ability.

The coaching now would be different too & a lot of those players would love the way the game is played.

People talking about defenders who are comfortable in possession for instance; Mike Doyle, Paul Lake.

[Rag_hater]

For me the fact that this team and squad have set and are on course to beat the records we set before shows that this group of players are the best we have had.

[Burt]

Heard an interview with Joe Royle last night who was praising Bell, especially for his athleticism.

I never saw the real Bell play - I probably saw a few games when he tried to come back, although I was only 7 when he left. But I suspect the best players from any era would be the best players now, despite the increase in pace.

The four minute mile may be slow by today's standards, but there's no reason to assume Bannister wouldn't be able to go any faster with modern sports science and equipment. Da Vinci couldn't work out how to make a helicopter fly, but that doesn't make him an idiot.

The same would apply to footballers - better pitches, balls, diet, training etc and Pele, Eusebio, Bell, Law etc would be the modern day Messi or Aguero.

In terms of Yaya, from what I've heard, I suspect Yaya can do things that Bell couldn't. However, Bell did a lot of things that Yaya can't or won't. And since money is no object, why wouldn't we just have both?

How about the real greatest player to have ever lived?

Fuck Pele, Maradona and Bell, imagine this guy in today's game...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfredo_Di_St%C3%A9fano

Bollox Slim. I've seen him play and he wasn't even as good as Cruyff!

[Slim]

Heard an interview with Joe Royle last night who was praising Bell, especially for his athleticism.

I never saw the real Bell play - I probably saw a few games when he tried to come back, although I was only 7 when he left. But I suspect the best players from any era would be the best players now, despite the increase in pace.

The four minute mile may be slow by today's standards, but there's no reason to assume Bannister wouldn't be able to go any faster with modern sports science and equipment. Da Vinci couldn't work out how to make a helicopter fly, but that doesn't make him an idiot.

The same would apply to footballers - better pitches, balls, diet, training etc and Pele, Eusebio, Bell, Law etc would be the modern day Messi or Aguero.

In terms of Yaya, from what I've heard, I suspect Yaya can do things that Bell couldn't. However, Bell did a lot of things that Yaya can't or won't. And since money is no object, why wouldn't we just have both?

How about the real greatest player to have ever lived?

Fuck Pele, Maradona and Bell, imagine this guy in today's game...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfredo_Di_St%C3%A9fano

Bollox Slim. I've seen him play and he wasn't even as good as Cruyff!

He retired when you were 4, how exactly?

[Blue Since 76]

For me the fact that this team and squad have set and are on course to beat the records we set before shows that this group of players are the best we have had.

You could have put Maradona into the side Alan Ball had and he'd have got it relegated. This is certainly the best team overall, but it might not have the best players in every position

[blue-nova]

This discussion gets rolled out every year or two :)

For me there are two key points:

1. Football these days is much more about athleticism. Colin would have been even faster and fitter given modern training, but one of the things that made him special was that he was ultra fit in a time when many players were simply "fit enough". Nowadays all those smoking, overweight types he was up against would have also been at peak fitness, or would be playing in League One.

So - while he would be better than he was, the players around him would likely have made a bigger jump, and his fitness wouldn't stand out so much.

2. At the time he played he was one of the best players in the UK. Nowadays maybe 80% of the best players in the league are from overseas. That means the standard is a hell of a lot higher. To be considered a top City player now you have to be one of the best players in the World, not just the British Isles.

[bigblue]

I don't mean to disrespect The King, but even if he had modern fitness training, he wouldn't be up to Yaya's level for one simple reason:

Yaya's heart is 2x the size of a normal human's heart.

People talk of men vs boys... well Yaya is a Jolly Giant/Goliath/Frankenstein playing against mere humans.