MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Wonderwall » Thu Dec 17, 2009 2:35 pm

It is a frustrating season with the draws and the missed opportunities, however, this topsy turvy season is not even half way yet and there are lots more surprises to come. Some of the media are saying it was a 6 pointer and that we are hard pushed to get that 4th spot. Typical over reaction that you expect from the media circus that lie in wait every game. I wonder if any of the Arsenal fans are campaigning to get Wenger out? They are seriously unpredictable.

Lost to the rags 102
lost to us 2-4
drew with west ham after being 2-0 up
lost to sunderland 0-1
lost to chelsea 0-3
lost to us again 0-3
drew with burnley after being 1-0 up

yet they beat other teams by high scores, they have had scores of 6-1, 4-1, 4-0, 6-2, 3-0 and 4-1 as well as other 1-0 and 2-0 scorelines.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Twobob » Thu Dec 17, 2009 2:38 pm

Wonderwall wrote:
Twobob wrote:
Wonderwall wrote:are these the same players that beat chelsea in an awesome performance just over a week ago?


Yes mate, so whats going wrong against 'lesser' teams (were we're lucky to get a draw) and get torn a new asshole by a 4th spot pretender?


its called consistency at a high level and we just dont have it. Its not 1 mans fault its several of them that need a good kicking. I dont care what tactics and formation hughes employs, the 11 that wear the shirt should give 100%. There is no excuse for not trying.


I'm just finding it more and more difficult to come up with any defense now though, I was in the Give hughes time etc bullshit 'camps' that grew arround the place, and he has my support as current manager of my club but finding it so hard to defend descisions and I find myself swaying from one side of the pendulum to the other now!

I dont know what the answer is and never will and can only give my feelings - going back with KK and Pearce, loved them both and wanted them to stay and be a success but eventually even I had to admit that things were not right - I'm starting to get to that ugly place again and I dont like it there - If we were at the bottom of the league then it would be easy but we're not - If Hughes does well we do well simple as that, but the little voices in my head are saying that at the end of the day if the 11 on the pitch aren't putting in the commitment its his and his teams job to make sure they do or play players that will.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby CITYSTEVEDON » Thu Dec 17, 2009 2:44 pm

9secondlegend wrote:this is exactly like when the cunt took over. he is slowly but surley turning good players into bad ones.



good players turn them selfs into bad players. if they carnt care then get some who would care for the blue shirt
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Wonderwall » Thu Dec 17, 2009 2:45 pm

Twobob wrote:
Wonderwall wrote:
Twobob wrote:
Wonderwall wrote:are these the same players that beat chelsea in an awesome performance just over a week ago?


Yes mate, so whats going wrong against 'lesser' teams (were we're lucky to get a draw) and get torn a new asshole by a 4th spot pretender?


its called consistency at a high level and we just dont have it. Its not 1 mans fault its several of them that need a good kicking. I dont care what tactics and formation hughes employs, the 11 that wear the shirt should give 100%. There is no excuse for not trying.


I'm just finding it more and more difficult to come up with any defense now though, I was in the Give hughes time etc bullshit 'camps' that grew arround the place, and he has my support as current manager of my club but finding it so hard to defend descisions and I find myself swaying from one side of the pendulum to the other now!

I dont know what the answer is and never will and can only give my feelings - going back with KK and Pearce, loved them both and wanted them to stay and be a success but eventually even I had to admit that things were not right - I'm starting to get to that ugly place again and I dont like it there - If we were at the bottom of the league then it would be easy but we're not - If Hughes does well we do well simple as that, but the little voices in my head are saying that at the end of the day if the 11 on the pitch aren't putting in the commitment its his and his teams job to make sure they do or play players that will.


I know exactly what your saying and empathise with your position. I am firmly in the camp of "he has until the end of the season and has my full support". I want to see how things pan out, however, I will not say nothing when he was totally wrong in his decisions like last night. I want him to succeed but I will not stand by and look for excuses for him.

I do tend to defend him on occasions when some people start to say silly things which are totally out of context and laughable. Football is a results game and Hughes needs to start stringing some together or he will start to feel the pressure from the crowd and the board room.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Original Dub » Thu Dec 17, 2009 2:45 pm

Twobob wrote:
Wonderwall wrote:
Twobob wrote:
Wonderwall wrote:are these the same players that beat chelsea in an awesome performance just over a week ago?


Yes mate, so whats going wrong against 'lesser' teams (were we're lucky to get a draw) and get torn a new asshole by a 4th spot pretender?


its called consistency at a high level and we just dont have it. Its not 1 mans fault its several of them that need a good kicking. I dont care what tactics and formation hughes employs, the 11 that wear the shirt should give 100%. There is no excuse for not trying.


I'm just finding it more and more difficult to come up with any defense now though, I was in the Give hughes time etc bullshit 'camps' that grew arround the place, and he has my support as current manager of my club but finding it so hard to defend descisions and I find myself swaying from one side of the pendulum to the other now!

I dont know what the answer is and never will and can only give my feelings - going back with KK and Pearce, loved them both and wanted them to stay and be a success but eventually even I had to admit that things were not right - I'm starting to get to that ugly place again and I dont like it there - If we were at the bottom of the league then it would be easy but we're not - If Hughes does well we do well simple as that, but the little voices in my head are saying that at the end of the day if the 11 on the pitch aren't putting in the commitment its his and his teams job to make sure they do or play players that will.


Excellent post mate and it mirrors my feelings too.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Im_Spartacus » Thu Dec 17, 2009 3:00 pm

Bluez wrote:
johnpb78 wrote:Sorry mate, I cannot accept the view that you put forward, that he "turned the season" round after xmas last year, as though he is completely absolved from blame for being in the bottom 3 on xmas day in the first place. It was only turned round because his team were so fucking shite in the first half, so it would have been hard NOT to have a better 2nd half of the season.

The fact was we should never have been in the predicament we were at xmas. We are now seeing a carbon copy of what happened last year, managers have worked out how to play against us, the results slowly slide firstly into mediocrity, then into farce.

This season, we have proven quality defenders who mysteriously have forgotten how to defend - as we did last season
This season, we have a team who sometimes look like they dont give a fuck - as we did last season
The quality of player who doesnt give a fuck, and the quality of the defenders who have become shite is significantly higher, thus questions have to be asked of the one who calls the shots - the manager who controls selection, training and tactics.


I never said we weren't absolute shite 1st half of the season, I just mentioned we did better points wise in the second half than we did in the first half.


The point is that he shouldnt be credited for "turning the season round" when we should never, ever have been in a predicament where it damned well needed turning around to avoid relegation. Last year many put it down to players attitudes, poor quality players etc etc, but here we are again - the same problems, different players, different year, same manager.

Good players will take you so far and might win the odd cup, it is the tactics and motivation that get you trophies on a consistent basis. Ultimately we now have a squad that could win a trophy this year on talent alone in one off games, but we also have a squad that with the right guidance, can consistently turn on performances like we did against Chelsea. The worry is that the manager is not getting the players up for every, or even the majority of games, invariably is tactically outwitted by his opponent, and these are the missing ingredient right now.

All this talk about this player should have played, or we should have plyed this formation is bollocks. The man is paid to prepare his team during the week both mentally and physically, and to outwit his opposition manager on a match day. He does neither often enough to warrant any suggestion that he is/could be a good manager.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Bluez » Thu Dec 17, 2009 4:02 pm

johnpb78 wrote:The point is that he shouldnt be credited for "turning the season round" when we should never, ever have been in a predicament where it damned well needed turning around to avoid relegation. Last year many put it down to players attitudes, poor quality players etc etc, but here we are again - the same problems, different players, different year, same manager.


I wasn't trying to give him credit in any way, if the phrase "turning teh season around" offends you so much I will change it

They won't back failure, but I think they will wait until they have confirmed evidence of it. Even now you regularly hear the press on the radio and podcasts etc saying that give it time and Hughes will trun it around, hes a good promising manager etc. [strike]If he turns this season round like he did[/strike] If the second half of this season is an improvement on the first half, as it was last season after Christmas, we will be on for a top four place so the owners could be pummeled in the press for getting rid now. We score almost every game so just a couple more clean sheets and we would start quickly moving up the table so its not as though too much needs fixing. If we don't finish where the owners want to finish this season they will get rid they are not stupid. The question is what do they consider acceptable?

I think they think more long term, so 6 months is not much in a 5-10 year plan. They will decide at the end of the season.

The basic underlying point remains the same, the owners do not want to be seen as having a revolving door policy on managers and seem to be prepared to wait. They want to gain credibility after all teh negative press such a high profile take over was bound to attract.

Personally I think he will be moved on in the summer.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Soulboy » Thu Dec 17, 2009 5:50 pm

Wonderwall wrote:It is a frustrating season with the draws and the missed opportunities, however, this topsy turvy season is not even half way yet and there are lots more surprises to come. Some of the media are saying it was a 6 pointer and that we are hard pushed to get that 4th spot. Typical over reaction that you expect from the media circus that lie in wait every game. I wonder if any of the Arsenal fans are campaigning to get Wenger out? They are seriously unpredictable.

Lost to the rags 102
lost to us 2-4
drew with west ham after being 2-0 up
lost to sunderland 0-1
lost to chelsea 0-3
lost to us again 0-3
drew with burnley after being 1-0 up

yet they beat other teams by high scores, they have had scores of 6-1, 4-1, 4-0, 6-2, 3-0 and 4-1 as well as other 1-0 and 2-0 scorelines.


Bit of an unfair comparison surely? Wenger deserves some level of patience and support because he can point to a track record of a couple of Premierships, a few Cups, unbeaten for a whole season... and Hughes can fall back on... beating Chelsea.

Once Hughes has delivered a track record like Wenger then I'll be all for forgiving him the odd spat!

Oh, and in spite of all those dodgy results, they are still top 4 and not quite out of it yet for the Premiership... as well as in the Champions League knock-outs.

Not really comparing like with like on this one.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby King Kev » Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:35 pm

dazby wrote:He got us in a cup semi. He's got the job til that campaign finishes.
What happens then?
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby King Kev » Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:37 pm

Wonderwall wrote:its called consistency at a high level and we just dont have it. Its not 1 mans fault its several of them that need a good kicking. I dont care what tactics and formation hughes employs, the 11 that wear the shirt should give 100%. There is no excuse for not trying.

Let's hope our manager is capable of giving them that kicking then.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Wonderwall » Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:57 pm

King Kev wrote:
Wonderwall wrote:its called consistency at a high level and we just dont have it. Its not 1 mans fault its several of them that need a good kicking. I dont care what tactics and formation hughes employs, the 11 that wear the shirt should give 100%. There is no excuse for not trying.

Let's hope our manager is capable of giving them that kicking then.


me too
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby King Kev » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:51 pm

Odds On The Next Prem Manager To Leave His Club (Paddy Power)

McCarthy 25/1
Allardyce 25/1
Benitez 14/1
Zola 10/1
Brown 11/2
Megson 11/2
hughes 1/4

It seems that it's more a matter of 'when' than 'if'.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Beefymcfc » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:17 pm

King Kev wrote:Odds On The Next Prem Manager To Leave His Club (Paddy Power)

McCarthy 25/1
Allardyce 25/1
Benitez 14/1
Zola 10/1
Brown 11/2
Megson 11/2
hughes 1/4

It seems that it's more a matter of 'when' than 'if'.

Heard it on the radio. Apparently he was at 9/1 before the game, knocked down by a couple of points afterwards, followed by quite a bit of betting ending with him at 5/2 late on. More betting this moning pushed it to 1/4 around lunchtime. I think people want to bet and the way it's going, Hughes looks to be that.

From my point of view, I wouldn't be wasting my money on it. It's surely money wasted.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Beefymcfc » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:45 pm

Didn't know whether to put this in the match thread or in here, so I chose the latter as it is more about Hughes position. For me it's a very good article that seems to echo my views and I've highlighted a couple of bits that I was unaware of, but pleased to here.

Hughes let down by City slackers
Oliver Kay Football Correspondent

If the raised voices in the Manchester City dressing room at White Hart Lane spoke of a team heading for the rocks, Mark Hughes will quietly spell out the need for more reinforcements and stronger personalities when he meets Khaldoon al-Mubarak, the club’s chairman, this weekend for discussions that will shape his future.

Hughes’s position as City manager is not under immediate threat, but, after a damaging sequence of one win in the past ten Barclays Premier League matches, a drastic improvement will be needed if he is to persuade al-Mubarak and Sheikh Mansour, the owner, to persevere with him next season rather than attempt to lure a more proven coach, such as José Mourinho or Guus Hiddink, to the City of Manchester Stadium.

City have spent more than £200 million on new players since Mansour bought the club in September 2008 and after an impressive start to the new campaign, their new-look team have slipped into alarming habits. Driven to distraction by Robinho, increasingly concerned by the form of Kolo Touré and Emmanuel Adebayor and unnerved by an injury crisis that will deprive him of Joleon Lescott and Wayne Bridge until the end of January, Hughes is desperate to reinforce his defence and midfield, and to add more leadership to a squad that has lost its way over the past two months.

Hughes is looking for stronger personalities in his squad and, for all the longer-term plans to entice Yaya Touré from Barcelona and Franck Ribéry from Bayern Munich, his targets for the January transfer window will be more prosaic. While the manager has looked far and wide in search of a left back, targets closer to home may include Brede Hangeland, the Fulham defender, Scott Parker, the West Ham United midfield player, and possibly even David Bentley, the winger who is out of favour at Tottenham Hotspur.

The departures of Kolo Touré and Adebayor on international duty this month, to represent Ivory Coast and Togo respectively in the African Cup of Nations, will stretch Hughes’s resources throughout January, but the former Arsenal pair felt the force of Hughes’s and at least one player’s ire in the dressing room after the 3-0 defeat by Tottenham on Wednesday night. Touré was culpable for Tottenham’s second goal, scored by Jermain Defoe, and Adebayor coasted through the game, as he has done on several occasions since returning from a three-match suspension in October.

Gareth Barry, the midfield player, said that the atmosphere among the City players was tense at White Hart Lane. “It was a more disappointed dressing room because of the way we lost,” he said. “There were a lot of hurt players in there and the lads were really at each other’s throats. We are desperate to put things right.”

Hughes is understood to have welcomed the slanging match, given that a similarly frank exchange of views in the dressing room last month, after the 1-1 draw at home to Hull City, was followed by victories over Arsenal, in the Carling Cup, and against Chelsea.

City need a similar reaction at home to Sunderland tomorrow — and, beyond that, at home to Stoke City on Boxing Day and away to Wolverhampton Wanderers two days later — to improve the mood before the FA Cup third-round tie away to Middlesbrough on January 2 and the eagerly awaited Carling Cup semi-final, first leg at home to Manchester United four days later.

For all that their form has been disappointing, though, City remain on course for the top-six finish that al-Mubarak cited as their pre-season target. Privately, Hughes has discussed the prospect of Champions League qualification with his players and the board, but even that ambition remains firmly within reach, with City six points behind Aston Villa, who are fourth, having played one game more.

“Christmas is a massive time,” Barry said. “There are a lot of games in a short space of time, so the chance is there to propel yourself up the league. Our desire to make the top four is stronger than ever.”
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby edge275 » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:50 pm

Beefymcfc wrote:Didn't know whether to put this in the match thread or in here, so I chose the latter as it is more about Hughes position. For me it's a very good article that seems to echo my views and I've highlighted a couple of bits that I was unaware of, but pleased to here.

Hughes let down by City slackers
Oliver Kay Football Correspondent

If the raised voices in the Manchester City dressing room at White Hart Lane spoke of a team heading for the rocks, Mark Hughes will quietly spell out the need for more reinforcements and stronger personalities when he meets Khaldoon al-Mubarak, the club’s chairman, this weekend for discussions that will shape his future.

Hughes’s position as City manager is not under immediate threat, but, after a damaging sequence of one win in the past ten Barclays Premier League matches, a drastic improvement will be needed if he is to persuade al-Mubarak and Sheikh Mansour, the owner, to persevere with him next season rather than attempt to lure a more proven coach, such as José Mourinho or Guus Hiddink, to the City of Manchester Stadium.

City have spent more than £200 million on new players since Mansour bought the club in September 2008 and after an impressive start to the new campaign, their new-look team have slipped into alarming habits. Driven to distraction by Robinho, increasingly concerned by the form of Kolo Touré and Emmanuel Adebayor and unnerved by an injury crisis that will deprive him of Joleon Lescott and Wayne Bridge until the end of January, Hughes is desperate to reinforce his defence and midfield, and to add more leadership to a squad that has lost its way over the past two months.

Hughes is looking for stronger personalities in his squad and, for all the longer-term plans to entice Yaya Touré from Barcelona and Franck Ribéry from Bayern Munich, his targets for the January transfer window will be more prosaic. While the manager has looked far and wide in search of a left back, targets closer to home may include Brede Hangeland, the Fulham defender, Scott Parker, the West Ham U***d midfield player, and possibly even David Bentley, the winger who is out of favour at Tottenham Hotspur.

The departures of Kolo Touré and Adebayor on international duty this month, to represent Ivory Coast and Togo respectively in the African Cup of Nations, will stretch Hughes’s resources throughout January, but the former Arsenal pair felt the force of Hughes’s and at least one player’s ire in the dressing room after the 3-0 defeat by Tottenham on Wednesday night. Touré was culpable for Tottenham’s second goal, scored by Jermain Defoe, and Adebayor coasted through the game, as he has done on several occasions since returning from a three-match suspension in October.

Gareth Barry, the midfield player, said that the atmosphere among the City players was tense at White Hart Lane. “It was a more disappointed dressing room because of the way we lost,” he said. “There were a lot of hurt players in there and the lads were really at each other’s throats. We are desperate to put things right.”

Hughes is understood to have welcomed the slanging match, given that a similarly frank exchange of views in the dressing room last month, after the 1-1 draw at home to Hull City, was followed by victories over Arsenal, in the Carling Cup, and against Chelsea.

City need a similar reaction at home to Sunderland tomorrow — and, beyond that, at home to Stoke City on Boxing Day and away to Wolverhampton Wanderers two days later — to improve the mood before the FA Cup third-round tie away to Middlesbrough on January 2 and the eagerly awaited Carling Cup semi-final, first leg at home to Manchester U***d four days later.

For all that their form has been disappointing, though, City remain on course for the top-six finish that al-Mubarak cited as their pre-season target. Privately, Hughes has discussed the prospect of Champions League qualification with his players and the board, but even that ambition remains firmly within reach, with City six points behind Aston Villa, who are fourth, having played one game more.

“Christmas is a massive time,” Barry said. “There are a lot of games in a short space of time, so the chance is there to propel yourself up the league. Our desire to make the top four is stronger than ever.”


Ah the old "It's the players not the manager" line.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby dikdik » Fri Dec 18, 2009 12:57 am

Surely it's the job of the manager to direct and motivate the players!? If they're not puttin in a shift then they're not being motivated.
In any organisation if the job is not being done then the manager takes the blame ultimately.
Or have I missed something?
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Wonderwall » Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:06 am

I see sky are creating bollox about nothing to try and unsettle City

Manchester City have asked about the future of Guus Hiddink, according to the Russia manager's representative.

Current Eastlands boss Mark Hughes is under increasing pressure after his side slipped to eighth in the Premier League following Wednesday's defeat at Tottenham.

City were comfortably beaten 3-0 by Spurs at White Hart Lane to cast doubts over their top-four credentials and the security of their manager's job.

Hiddink, alongside Roberto Mancini and Jose Mourinho, has been installed among the favourites to replace Hughes if City owner Sheikh Mansour decides to act

And the Dutchman's agent, Cees Van Nieuwenhuizen, told the Daily Telegraph when asked if he has spoken to the English club's chief executive Garry Cook: "Yes, I did.

"But Guus is happy with Russia. Definitely. I had a call because I have been working with Garry for 12 years since we worked together at Nike.

Discuss

"But I have received calls from all over the world about Guus. There has also been an approach from Juventus.

"He (Cook) asked me if it would be worthwhile having a meeting to discuss the future and what might happen next summer. But I told him that Guus was contracted to Russia.

"I said I didn't think it was worth having a meeting. Guus is very relaxed. He starts his holiday tomorrow and in January there are elections for a new president for the Russian Federation.

"He is contracted until next summer but there is an offer for him to stay for two more years, and I think he will definitely stay."

Van Nieuwenhuizen claims City did not go into detail regarding a potential role for Hiddink, adding: "I don't know because I said it was not worth discussing it because Guus was happy."

Reports suggest Hiddink, who performed excellently in guiding Chelsea to an FA Cup win as interim manager in the second half of last season, is prepared to consider his future in February.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Craig B » Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:12 am

Is it bollocks though Bob? It's actually encouraging to me that Cook is out there asking the question - gives me a bit more confidence that he at least is aware of the fact Hughes is failing.
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Beefymcfc » Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:21 am

Wonderwall wrote:I see sky are creating bollox about nothing to try and unsettle City

Manchester City have asked about the future of Guus Hiddink, according to the Russia manager's representative.

Current Eastlands boss Mark Hughes is under increasing pressure after his side slipped to eighth in the Premier League following Wednesday's defeat at Tottenham.

City were comfortably beaten 3-0 by Spurs at White Hart Lane to cast doubts over their top-four credentials and the security of their manager's job.

Hiddink, alongside Roberto Mancini and Jose Mourinho, has been installed among the favourites to replace Hughes if City owner Sheikh Mansour decides to act

And the Dutchman's agent, Cees Van Nieuwenhuizen, told the Daily Telegraph when asked if he has spoken to the English club's chief executive Garry Cook: "Yes, I did. (Beefy Edit) We talk all the time, but we did not talk about Guus, why would we?

Interviewer: Simple, because City want Guus as their manager.

"But Guus is happy with Russia. Definitely. I had a call because I have been working with Garry for 12 years since we worked together at Nike.

Discuss

"But I have received calls from all over the world about Guus. There has also been an approach from Juventus.

"He (Jean-Claude) asked me if it would be worthwhile having a meeting to discuss the future and what might happen next summer. But I told him that Guus was contracted to Russia.

"I said I didn't think it was worth having a meeting. Guus is very relaxed. He starts his holiday tomorrow and in January there are elections for a new president for the Russian Federation.

"He is contracted until next summer but there is an offer for him to stay for two more years, and I think he will definitely stay."

Van Nieuwenhuizen claims City did not go into detail regarding a potential role for Hiddink, adding: "I don't know because I said it was not worth discussing it because Guus was happy."

Reports suggest Hiddink, who performed excellently in guiding Chelsea to an FA Cup win as interim manager in the second half of last season, is prepared to consider his future in February.

If that was an accurate statement of events then it would seem that the board are making moves for next season. However, looking at the way it has been edited, it looks as if they are as you say, trying to unsettle us. Having a call from him seems more like it's from someone at Juve who wants a meeting and that Cook actually called him just because they are mates.

For me, Hiddink would be a good replacement if Hughes was shown the door, but why would a friend/colleague of Cook's let something like this slip, especially in line with the fact that we do all our business out of the public eye?
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Re: MARK HUGHES THREAD (all hughes opinions in here please)

Postby Socrates » Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:31 am

dikdik wrote:Surely it's the job of the manager to direct and motivate the players!? If they're not puttin in a shift then they're not being motivated.
In any organisation if the job is not being done then the manager takes the blame ultimately.
Or have I missed something?


You've missed the fact that some people are members of a cult where they confuse unwavering support for the incumbent manager with support for the club. Never knew sheep could be so vicious.
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