Players Who Would And Would Not Have Made It In Modern Game?

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

Arguments are always going that this and that player would and wouldn't have been stars in modern game because of this and that reason. But which of the STAR players do you think would've been equally great if not even better in modern game and which do you think would have been flops.

One fact that needs to be pointed here is that in average players run whopping four times more in English top flight these days compared to 80's.

Some players I think would've still been stars:
Pele - Always thought to epitomise Brazilian dribbling but in reality he was (from what I've gathered from old videos) classic centerforward who had it all. Skill in abundance but also pace and strength. Equally good in air as with ball on his feet.

Colin Bell - Again, from what I've gathered from videos and reading about him, a true all around midfielder who could run, shoot, pass and take care of himself as well.

Marco van Basten - Player with great strength, speed of thought and technical skill. He was one of the best around at the time but in modern era in faster game I feel he would've been second to none

Some players I think wouldn't have made it to VERY top:

Maradona - Fantistally talented with great vision and passing skills to die for. But I doubt he would've coped with the pace of the game and athletic nature of modern game. Would've been professional but not world star

Gazza - Pretty much same as Maradona. Gazza was stronger but those who remember him in prime and not just youtube collections know that he had bad tendency to go missing in games and basically just walk around the pitch when he wasn't up for it, for whatever reason.

Duncan Ferguson - Epitomises to world gone by and was last of his breed. Scared the shit out of defenders (for a good reason as well) and was good targetman in his prime. But modern game would simply pass him by and he was already struggling in the final years of his career.


I've got millions more to both category but wht do you people think?

[Dubciteh]

good topic cant think of many of my head but will do.

dont think kinky would be special in our team but thats a different argument!

[Kyle]

I agree with those. Pele also got hacked and kicked in every game he played in an attempt to stop him, now a days those would all be cards and I think he would be a little more protected.

For me maradona is a tough one. Part of me agrees with you completly, and the other part thinks that he would be just like messi in the modern game.

[Kladze]

Not sure if the 'they weren't athletic enough' argument really stands up Antti because if those players were around during modern times then surely they would have received the training to make them athletic enough - in which case players like Best, Maradonna, and Cruyff would still have bestrode our game like the 'kings' they were.

Of course, if you're just talking about transplanting them directly that's a different argument - and it's then debatable as to whether any of them would have made it.

[Cityfan]

The game is faster, forwards are better protected and hackers are more heavily punished.
I suspect many of the greats would be great in any era.
I disagree about Maradonna who I feel would have been better protected by referees and with is power and close control would ahve been even more effective. Gazza had these attributes but to a lesser extent.

The player who ghosts in and scores but contributes little else and does not creat etheir own chances seem to have disappeared from the game possibly because of better defenses so maybe players like Lineker and Gerd Muller would have been less prominent.

The hard men would maybe get sent off more so players like Souness Bremner Hunter and possibly our own Mick Doyle be less effective.

[Dunne's Half-Time Pint]

Some players I think wouldn't have made it to VERY top:

Maradona - Fantistally talented with great vision and passing skills to die for. But I doubt he would've coped with the pace of the game and athletic nature of modern game. Would've been professional but not world star.

Duncan Ferguson - Epitomises to world gone by and was last of his breed. Scared the shit out of defenders (for a good reason as well) and was good targetman in his prime. But modern game would simply pass him by and he was already struggling in the final years of his career.

I might use this quote once a disagreement. Maradona was on a different planet - if you honestly believe that the modern Prem, replete as it is with the giants of Hull, Wigan, Bolton, Pompey, Wolves... packed with footballing titans like Amdy Faye, Keith Andrews, Gary O'Neill and Zubar.... or whatever level you're talking about (the new look shit serie-A? The pace and verve of la Liga?) would have proved beyond him I despair.

The juxtaposition is superb as well - love the suggestion that "Big" Dunc did make it to the "VERY top".
Do you think that Lothar Matthaus and John Moncur would have struggled in their respective ascents to the summit of world football?

Duncan Ferguson:
Dundee - 077 (28)
Rangers - 014 0(2)
Everton - Loan 009 0(2)
Everton - 107 (35)
Newcastle - 030 0(8)
Everton - 123 (24)
Career - 360 (99)
Scotland - 7 (0)
Honours: FA Cup: 1- 1994-95

Diego Maradona:
Argentinos Juniors 167 (115)
Boca Juniors 40 (28)
FC Barcelona 36 (22)
Napoli 188 (81) - 1984-1991- In the arguably the greatest league ever; certainly one of the hardest to score in.
Sevilla 26 (5)
Newell's Old Boys 7 (0)
Boca Juniors 30 (7)
Career: 490 (258)
1977–1994 - Argentina 91 (34)
Honours:
* Argentina Boca Juniors
o Primera División: 1981

* Spain Barcelona
o Copa del Rey: 1983
o Copa de la Liga: 1983
o Spanish Super Cup: 1983

* Italy Napoli
o Serie A: 1987, 1990
o Coppa Italia: 1987
o UEFA Cup: 1989
o Italian Super Cup: 1990

World Cup - winner 1986; runner-up 1990.
Individual:

* Golden Ball for Best Player of the FIFA U-20 World Cup: 1979
* Argentine league Top Scorer: 1979, 1980, 1981
* Argentine Football Writers' Footballer of the Year: 1979, 1980, 1981, 1986
* South American Footballer of the Year (El Mundo, Caracas):1979, 1986, 1989, 1990, 1992
* Italian Guerin d'Oro: 1985
* Argentine Sports Writers' Sportsman of the Year: 1986
* Golden Ball for Best Player of the FIFA World Cup: 1986
* Best Footballer in the World Onze d'Or: 1986, 1987
* World Player of the Year (World Soccer Magazine): 1986
* Capocannoniere (Serie A top scorer): 1987-88
* Golden Ball for services to football (France Football): 1996
* Argentine Sports Writers' Sportsman of the Century: 1999
* FIFA best football player of the century: 2000

[Original Dub]

Some players I think wouldn't have made it to VERY top:

Maradona - Fantistally talented with great vision and passing skills to die for. But I doubt he would've coped with the pace of the game and athletic nature of modern game. Would've been professional but not world star.

Duncan Ferguson - Epitomises to world gone by and was last of his breed. Scared the shit out of defenders (for a good reason as well) and was good targetman in his prime. But modern game would simply pass him by and he was already struggling in the final years of his career.

I might use this quote once a disagreement. Maradona was on a different planet - if you honestly believe that the modern Prem, replete as it is with the giants of Hull, Wigan, Bolton, Pompey, Wolves... packed with footballing titans like Amdy Faye, Keith Andrews, Gary O'Neill and Zubar.... or whatever level you're talking about (the new look shit serie-A? The pace and verve of la Liga?) would have proved beyond him I despair.

The juxtaposition is superb as well - love the suggestion that "Big" Dunc did make it to the "VERY top".
Do you think that Lothar Matthaus and John Moncur would have struggled in their respective ascents to the summit of world football?

Duncan Ferguson:
Dundee - 077 (28)
Rangers - 014 0(2)
Everton - Loan 009 0(2)
Everton - 107 (35)
Newcastle - 030 0(8)
Everton - 123 (24)
Career - 360 (99)
Scotland - 7 (0)
Honours: FA Cup: 1- 1994-95

Diego Maradona:
Argentinos Juniors 167 (115)
Boca Juniors 40 (28)
FC Barcelona 36 (22)
Napoli 188 (81) - 1984-1991- In the arguably the greatest league ever; certainly one of the hardest to score in.
Sevilla 26 (5)
Newell's Old Boys 7 (0)
Boca Juniors 30 (7)
Career: 490 (258)
1977–1994 - Argentina 91 (34)
Honours:
* Argentina Boca Juniors
o Primera División: 1981

* Spain Barcelona
o Copa del Rey: 1983
o Copa de la Liga: 1983
o Spanish Super Cup: 1983

* Italy Napoli
o Serie A: 1987, 1990
o Coppa Italia: 1987
o UEFA Cup: 1989
o Italian Super Cup: 1990

World Cup - winner 1986; runner-up 1990.
Individual:

* Golden Ball for Best Player of the FIFA U-20 World Cup: 1979
* Argentine league Top Scorer: 1979, 1980, 1981
* Argentine Football Writers' Footballer of the Year: 1979, 1980, 1981, 1986
* South American Footballer of the Year (El Mundo, Caracas):1979, 1986, 1989, 1990, 1992
* Italian Guerin d'Oro: 1985
* Argentine Sports Writers' Sportsman of the Year: 1986
* Golden Ball for Best Player of the FIFA World Cup: 1986
* Best Footballer in the World Onze d'Or: 1986, 1987
* World Player of the Year (World Soccer Magazine): 1986
* Capocannoniere (Serie A top scorer): 1987-88
* Golden Ball for services to football (France Football): 1996
* Argentine Sports Writers' Sportsman of the Century: 1999
* FIFA best football player of the century: 2000

Big Dunc wins hands down mate.

No fucking contest, take your head out of your arse DHTP.

[Dunne's Half-Time Pint]

Big Dunc wins hands down mate.

No fucking contest, take your head out of your arse DHTP.

It's the juxtaposition that's so funny - two men who both reached the very top of the world game.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

Some players I think wouldn't have made it to VERY top:

Maradona - Fantistally talented with great vision and passing skills to die for. But I doubt he would've coped with the pace of the game and athletic nature of modern game. Would've been professional but not world star.

Duncan Ferguson - Epitomises to world gone by and was last of his breed. Scared the shit out of defenders (for a good reason as well) and was good targetman in his prime. But modern game would simply pass him by and he was already struggling in the final years of his career.

I might use this quote once a disagreement. Maradona was on a different planet - if you honestly believe that the modern Prem, replete as it is with the giants of Hull, Wigan, Bolton, Pompey, Wolves... packed with footballing titans like Amdy Faye, Keith Andrews, Gary O'Neill and Zubar.... or whatever level you're talking about (the new look shit serie-A? The pace and verve of la Liga?) would have proved beyond him I despair.

The juxtaposition is superb as well - love the suggestion that "Big" Dunc did make it to the "VERY top".
Do you think that Lothar Matthaus and John Moncur would have struggled in their respective ascents to the summit of world football?

Duncan Ferguson:
Dundee - 077 (28)
Rangers - 014 0(2)
Everton - Loan 009 0(2)
Everton - 107 (35)
Newcastle - 030 0(8)
Everton - 123 (24)
Career - 360 (99)
Scotland - 7 (0)
Honours: FA Cup: 1- 1994-95

Diego Maradona:
Argentinos Juniors 167 (115)
Boca Juniors 40 (28)
FC Barcelona 36 (22)
Napoli 188 (81) - 1984-1991- In the arguably the greatest league ever; certainly one of the hardest to score in.
Sevilla 26 (5)
Newell's Old Boys 7 (0)
Boca Juniors 30 (7)
Career: 490 (258)
1977–1994 - Argentina 91 (34)
Honours:
* Argentina Boca Juniors
o Primera División: 1981

* Spain Barcelona
o Copa del Rey: 1983
o Copa de la Liga: 1983
o Spanish Super Cup: 1983

* Italy Napoli
o Serie A: 1987, 1990
o Coppa Italia: 1987
o UEFA Cup: 1989
o Italian Super Cup: 1990

World Cup - winner 1986; runner-up 1990.
Individual:

* Golden Ball for Best Player of the FIFA U-20 World Cup: 1979
* Argentine league Top Scorer: 1979, 1980, 1981
* Argentine Football Writers' Footballer of the Year: 1979, 1980, 1981, 1986
* South American Footballer of the Year (El Mundo, Caracas):1979, 1986, 1989, 1990, 1992
* Italian Guerin d'Oro: 1985
* Argentine Sports Writers' Sportsman of the Year: 1986
* Golden Ball for Best Player of the FIFA World Cup: 1986
* Best Footballer in the World Onze d'Or: 1986, 1987
* World Player of the Year (World Soccer Magazine): 1986
* Capocannoniere (Serie A top scorer): 1987-88
* Golden Ball for services to football (France Football): 1996
* Argentine Sports Writers' Sportsman of the Century: 1999
* FIFA best football player of the century: 2000

Oh come on. I wasn't comparing them FFS. To make it more clear, I think Maradona would be playing his football in average team in one of the better leagues and would be alright player for Argentina but would not be match for likes of Messi and Tranaldo in very top of the world game. Duncan Ferguson would laying bricks and playing Sunday League.

[bluej]

Ferguson only retired a few years ago didn't he, so I can't see how much the game has changed since then. There's no difference between him and Kevin Davies playing now really.

Good topic though, I think someone mentioned Kinkladze further up the thread, it would have been interesting to see him these days with the better protection afforded to him.

[Dunne's Half-Time Pint]

Oh come on. I wasn't comparing them FFS. To make it more clear, I think Maradona would be playing his football in average team in one of the better leagues and would be alright player for Argentina but would not be match for likes of Messi and Tranaldo in very top of the world game. Duncan Ferguson would laying bricks and playing Sunday League.

Maradona: Would've been professional but not world star

- this should be the end of your credibility.

Didn't say you'd 'compared' them. You've placed them together under the same heading - absurd for any number of reasons - inviting the comparison. Comic juxtaposition yeah:

Some players I think wouldn't have made it to VERY top:

Maradona - Fantistally talented with great vision and passing skills to die for. But I doubt he would've coped with the pace of the game and athletic nature of modern game. Would've been professional but not world star

Duncan Ferguson - Epitomises to world gone by and was last of his breed. Scared the shit out of defenders (for a good reason as well) and was good targetman in his prime. But modern game would simply pass him by and he was already struggling in the final years of his career.

[fangsanalsatan]

NQDP, from what I've seen/read Maradona had natural pace and strength in abundance. In his prime he was unstoppable. He'd be the daddy today, no doubt.

[gillie]

Pele best player in any age imo he was so far in front in his pomp he could stroll it even now.Pele best i have ever seen FACT.

[Ted Hughes]

Obviously players are more like highly tuned athletes now but I think one thing people tend to forget is the different pitches that the old boys used to play on, the toll that takes on the body along with the physical nature of the challenges they used to endure week in week out & the different equipment used. For that reason, I think many of the players of the past would be a similar level in today's game as they were then, they'd just be fitter & adapt. The cloggers, like Nobby Stiles, would be the ones to really lose out because everything they did would be a foul.

Bell, Maradona, Best, Cruyff etc would all be stars just the same imo. Bobby Moore would be a world class version of John Terry & Carvalho put together without the need to Rugby tackle & better at football. Francis Lee would be Tevez as he is in this current spell but with a harder shot.

Paddy Crerand would be overrated shite & Jack Charlton would get the piss taken out of him.

[BobbyJ1956]

Who from the old days would still make it to the top? Pele, yes. Beckenbauer. Probably Zola. From City players, Colin Bell (superbly fit), and to the nearly top Mike Summerbee and Dave Watson are the first ones to come to mind. But this thread is full of talk about "Big Dunc" and I laughed when I saw it's about Duncan Ferguson. Give over, there was and will only ever be one Big Dunc and that was the incomparable Duncan Edwards who would have made it to the top in any age in any country and possibly in any sport involving strength, brilliant skills, and great heart. His tragic early death was the greatest single loss English football has ever suffered. OK, most folk on here are too young to have seen him play, but then you never watched Olivier act or heard Edith Piaf sing either.

[BlueinBosnia]

Jarizinho
Duncan Edwards
Ferenc Puskas
Most GKs

Would have made it for definite

[Fidel Castro]

Maradona would still be the dogs bollocks.
What about Garrincha? Some Dutch guy made a documentary about him a few years back, he looked bloody amazing.

[Dunne's Half-Time Pint]

Maradona would still be the dogs bollocks.
What about Garrincha? Some Dutch guy made a documentary about him a few years back, he looked bloody amazing.

Brazil did not lose a single game in which he and Pele played - supposed to have been a staggering player. That said, he had polio as a youngster (or some such) and had a wonky leg... he'd be better than fuckin Jo. that's certain.

[Ted Hughes]

Maradona would still be the dogs bollocks.
What about Garrincha? Some Dutch guy made a documentary about him a few years back, he looked bloody amazing.

Brazil did not lose a single game in which he and Pele played - supposed to have been a staggering player. That said, he had polio as a youngster (or some such) and had a wonky leg... he'd be better than fuckin Jo. that's certain.

He could make the footballs they had in those days fly like a missile. God knows what he could do with the things they use now.

[BlueinBosnia]

Maradona would still be the dogs bollocks.
What about Garrincha? Some Dutch guy made a documentary about him a few years back, he looked bloody amazing.

Garrincha (I forgot his name) was one I'd say would be iffy. Barton's background, Merton's lifestyle.