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This is a club in freefall and the similaraties with the shite are obvious.
Living on past success, in debt over their heads, low on confidence with foreign owners who would love to turn the clock back to a time when investing in 'soccer' was low on the adgenda.

liverpool have always been regarded as a member of 'the top 4' but the current calls for rafa's head indicates this season they will lose that mantle. Their fans can see this, so can the media, but whats the mood of their best players? i.e. Gerrard & Torres.
Is gerrard so scouse that he would only ever play for them or would the time come when he would consider moving on?
A tough one but maybe the club would be the prime mover, rather than the player, if confronted with an amout they couldn't turn down!

Torres, on the other hand, has no reason to habour any such loyalties and could be more open to moving on.

With rafa's position becoming more precarious by the week I can't see him endorsing the sale of either atm and if he did get the chop the new man wouldn't either but by seasons end if they fail to qualify for europe can anyone not see both players ripe for the picking?
Surely Torres could be aquired for the right money in the summer if we finished in the top 4 and I would imagine if gerrard was targeted he and his employers would be receptive to a substantial bid.

I would love both but would be happy with either! Is this just a pipe dream or could this really be on the cards?

Only clubs that could afford Torres are Barca, Real, Chelski and us I think.
Don't think he would move to Real due to his Atletico past (but that didn't stop two-faced Raul), Barca have already got Zlatan but maybe they will sell him on if they could get Torres?, so I think that leaves us and Chelski as favourites.

Not sure about Gerrard. He's been pretty poor this season and although definitely not past it, think he has had his best time especially with all the injuries he had early on in his career. Bound to take it's toll on his body sooner or later

Certainly not now...in the summer? Depending on where us and them finish...if we finish top 4 and they finish in 5th 6th 7th whatever...then there might be a chance

I disagree with what you said about Torres btw...he seems very loyal to the scousers so it would be more difficult then you think

IanBishopsHaircut wrote:I disagree with what you said about Torres btw...he seems very loyal to the scousers so it would be more difficult then you think

2 words: Kaka. Milan.

IanBishopsHaircut wrote:Certainly not now...in the summer? Depending on where us and them finish...if we finish top 4 and they finish in 5th 6th 7th whatever...then there might be a chance

I disagree with what you said about Torres btw...he seems very loyal to the scousers so it would be more difficult then you think

He allegedly said he would have to consider his future stay if they werent in champions league and looked like they couldnt compete.

£75m and champions league football should get you both Villa and Torres in the summer - might be the thing that finally prises Villa from Valencia. mmmmmmmm.

I really wouldnt give Liverpool a silly amount for Torres. Not enough where they could really strenghen the rest of their team and become a force again. Plus, Torres has been injured loads lately,another Owen type player? No point having world class players that are injured all the time.

I think we're very close to a position where the worlds best see us as a viable option.
Torres has never been in the position he's faced with now in his time at liverpool, a situation where he's resigned to playing domestic football next season for a club on the decline.
I think the player would relish the challenge and their owners would find a 50 million+ bid almost impossible to turn down!

We could give them Benjani in part exchange ;-)

Fidel Castro wrote:Only clubs that could afford Torres are Barca, Real, Chelski and us I think.
Don't think he would move to Real due to his Atletico past (but that didn't stop two-faced Raul), Barca have already got Zlatan but maybe they will sell him on if they could get Torres?, so I think that leaves us and Chelski as favourites.

Not sure about Gerrard. He's been pretty poor this season and although definitely not past it, think he has had his best time especially with all the injuries he had early on in his career. Bound to take it's toll on his body sooner or later

Gerrard has been and still is, one of, if not the greatest midfielders to play in the Premiership.

You aren't the first person to say they wouldn't be sure about signing Gerrard and I still can't get my head round the fact that any City fan is turning their noses up at the prospect of signing him (even though it's never going to happen). Madness.

Gerrard will never leave Liverpool for another English club. He will go down in history as a Liverpool legend.If he moves to us, all that will be flushed down the drain. It wont happen and Im not at all bothered about it.

M147WN wrote:
We could give them Benjani in part exchange ;-)

Took the words out of my mouth, although I would throw in big Phil, Bojinov and RSC for good measure. Joking aside, it would probably do them some good not to have the reliance on Torres

Dazzacity wrote:Gerrard will never leave Liverpool for another English club. He will go down in history as a Liverpool legend.If he moves to us, all that will be flushed down the drain. It wont happen and Im not at all bothered about it.

He was already a liverpool legend when he was going to Chelsea.

He changed his mind as he felt the club were still moving forwards back then in 2004, and he was right, he won the Champions League the year after. By the very same reasoning, there must be a lot of clubs on the phone to his agent right now stirring it up.

Something I've never seen before happened with Gerrard tonight. Earlyish in the game, he hit a real stinker of a pass straight to a Reading player. Usually, even when half fit, if he does that he's like Rooney; he charges after them & tries to get the ball back even if it means kicking them up in the air. On this occasion he stood still & his shoulders slumped down.

Dazzacity wrote:Gerrard will never leave Liverpool for another English club. He will go down in history as a Liverpool legend.If he moves to us, all that will be flushed down the drain. It wont happen and Im not at all bothered about it.

I know what you're saying Dazza about him being to Liverpool what JT is to chelsea but imo if you don't ask you don't get.

Imagine Macini's problem of having to pick 2 from Torres, Ade or Tevez being fed by Bellers, Gerrard, Rob et al.
The stike force would be globally second to none! And the midfield wouldn't be bad either!

M147WN wrote:

Dazzacity wrote:Gerrard will never leave Liverpool for another English club. He will go down in history as a Liverpool legend.If he moves to us, all that will be flushed down the drain. It wont happen and Im not at all bothered about it.

I know what you're saying Dazza about him being to Liverpool what JT is to chelsea but imo if you don't ask you don't get.

Imagine Macini's problem of having to pick 2 from Torres, Ade or Tevez being fed by Bellers, Gerrard, Rob et al.
The stike force would be globally second to none! And the midfield wouldn't be bad either!

I'm not absolutely sure they would criticise him if he moved now provided he didn't agitate for the move. If Liverpool accepted a bid I think it's possible the fans may wish him well & be glad they can buy several players with the money, so long as Rafa's not the bloke who gets to spend it!

Benitez has had the time to shape his team, a shedload of money, he's chopped and changed, and whats he left with? he lets a TOP player in Alonso go after publicly courting Barry(not in Alonso's class, sorry) throws his dummy out when left with Keane, who wanted to play for the club, and walked away from spurs to do it when he was loved there. He sells Keane at a big loss, Bellamy(who also wanted to stay) and Crouch, ALL of whom could have supported Torres at varying stages of the campaign, both this season and last. He hasn't utilised players like Benayoun, a fine player, always trying to make things happen, but somehow always marginalised. He has bought untold average spaniards and south americans, paid WAY over the odds for Riera, good crosser, not much else, not for our league anyway, then blowing a suitcase full on Aquilani, whos an Italian version of Lucas, exhausting the cash reserves so he's left selling players he bought and under-used to bring in players on the cheap who mayor may not make the grade. Liverpool fans slaughter the owners but theyve backed Benitez with more cash in real terms than the leprechauns at the swamp. Benitez has gone through a fucking fortune and arguably is left with a weaker pool of players than when he arrived. Take the Champions league title away, take the contract away, and he'd be going back to spain right now. He should resign.

Bianchi on Ice wrote:Benitez has had the time to shape his team, a shedload of money, he's chopped and changed, and whats he left with? he lets a TOP player in Alonso go after publicly courting Barry(not in Alonso's class, sorry) throws his dummy out when left with Keane, who wanted to play for the club, and walked away from spurs to do it when he was loved there. He sells Keane at a big loss, Bellamy(who also wanted to stay) and Crouch, ALL of whom could have supported Torres at varying stages of the campaign, both this season and last. He hasn't utilised players like Benayoun, a fine player, always trying to make things happen, but somehow always marginalised. He has bought untold average spaniards and south americans, paid WAY over the odds for Riera, good crosser, not much else, not for our league anyway, then blowing a suitcase full on Aquilani, whos an Italian version of Lucas, exhausting the cash reserves so he's left selling players he bought and under-used to bring in players on the cheap who mayor may not make the grade. Liverpool fans slaughter the owners but theyve backed Benitez with more cash in real terms than the leprechauns at the swamp. Benitez has gone through a fucking fortune and arguably is left with a weaker pool of players than when he arrived. Take the Champions league title away, take the contract away, and he'd be going back to spain right now. He should resign.

Great post, its what I would have said if I could be arsed writing that much lol ;)

Bianchi on Ice wrote:Benitez has had the time to shape his team, a shedload of money, he's chopped and changed, and whats he left with? he lets a TOP player in Alonso go after publicly courting Barry(not in Alonso's class, sorry) throws his dummy out when left with Keane, who wanted to play for the club, and walked away from spurs to do it when he was loved there. He sells Keane at a big loss, Bellamy(who also wanted to stay) and Crouch, ALL of whom could have supported Torres at varying stages of the campaign, both this season and last. He hasn't utilised players like Benayoun, a fine player, always trying to make things happen, but somehow always marginalised. He has bought untold average spaniards and south americans, paid WAY over the odds for Riera, good crosser, not much else, not for our league anyway, then blowing a suitcase full on Aquilani, whos an Italian version of Lucas, exhausting the cash reserves so he's left selling players he bought and under-used to bring in players on the cheap who mayor may not make the grade. Liverpool fans slaughter the owners but theyve backed Benitez with more cash in real terms than the leprechauns at the swamp. Benitez has gone through a fucking fortune and arguably is left with a weaker pool of players than when he arrived. Take the Champions league title away, take the contract away, and he'd be going back to spain right now. He should resign.

Great post mate.

he shouldn't resign. he should be fired.

Liverpool always runs to a budget and they forecast long cup runs into that little money pot. This is a time when Liverpool as very cash strapped and looking for investors all over the globe. The set backs this season are going to seriously damage any potential investment as they will be using the teams success as a bargaining tool.

No Champs league revenue
No Carling Cup revenue
No FA Cup revenue

they are in serious trouble when it comes to buying in class players also.

As I said in the last thread about us taking Torres and Gerrard, Liverpool can keep their crocks for me. The pair of them spend more time injured than they do playing, it just isn't worth it. If we are in the market for a world class striker then I'd prefer Villa or Aguero. A fit, on form Torres is an incredible sight however you see it so rarely that it actually upsets your planning.