NDJ

[mcfc1632]

Nigel De Jong shouldn't be anywhere near our starting 11 unless we're away against a top team, or 2 or 3 goals in front in a game and need somebody to sit in front of the defence. Why oh why mancini felt the need to play 451 at home, after going for an attacking 442 away at Fulham I don't know. He seems to think that playing defensively works for us, it doesn't. we are best when we're attacking, and for this season alone, while we have these personnel he should play to the score one more than you approach. What does my nut in about De Jong is how when one of our defenders or midfielders has the ball he goes and stands next to them asking for it, then does a one, two. whats the fucking point? get in space, free yourself up, be fucking useful. fuck me.

Absolutely spot on. I don't actually mind if DeJong plays in home games against teams who are going to play 'open' against us, so long as he's one of 2 not 3 but playing him against dour teams just drags us down to their level. I'd prefer not to have a player like that most of the time.

Why don't Barry or Ireland come & take the ball off defenders & start off moves instead? That's what similar players in top teams do.

2 posters that I agree with so often - but I cannot understand their comments on this - good question: why the MF are not more creative - and why they do not take the ball onwards etc - the answer used to be because we just hoofed it over them because we were being overrun all the time - the thing that NDJ stopped - and every time he does not play - or has an off game - guess what happens!!!! - better fix the real problems before removing the the finger from the dyke

Arteta and Cahill made him look a spare part last night, which effectively meant we sacrificed playing a forward for nothing. During the early part of the game when we were on top, had RSC been on the pitch and we had someone to aim at, I believe we would have scored and made it a very different game. Ultimately, Ireland and Barry do not complement De Jong as one is totally immobile and the other is badly out of sorts (even taking into account last nights thuggery) so it is mental to play such a disfunctional trio. Maybe thats more Mancini's fault than De Jong's.

Midfield balance aside, I watched them warming up one game before xmas, and they were playing in a little box with one/two touch pass & move. De Jong lost/panicked into a poor pass which cost his side the ball on every single occasion he got it. His distribution, particularly under pressure is simply not good enough, and whilst running round the pitch putting in big tackles curries favour from fans like it did with Zabaleta, it seems those who are into that sort of thing makes the player impervious from criticism.

I dont think he is a poor player, I just dont believe a hard man who can't pass or get forward is appropriate or relevant at the top level of football any more.

If we had a front 5 which went gung ho attacking like Real Madrid's 'galacticos' or even 4 out & out attackers & a Roy K**** type player I could see a role for him but not at home alongside Barry & Ireland (who looks nowhere near good enough incidentally). If we're going to have a player like that then I'd rather he was 6ft6 & fast as fuck anyway personally.

....well I agree - but if the logic is right - then the thread should be about replacing Barry and Ireland should'nt it - when we have players that cann spring attack - then we can get rid of the DM perhaps

[mcfc1632]

Nigel De Jong shouldn't be anywhere near our starting 11 unless we're away against a top team, or 2 or 3 goals in front in a game and need somebody to sit in front of the defence. Why oh why mancini felt the need to play 451 at home, after going for an attacking 442 away at Fulham I don't know. He seems to think that playing defensively works for us, it doesn't. we are best when we're attacking, and for this season alone, while we have these personnel he should play to the score one more than you approach. What does my nut in about De Jong is how when one of our defenders or midfielders has the ball he goes and stands next to them asking for it, then does a one, two. whats the fucking point? get in space, free yourself up, be fucking useful. fuck me.

Absolutely spot on. I don't actually mind if DeJong plays in home games against teams who are going to play 'open' against us, so long as he's one of 2 not 3 but playing him against dour teams just drags us down to their level. I'd prefer not to have a player like that most of the time.

Why don't Barry or Ireland come & take the ball off defenders & start off moves instead? That's what similar players in top teams do.

2 posters that I agree with so often - but I cannot understand their comments on this - good question: why the MF are not more creative - and why they do not take the ball onwards etc - the answer used to be because we just hoofed it over them because we were being overrun all the time - the thing that NDJ stopped - and every time he does not play - or has an off game - guess what happens!!!! - better fix the real problems before removing the the finger from the dyke

Mate, when NDJ isn't on the pitch, we attack. we don't need anyone doing his work, because we're bombarding the opposition. Having NDJ on the field invites the oppo onto us. Thats where it fucks up.

...but we are not bombarding the opposition! - when did we do that?? I do not have this memory of Mancini's team bombarding anyone - we need better/ creative MFs - that is the issue

[Lees Alter Ego]

Just out of interest i went through all the league games de jong hadnt started in. I found a total of 7. We won 5 of these an drew 2, losing zero.....

[horlock2000]

I suppose this is a valid point but the blame for our lack of midfield should be centred on one person...GARETH BAHe has been useless for the best part of the season and desperately needs dropping as his performances havent been consistently nowhere near as good as they should be!

He a crack player but we have only seen very few glimpses and he should be our midfield linch pin...after all...this is why we signed him!

[carl_feedthegoat]

Just out of interest i went through all the league games de jong hadnt started in. I found a total of 7. We won 5 of these an drew 2, losing zero.....

Interesting stat.
Ive said it a million times,NDJ should only be in the team when a point is a good enough result. He is fucking PAP when we need to attack and win as he SLOWS play up all the fucking time...he,s such a one dimensional fucking pain in the arse.

Im sick of him and do not see him as a first team player next season.....

[Lees Alter Ego]

Just out of interest i went through all the league games de jong hadnt started in. I found a total of 7. We won 5 of these an drew 2, losing zero.....

Interesting stat.
Ive said it a million times,NDJ should only be in the team when a point is a good enough result. He is fucking PAP when we need to attack and win as he SLOWS play up all the fucking time...he,s such a one dimensional fucking pain in the arse.

Im sick of him and do not see him as a first team player next season.....

So when he starts we would have Won 9 drawn 9 lost 5 - average points per game 1.56

Without him average points per game - 2.42

[carl_feedthegoat]

Just out of interest i went through all the league games de jong hadnt started in. I found a total of 7. We won 5 of these an drew 2, losing zero.....

Interesting stat.
Ive said it a million times,NDJ should only be in the team when a point is a good enough result. He is fucking PAP when we need to attack and win as he SLOWS play up all the fucking time...he,s such a one dimensional fucking pain in the arse.

Im sick of him and do not see him as a first team player next season.....

So when he starts we would have Won 9 drawn 9 lost 5 - average points per game 1.56

Without him average points per game - 2.42

You have to change your avatar mate....it,s just not right.

[Bingo Lewis]

Just out of interest i went through all the league games de jong hadnt started in. I found a total of 7. We won 5 of these an drew 2, losing zero.....

Interesting stat.
Ive said it a million times,NDJ should only be in the team when a point is a good enough result. He is fucking PAP when we need to attack and win as he SLOWS play up all the fucking time...he,s such a one dimensional fucking pain in the arse.

Im sick of him and do not see him as a first team player next season.....

So when he starts we would have Won 9 drawn 9 lost 5 - average points per game 1.56

Without him average points per game - 2.42

Couldn't be any clearer could it? We are better off without De Jong.
Come on you lot who back him, argue against that.

[getdressedmctavish]

Here's why I think he is unnecessary. We have Barry who is Englands holding Mf. He holds but he is capable of getting forwards, shooting, heading a goal, crossing and playing a penetrative pass, as well as tackling and playing a short square ball when necessary.A bloke who only does a third of the job and who in my op is poor at that is totally surplus to requirements and I believe we will see fewer of these players not more. Football is moving on and teams need 11 footballers to reach the top.

[CityGer]

I appreciate his effort and never say die spirit but he is just too one dimensional to play in a 4-4-2 or as part of midfield with Barry in a 3. He doesn't offer enough in a creative sense and unless your pairing him with two attacking players such as Sneider and Van Der Vart, as is the case with Holland, then we're hindered in an attacking sense before the game even kicks off.

We need to shell out whatever it takes to get De Rossi in the sumer who can do Nige's job but offer something going forward both in terms of creativity and goal scoring.

[Mr Miyagi]

He lacks the intelligence to play the role. It needs a football brain as well as the ability to tackle.

The job of the holding midfielder is to protect the back 4. The problem with NDJ is he doesn't do it properly. He goes tearing around the pitch and leaves the zone unprotected where he should be. Remember Rooney wandering freely in front of our back four in the semi final? It happens time again.

He needs to keep a level head and read the game. I don't think he is capable of doing that. He has a rush of blood to the head and gets dragged out of position.

[Lees Alter Ego]

Just out of interest i went through all the league games de jong hadnt started in. I found a total of 7. We won 5 of these an drew 2, losing zero.....

Interesting stat.
Ive said it a million times,NDJ should only be in the team when a point is a good enough result. He is fucking PAP when we need to attack and win as he SLOWS play up all the fucking time...he,s such a one dimensional fucking pain in the arse.

Im sick of him and do not see him as a first team player next season.....

So when he starts we would have Won 9 drawn 9 lost 5 - average points per game 1.56

Without him average points per game - 2.42

You have to change your avatar mate....it,s just not right.

ha whys that. Its blue and got a city shirt in the background. Fitting id say. maybe one day......

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[King Kev]

This debate reminds me of when we had Paul Bosvelt at the club.

This site was split pretty much 50/50 over whether he was a good player or a useless piece of shit, I was in the camp that thought the latter.
However, I decided to give him another chance and to watch him and assess his performances objectively. I tried to understand the job he was doing and how it helped the team out. I then realised that he was an important part of the team and that his work was allowing other players to be more effective in their roles.

When he left I shook his hand and thanked him for all he had done for us.

[Bingo Lewis]

This debate reminds me of when we had Paul Bosvelt at the club.

This site was split pretty much 50/50 over whether he was a good player or a useless piece of shit, I was in the camp that thought the latter.
However, I decided to give him another chance and to watch him and assess his performances objectively. I tried to understand the job he was doing and how it helped the team out. I then realised that he was an important part of the team and that his work was allowing other players to be more effective in their roles.

When he left I shook his hand and thanked him for all he had done for us.

Its not De Jong thats the problem. He is a good player, but he should only be played in certain games, and at certain times. If we didn't have Barry, and had two skillful attackminded CM's, then De Jong would be perfect to play alongside them, but as it is, De Jong stifles Barry's game. Barry is England's best DM, and in reality he is ours too. Our best midfield three if all are fit is

----------Barry

Ireland-------M Johnson

but unfortunately Ireland hasn't been up to it, and Jonno is a sicknote, so De Jong has played in Barry's best position, and Barry has been moved into another one to replace Johnson, and in my opinion that is why he's had some bad performances this season, and people have been saying he's shite.

I would sell De Jong this summer whilst other teams hold him in high regard, and get VDV and another skillful CM in and let Barry sit.

[Lees Alter Ego]

This debate reminds me of when we had Paul Bosvelt at the club.

This site was split pretty much 50/50 over whether he was a good player or a useless piece of shit, I was in the camp that thought the latter.
However, I decided to give him another chance and to watch him and assess his performances objectively. I tried to understand the job he was doing and how it helped the team out. I then realised that he was an important part of the team and that his work was allowing other players to be more effective in their roles.

When he left I shook his hand and thanked him for all he had done for us.

Its not De Jong thats the problem. He is a good player, but he should only be played in certain games, and at certain times. If we didn't have Barry, and had two skillful attackminded CM's, then De Jong would be perfect to play alongside them, but as it is, De Jong stifles Barry's game. Barry is England's best DM, and in reality he is ours too. Our best midfield three if all are fit is

----------Barry

Ireland-------M Johnson

but unfortunately Ireland hasn't been up to it, and Jonno is a sicknote, so De Jong has played in Barry's best position, and Barry has been moved into another one to replace Johnson, and in my opinion that is why he's had some bad performances this season, and people have been saying he's shite.

I would sell De Jong this summer whilst other teams hold him in high regard, and get VDV and another skillful CM in and let Barry sit.

Absolutely spot on that for me. Although i wouldnt sell De jong as he is a useful asset to have esp if Barry were to get injured. Hes only young as well so not like age is against him.

He does stifle Barrys game. It is not a coincidence that Barry has his best games when NDJ isnt in the side. Barry is not an never will be a attacking midfielder, but with NDJ in the side he has to play a different role and get forward much more than he would in the DM role like he plays for england for example.

[brite blu sky]

This debate reminds me of when we had Paul Bosvelt at the club.

This site was split pretty much 50/50 over whether he was a good player or a useless piece of shit, I was in the camp that thought the latter.
However, I decided to give him another chance and to watch him and assess his performances objectively. I tried to understand the job he was doing and how it helped the team out. I then realised that he was an important part of the team and that his work was allowing other players to be more effective in their roles.

When he left I shook his hand and thanked him for all he had done for us.

Its not De Jong thats the problem. He is a good player, but he should only be played in certain games, and at certain times. If we didn't have Barry, and had two skillful attackminded CM's, then De Jong would be perfect to play alongside them, but as it is, De Jong stifles Barry's game. Barry is England's best DM, and in reality he is ours too. Our best midfield three if all are fit is

----------Barry

Ireland-------M Johnson

but unfortunately Ireland hasn't been up to it, and Jonno is a sicknote, so De Jong has played in Barry's best position, and Barry has been moved into another one to replace Johnson, and in my opinion that is why he's had some bad performances this season, and people have been saying he's shite.

I would sell De Jong this summer whilst other teams hold him in high regard, and get VDV and another skillful CM in and let Barry sit.

Bang on the money Bingo, not sure about selling him, but you have a point about selling while the stock is high.

It wouldn't necessarily leave us short, as Kompany can also come in to that position if Baz was injured or we needed a more defensive stance. But we would buy someone to replace him anyway.
I suppose the only thing to consider would be if we have CL football... in which case i could see NDJ being useful in that campaign where you dont know the opposition as well and it pays to be cautious in away games in outer Kasakstan etc

[the_georgian_genius]

and people still think Mark Hughes was good for this club. He had a blank cheque book and chose to but Gareth Barry and Nigel De Jong, both decent individual players but not a good midfield.

Forget right back or centre half, centre midfield is our number one target in the summer.

[Mase]

Just like to confirm to everyone again that Gaz Baz is not and never has been a 'defensive' midfielder.

Thanks.

[Lees Alter Ego]

Just like to confirm to everyone again that Gaz Baz is not and never has been a 'defensive' midfielder.

Thanks.

Could you please confirm to me what he is and always will be then please.

Thnaks

[Mase]

Just like to confirm to everyone again that Gaz Baz is not and never has been a 'defensive' midfielder.

Thanks.

Could you please confirm to me what he is and always will be then please.

Thnaks

A central midfielder. Neither does he play defensive mid for England.

Thnaks