The Yaya Toure 'Munich' song

[ronk]

Just watching a shit Irish TV show called Katherine Lynch's Wagon's Den.

She fancies herself as a bit of a comedian - she just said her mother had all her teeth taken out, but it was fine because she's a hooker... then she said "50 euro and you get more head than Lady Di's dashboard".

When the audience gasped and groaned she said "Its a joke, relax. Comedy is tragedy plus time, its 15 years ago, get over it".

I'm not sure what side of the argument this helps, or if it helps at all, I just found it relevant to thread so I thought I'd share!

You also picked probably the worst of all Irish TV at the moment, someone whose whole show is built around being irritating and offensive.

[Original Dub]

Just watching a shit Irish TV show called Katherine Lynch's Wagon's Den.

She fancies herself as a bit of a comedian - she just said her mother had all her teeth taken out, but it was fine because she's a hooker... then she said "50 euro and you get more head than Lady Di's dashboard".

When the audience gasped and groaned she said "Its a joke, relax. Comedy is tragedy plus time, its 15 years ago, get over it".

I'm not sure what side of the argument this helps, or if it helps at all, I just found it relevant to thread so I thought I'd share!

You also picked probably the worst of all Irish TV at the moment, someone whose whole show is built around being irritating and offensive.

Well I didn't "pick" it so much as had it on in the background. I think she's a fucking idiot, but I found it kind of relevant to this thread, in that her reasoning was that comedy was tragedy plus time. The fact that it was years ago means fuck all really IMO.

I will say one thing, no matter how much I hate our supporters giving the media fuel to make us look like scumbags, the media themselves are really milking this at this stage. Cunts.

The point remains the same, no matter how you feel towards the word Munich itself - the media are all over us on the subject now and its a battle we can't win by being persistant, unlike the ongoing battle we have because of the money.

It has to stop or the world will take note and that'd be a fucking travesty, given the unique sense of genuine humour most of our fans have.

[twosips]

Spot on - I fucking loved the sight of City fans at Wembley. An arena we deserve. The stadium had never seen anything like the poznan. I want our fans to be know for things like that world wide. Not this...

[Wonderwall]

Just finished watching blue moon rising and the footage of the carling cup semi final clearly shows utd fans doing aeroplane signs to city fans. Double fucking standards, stop being such whinging twats, if it winds the red shite up, give it to em.

Fucking despise them. and being politically correct is pure bollocks in this situation.

[john68]

Let's start by dealing with the assumptions you make about my opinion.
1...I have made NO criticism of your moral view or opinion about the rights and wrongs of using the Munich term in any way. In fact, I made it abundantly clear that I respected your opinion and your right to hold it.
2...I have NOT at any point suggested that "if the rags do it, it is right for us to do it". Please don't attribute shite like that to me, unless I actually said it...Ta.
3...I NEVER said that City fans were the only fans not allowed to chant horrible things....again you just made that up.
4...NOR did I say that the media were picking on us without reason...yet another thing you wrongly attributed to me.
If you want to discover what I really think, please simply read what I have posted and simply stick with the words I have used without changing them, warping their meaning or altering the context....Thanks mate.

Now then, having got that out of the way, to the points in question...Let me ask why you feel that you cannot answer for the rags...(nor be expected to) nor can you answer for the media...(nor can you be expected top)...but feel that you can answer for the City fans? my point was not your morals but the fact that you tried to haul other City fans over the coals for their morals. You criticised KK and others for their opinions, not only ignoring the reasons they held those opinions but when you were told their reasons, you totally disregarded them.

Another point...the media....who you have no control over.
1...Post Munich, the rags threw the like of Jackie Blanchflower onto the scrapheap. They also chucked him out of the club house, making him homeless.
2...The rags even refused to pay Albert Scanlon's taxi fare from the Airpot to the ground, when he returned from the German hospital, where he had been recovering...he too was thrown onto the scrap[heap.
3...The family of Duncan Edwards were left isolated by the club and were never contacted by the rags, having lost their young son in the air crash. The next time the rags got in touch was when they were begging for Edward's memorabilia to put into their museum. The Edwards family were disgusted.
4...On the 40th anniverary of the air crash, the rags held a memorial match at the swamp that tuned out to be a textimonial for Eric Cantona.
5...Despite the wishes of their own fans, the 50th anniversary was sponsored by AIG.
6...This line can contain all the other disrespectful things that the rags did regarding their own dead.
7...The Liverpool fans sing about Miunich.
8...The rags fans sing about Shankly.
9...The rags sing about the deaths of Leeds murdered in Turkey.
10..The rags sing about Hillborough.
11..The rags sing about dead Russian submariners.

Yet you really believe that the media would call out any fans that make chants...I'll bet you can't find any of those reports can you.
But whilst you are happy to come on here and sermonise to city fans, have you ever written to the rags to criticise them? Or considered contacting the Press Complaints people to ensure fair reportage?
Why if you feel you can't account for the actions of others, do you think you can account for the action of City fans who, whether right or wrong, are also thinking individuals with the right to think for themselves and make their own minds up.

[twosips]

Haha - John. You are unbelievable. You want to call me up for making assumptions? Christ, i wouldn't know where to start with you. You've not even read my post clearly! You're just ranting nonsense at me again. I've actually answered ALL your points pretty much and you're just ignoring them and ranting on. I lost count how many times i said that I think the way United dealt with all the munich thing was horrible (yet you're questioning me about that again - why?!), and how I think all the chants you mention are horrible and shouldn't be sung (yet you're seemingly asking for my opinion again) and I even said why in my opinion the press picked on up these chants and not the others (but i guess you don't agree, so for some reason you're just asking me again - confusing)

Why I can't answer for the rags or the press? Come on lad have a think about it....it's pretty obvious.

How about because i'm not a rag, or a journalist? I am in fact a City fan. I am more accountable for a city fan's action than a United fans. I will still debate any journalist/united fan though on their morals. In fact, the other week i had a fucking huuuuuuuuge debate with 'Scott the Red' on twitter over his reason for the murderer chants not being that bad. Don't act like i'm just picking on City fans. I'm not. I'm merely talking to city fans more, cos that's what I do. As I am a city fan. And regarding's KK's reasoning - i just don't agree with it. Simple. I'm happy to agree to disagree, but I will still think he's being fucking classless if he sings it. I always will. What do you want me to do about that? If you want me to agree with KK, well that's never gonna happen.

Oh and about me suggesting that you seem to think 'if they're allowed to do it then we are' - well you can hardly blame me can you? Seeing as all you've done is constantly go on about other team's morals. Again. And again. Annnnnnd again. It's fucking typical of people these days. They're all too happy to point their finger elsewhere but never have enough time to actually consider their own actions and what effect it'll have on others.


Anyway, I can reply in depth another time if you really want me to, as it is, i have work to get ready for and I can't be arsed typing anymore if you're not gonna listen to what i'm trying to say. Off to eat my frosties.

[Chinners]

Top, top post John. I doff my cap in your direction

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

Just going right back to the first post. ....Cos it's all got a bit sidelined. Nobody is mocking the dead.

[Avalon]

I just love the new argument some have here: "they do it too", "they are hypocrites", "they sing blah blah", "they milked this", "they milked a cow", "they did this", "a monkey ate a banana"

Really? So, because they do things, it is okay we sing things in return? Are we that childish? That immature? Whether it is "just a word", "a word to describe the way Stretford treated the families and friends after the disaster", "a way to piss them off", it all doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what the media writes about us, it doesn't matter what Stretford does. Why are some of you looking at others and use the "oh, but he did it too" mentality? We're adults for crying out loud! "Monkey sees, monkey does " seems like an appropriate adage for the attitude for some of you. We shouldn't be looking at others, we should look at ourselves. The club, Bell and various other names that are, "supposedly" important to us asked to knock it off. The least you could do, is to do just that. Respect the club's wishes and stop whining about what others do. It's not even important.

[john68]

Two sips mate...You miss my point completely....again.
It is not about the rights or wrongs of using the terms "Munich" or "Mune", (I have made that quite clear a number of times) but whether those who do so, having giving it consideration and thought, have the right to make their own minds up regarding their opinions and actions.

City fans like KK and many others are thinking, intelligent people who use the the terms "Munich" and "Mune" for the rags. They are fully aware of why they do it and they are fully aware of the implications of their actions. When they use the terms "Munich" and "Mune", they do so mindfully. I am not opining whether their choice is morally right or wrong but I am asserting that; because it is mindful, they have the right to that opinion....Whether you, I or the club like it or agree with it or not.
I understand that you have no control, nor can answer for the media, the rags or any other group of fans, again I have no problem with that...but as these City fans are thinking, mindful beings, you cannot answer nor control them either. Which is what you seek to do.
My next point was simply regarding the balance of your targetting. You chose to defend you principles (quite right to do so) but only chose to attack City fans, whilst not (until pushed) attack either the rags' fans and club and the media. Your belief being that you can't account for the latter but can for the former...(see above).
I don't expect you to agree with KK, (never did) but you should acknowledge his right (and others) to hold his (their) opinion and be responsible for his (their) own actions.
Regarding the (wrong) assumption and your accusation of "if they're allowed to do it, then we are" I can and do blame you for that. It is you that chose to take my words and twist them. despite being asked previously not to do so. If I didn't say it, consider that I didn't mean it.
My mention of other teams' morals was simply to ensure that the picture was complete. Until i did so, your argument only targetted city fans. it also added balance, showing that the reasoning behind fans' opinions wasn't as mindless as you were suggesting.
It is also fucking typical that people only point their fingers in a singualr direction, failing to point their finger at others actions that a the essence of the issue.
BTW, I did listen...I'm excellent at reading and unlike you, I never misrepresented nor assumed wrongly what you posted.
Enjoy the Frosties...Prefer Weetabix myself.

[1950]

What a load of flowery apologist bullshit.

It is not about the rights or wrongs of using the terms "Munich" or "Mune"

That is exactly what this discussion is about, only you chose to sidetrack it repeatedly.

but whether those who do so, having giving it consideration and thought, have the right to make their own minds up regarding their opinions and actions.

They do. Just as much as those critisicing their choice have the right to critisice their choice.

City fans like KK and many others are thinking, intelligent people who use the the terms "Munich" and "Mune" for the rags. They are fully aware of why they do it and they are fully aware of the implications of their actions. When they use the terms "Munich" and "Mune", they do so mindfully. I am not opining whether their choice is morally right or wrong but I am asserting that; because it is mindful, they have the right to that opinion....Whether you, I or the club like it or agree with it or not.
I understand that you have no control, nor can answer for the media, the rags or any other group of fans, again I have no problem with that...but as these City fans are thinking, mindful beings, you cannot answer nor control them either. Which is what you seek to do.

They might have the right to that opinion, but that doesn't necessarily give them the right to voice that opinion in a certain fashion at certain events in certain venues. The club has every right to 'control' that particular behaviour & any individual has the right to advocate said control by the club.
That said, I haven't seen anyone seeking to 'control' other 'thinking, mindful beings' on this site. I have seen disagreement & reasoning (in the broad sense of the word).

My next point was simply regarding the balance of your targetting. You chose to defend you principles (quite right to do so) but only chose to attack City fans, whilst not (until pushed) attack either the rags' fans and club and the media. Your belief being that you can't account for the latter but can for the former...(see above).
I don't expect you to agree with KK, (never did) but you should acknowledge his right (and others) to hold his (their) opinion and be responsible for his (their) own actions.
Regarding the (wrong) assumption and your accusation of "if they're allowed to do it, then we are" I can and do blame you for that. It is you that chose to take my words and twist them. despite being asked previously not to do so. If I didn't say it, consider that I didn't mean it.
My mention of other teams' morals was simply to ensure that the picture was complete. Until i did so, your argument only targetted city fans. it also added balance, showing that the reasoning behind fans' opinions wasn't as mindless as you were suggesting.
It is also fucking typical that people only point their fingers in a singualr direction, failing to point their finger at others actions that a the essence of the issue.

This particular matter is regarding MCFC & it's supporters. There is no need to point any fingers in any other direction until this particular matter is resolved by MCFC & it's supporters.

[The Man In Blue]

This particular matter is regarding MCFC & it's supporters. There is no need to point any fingers in any other direction until this particular matter is resolved by MCFC & it's supporters.

This is core fact that most apologists in this thread are missing. John, do two wrongs make a right?

How childish must this seem. "Well, they sing nasty songs about death so we are going to too".

I thought we were better than the rag supporters. Thats one of the things that has kept me going as a City fan through my 28 years. That, however long our trophy drought lasted, no matter what shitty league we were playing in and no matter how many titles that lot won, we as football fans were different from them.Seems I was completely mistaken eh.

I wish people would just be big enough to admit they want to shout Munich and refer to it as a convenient way to wind up rags, rather than all this "It's to have a pop at the club for it's disgraceful blah blah blah..."

[Im_Spartacus]

This particular matter is regarding MCFC & it's supporters. There is no need to point any fingers in any other direction until this particular matter is resolved by MCFC & it's supporters.

This is core fact that most apologists in this thread are missing. John, do two wrongs make a right?

How childish must this seem. "Well, they sing nasty songs about death so we are going to too".

I thought we were better than the rag supporters. Thats one of the things that has kept me going as a City fan through my 28 years. That, however long our trophy drought lasted, no matter what shitty league we were playing in and no matter how many titles that lot won, we as football fans were different from them.Seems I was completely mistaken eh.

I wish people would just be big enough to admit they want to shout Munich and refer to it as a convenient way to wind up rags, rather than all this "It's to have a pop at the club for it's disgraceful blah blah blah..."

Oh for fuck sake, nobody has EVER in this thread said "It is alright to sing it because they do the same". What has been said repeatedly that the huge outcry of mock disgust and indignation that the munes feign in response to the word Munich, is fucking pathetic given that they are amongst the worst offenders, eg, why don't they get their own fucking house in order before they start the next sympathy crusade?

And yes, over the last 28 years, clearly you were either completely mistaken about City fans or deaf, as one song or another with reference to the word "Munichs" has been sung at almost every city game I have ever been to.

[BlueMoonAwoken]

I thought that city fans was impeccable because of the support they give through thick or thin, and the amount of noise we make when we are needed. Not the fact we dont sing a few songs that might upset rival fans, if we all acted like adults all of the time then life would be very boring as we would be living in a perfect world. We can all be immature at times especially at football as its a release from day to day life of being an adult.

[The Man In Blue]

And yes, over the last 28 years, clearly you were either completely mistaken about City fans or deaf, as one song or another with reference to the word "Munichs" has been sung at almost every city game I have ever been to.

I'd expect it on the regs in the back of Mary D's, but hadn't heard much of it for years until Carlitos signed.

I wish I hadn't posted in this thread.

[BlueMoonAwoken]

Im_Spartacus wrote:
And yes, over the last 28 years, clearly you were either completely mistaken about City fans or deaf, as one song or another with reference to the word "Munichs" has been sung at almost every city game I have ever been to.

what he said.

[Goataldo]

At half time against WHUFC, on the concourse, we were queueing for a beer. Quite a few people were laughing at some little kid aged about three or four, and pointing. Loads of people were going over to the kid, and taking photos of name on the kid's back. The name was MUNCH.

These guys were laughing their heads off, thrilled that they'd got a picture of a City kid with MUNICH on his back. I mean cos yeah, that'll show em, cos, erm, yerwhat like? Hahahaha, true story!

Make of that, what you will.

[Wonderwall]

At half time against WHUFC, on the concourse, we were queueing for a beer. Quite a few people were laughing at some little kid aged about three or four, and pointing. Loads of people were going over to the kid, and taking photos of name on the kid's back. The name was MUNCH.

These guys were laughing their heads off, thrilled that they'd got a picture of a City kid with MUNICH on his back. I mean cos yeah, that'll show em, cos, erm, yerwhat like? Hahahaha, true story!

Make of that, what you will.

was his first name edvard

[Goataldo]

At half time against WHUFC, on the concourse, we were queueing for a beer. Quite a few people were laughing at some little kid aged about three or four, and pointing. Loads of people were going over to the kid, and taking photos of name on the kid's back. The name was MUNCH.

These guys were laughing their heads off, thrilled that they'd got a picture of a City kid with MUNICH on his back. I mean cos yeah, that'll show em, cos, erm, yerwhat like? Hahahaha, true story!

Make of that, what you will.

was his first name edvard

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH! You frightened me.

[Im_Spartacus]

And yes, over the last 28 years, clearly you were either completely mistaken about City fans or deaf, as one song or another with reference to the word "Munichs" has been sung at almost every city game I have ever been to.

I'd expect it on the regs in the back of Mary D's, but hadn't heard much of it for years until Carlitos signed.

I wish I hadn't posted in this thread.

Gary Neville is a blue?
Hark now hear?

Every fucking week without fail