Things That Can And Can't Be Taught to Adult Player

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

I think people don't understand what natural ability is.

Running, dribbling that is taught. Sanè is brilliant at that.
The vision Silva, Ali B, someone like Messi have is natural. You can't teach that.

Running with the ball and dribbling WAS taught to him at one time early on as a kid. You can't improve either skill much at all for a grown up player. Sure you can teach how to time runs and when to dribble but the actual raw skill is what it is.

You've just said it was taught to him as a kid. If no one had taught him, and he hadn't practiced he wouldn't be good at it. No one taught Silva to have 500 eyes on every one of his team mates at any given moment.

As I said above, the midfielders "eye for pass" or "vision" is bit of a mythical thing in that it's hard to tell whether they learned it at some point or is it just about the way they are wired. Could be something to do with beains natural ability to process things.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

The player i have seen with the most raw talent at city ever has been Sane.

He has potential to be the worlds best player if coached correctly and he has the hunger, alternatively he could end up at Stoke with Shaikiri.

It is finely balanced for me.

Agree 100%.
Sane is BY FAR the most NATURALLY talented player I've seen for us. Whether he fullfils his potential is whole another thing.

You think he has by far more natural ability than Silva?

In a sense I would say yes. Now Silva is one of the best playmakers I have ever seen, not only at City but in the world. But as far as raw talent goes he lacks lot of things that Sane is gifted with like raw pace and running and dribbling with ball at full speed. Silva has exceptional spacial awareness and vision and out of this world passing technique.

Be as it may though the point of this topic wasn't to point who is the most talented but what sort of things can be improved via (proper) training and what sort of attributes will not improve much regardless of the training.

[Scatman]

The player i have seen with the most raw talent at city ever has been Sane.

He has potential to be the worlds best player if coached correctly and he has the hunger, alternatively he could end up at Stoke with Shaikiri.

It is finely balanced for me.

Agree 100%.
Sane is BY FAR the most NATURALLY talented player I've seen for us. Whether he fullfils his potential is whole another thing.

You think he has by far more natural ability than Silva?

In a sense I would say yes. Now Silva is one of the best playmakers I have ever seen, not only at City but in the world. But as far as raw talent goes he lacks lot of things that Sane is gifted with like raw pace and running and dribbling with ball at full speed. Silva has exceptional spacial awareness and vision and out of this world passing technique.

Be as it may though the point of this topic wasn't to point who is the most talented but what sort of things can be improved via (proper) training and what sort of attributes will not improve much regardless of the training.

So basically it was a thread to tell us all how much you know from your decades of experience

[edge275]

Great post NQDP. I enjoyed reading it.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

You think he has by far more natural ability than Silva?

In a sense I would say yes. Now Silva is one of the best playmakers I have ever seen, not only at City but in the world. But as far as raw talent goes he lacks lot of things that Sane is gifted with like raw pace and running and dribbling with ball at full speed. Silva has exceptional spacial awareness and vision and out of this world passing technique.

Be as it may though the point of this topic wasn't to point who is the most talented but what sort of things can be improved via (proper) training and what sort of attributes will not improve much regardless of the training.

So basically it was a thread to tell us all how much you know from your decades of experience

Eh?
It was to have discussion about training of professional footballers and how they can be improved via training. I have zero experience of training professional footballers if that's what you mean. It's also true that I have decades of football experience in different roles. I have been fortunate enough to train and play with and against players who ended up as professional footballers. So I would honestly say that I may have teeny tiny bit of clue but I'm certainly no Arsene Wenger.

In all honesty this was my effort to have little bit deeper football discussion than "It said on The Sun that we are on the verge of signing Messi" or "some random pundit didn't give us the credit we deserve and I don't understand why they give stick to us when we play against smaller team eventhough only 10% of viewers are City supporters and 87% are neutrals who are naturally drawn to support smaller team in any individual game and therefore more likely to renew thekr Sky subsciption if praise the smaller team". But yeah, I suppose if you really wanted you could see that this topic is about me rather than player attributes.

Would it have helped you if I had put "in my humble opinnion" in every fuxking corner of the thread?

[john68]

Great thought provoking topic Antti. My compliments......BUT.....I though I agree with your general theories there is devil in the detail I don't.
I was amused by the admission from a passionate and emotionally attached City fan that you had 'RED' coaching manuals. :-)

Regarding nature versus nurture, I think it entirely possible to teach an old dog new tricks. That being dependent on the mindset of the old dog being willing to learn. I agree there are players with that natural instinct and natural aptitude who will with dedication and determination usually reach greater heights.

Can instinct be taught? Some have it naturally but I think for the most part, what we identify as natural ability was in fact learned at an early age and embedded or hardwired by good coaching and often the environment.a player played his early years in.

In the past, playground and street football was a place where most professionals LEARNED and honed their skills. Playing 30 a side in a limited area meant packed playing areas and no time whatsoever to react with the ball. It is there in the street or the waste grounds of the favellas that many many youngsters learned their trickery, control, accuracy of passing etc.

It was undoubtedly the hour upon hour that Aguero spent in tiny spaces, surrounded by a mass of other kids that laid the foundations to him becoming the player he is now.

We have only to look at the Goat to note that a lumbering, relatively poor player, learned quite late in his career to time runs, find the right positions and acquire the shooting accuracy that made him the legend he became..

[Mase]

Agree with everything in that apart from the Goat being used as an example. He scored 40 goals in 75 appearances for Bristol City and before that with Rotherham 70 in 209 apps. He was always a decent poacher/finisher.

[Mikhail Chigorin]

I don't know about anyone else but there have been a great series of posts in this thread. Apart from the ongoing EDS thread, it's been one of the the most interesting we 've had so well done to NQDP for 'launching' it.

[Mase]

I don't know about anyone else but there have been a great series of posts in this thread. Apart from the ongoing EDS thread, it's been one of the the most interesting we 've had so well done to NQDP for 'launching' it.

Until Kola leaves this summer and we have our Kolarov Appreciation Thread.

[Mikhail Chigorin]

I don't know about anyone else but there have been a great series of posts in this thread. Apart from the ongoing EDS thread, it's been one of the the most interesting we 've had so well done to NQDP for 'launching' it.

Until Kola leaves this summer and we have our Kolarov Appreciation Thread.

Mmmmm.....that could be a thought provoking thread as well.............

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

I don't know about anyone else but there have been a great series of posts in this thread. Apart from the ongoing EDS thread, it's been one of the the most interesting we 've had so well done to NQDP for 'launching' it.

Until Kola leaves this summer and we have our Kolarov Appreciation Thread.

Mmmmm.....that could be a thought provoking thread as well.............

He has certainly "provoked some thoughts" over the years.

[Mikhail Chigorin]

I don't know about anyone else but there have been a great series of posts in this thread. Apart from the ongoing EDS thread, it's been one of the the most interesting we 've had so well done to NQDP for 'launching' it.

Until Kola leaves this summer and we have our Kolarov Appreciation Thread.

Mmmmm.....that could be a thought provoking thread as well.............

He has certainly "provoked some thoughts" over the years.

Absolutely.

If he does leave, which is by no means certain, I wonder which poster wold be constrained to launch such a thread ??

Mmmmm. Let me see.........................

[Mase]

I don't know about anyone else but there have been a great series of posts in this thread. Apart from the ongoing EDS thread, it's been one of the the most interesting we 've had so well done to NQDP for 'launching' it.

Until Kola leaves this summer and we have our Kolarov Appreciation Thread.

Mmmmm.....that could be a thought provoking thread as well.............

He has certainly "provoked some thoughts" over the years.

Absolutely.

If he does leave, which is by no means certain, I wonder which poster wold be constrained to launch such a thread ??

Mmmmm. Let me see.........................

There's so many of his fans on here it'd be hard to guess.

[Mikhail Chigorin]

^^^^^

That's why I was having to have a good think Mase; there'd be so many falling over themselves to start it, that it would be a veritable stampede

In all seriousness though, I've just got a feeling that Pep will keep the 'Big K' onboard this summer.