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After a great win on Saturday it's back to Carrington in the pouring rain. The coaches all out setting up and it looked like everyone there apart from Maicon and Kolo and one face I didn't recognise.Most of the young guns are away and I just couldn't place this one.Mancini took them for starters with a longer than usual briefing which I would guess would be stressing the importance of Wednesday's game.

Still on a far pitch they did some exercises and then some play in two groups which seemed mostly about moving the ball and keeping shape.Then all came over for some play in an interesting game with big nets but also with 5 a side nets down each flank.They were scoring mostly in the small nets but plenty of passing and moving.Best pass of the day was from Joe Hart when he got a high back pass and chested it about 20 yards straight to a teammate.

A few exercises later and the Fulham 1st team went in leaving the rest,plus Fillipe and Scapuzzi plus the boss to make up the teams for the end game.An early goal from Edin was no surprise as he swept one in which was quickly followed by one from Mario.Highlights from there were:

Roberto Mancini scoring with a class volley hooked high into the top corner
Micah scored two nice goals
Rodders a neat headed goal from a corner
Micah also cleared from Rodders in a typical crunch last ditch challenge.I thought somebody must get hurt but no problems at all.
Kolarov took the boss out!
Platt was shouting something about contracts :)
Milner scored as he always does
Two nutmegs by Lescott were pretty special (that was BY Joleon and not ON Joleon)
Joe was very keen not to let Edin get near the ball based on what he was yelling :)
Kolarov took the boss out again :)
I think Milner scored again before Edin made it 5.5 ( I think I missed 1 or 2 )
Plenty of disputes had been going on and more Italian being spoken than english.I would love to know what Platt was saying to Roberto in one exchange with off side appeals turned down and the boss appealing for fouls against him.

All good fun ( I am sure!) before a golden chance for Rodders but he smacked it onto the bar but when it came down he got another chance in a scramble and belted it in.The arguments continued but that was that and as the boss's side won there were not going to be any decisions changed.

A few styaed out for some shooting practice plus some extra work for Mario plus some shooting. Milner and Sinclair led the way with the shooting and Milner especially with the banter with both Wright and Costel. He scored with his first 3 or 4 and was giving Costel in particular some real grief.Right foot left foot it didnt matter for a while.He even shouted over to the keeper coach that he had better build up their confidence tomorrow after he had shattered it. All good stuff.

Cheers Doug good to see Milner having a good time and that Rodwell's injury isn't serious.

That's the Milner who has apparently 'cut a dispirited figure' at City recently. Yep - fuck off tabloids.

"Roberto Mancini scoring with a class volley hooked high into the top corner"

Old lion can still bite.

So that's why Kolo wasn't there today.Getting some game time playing for the EDS team.

top stuff Doug. Good to get the inside on Milner and a few others.

Excellent.

Since I wasn't able to watch or listen to the Villa cup draw, how does Milner look? I thought he was having surgery on his toe or something...? I'd love to see him come back into the side.

Similarly, sounds like Micah is getting close to coming back....

Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

john68 wrote:Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

there is only a way to improve GK distribution : sell hart and sign a GK wich has a good distribution.

john68 wrote:Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

Strangely no. In the past I have seen plenty of time spent with the keepers kicking long but nothing this year so far. Maybe some time has been spent when I have not been there. The answer for me or at least part of it anyway is that he should throw the ball out more.Obviously if there is a free player where he can just roll it out but also the longer throws as he is miles more accurate with his throwing than kicking.

Douglas Higginbottom wrote:

john68 wrote:Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

Strangely no. In the past I have seen plenty of time spent with the keepers kicking long but nothing this year so far. Maybe some time has been spent when I have not been there. The answer for me or at least part of it anyway is that he should throw the ball out more.Obviously if there is a free player where he can just roll it out but also the longer throws as he is miles more accurate with his throwing than kicking.

I fucking hate Hart kicking the ball out , we play possession football so there is zero need to hoof it up to the midgets we have upfront.
And in any case , Hart is fuckign wank at kicking the ball anywhere but down the middle , I have lost count of the times he hoofs it to the wing only for it to go out for a throwing.

Hart is the biggest culprit for giving the ball away. City must be aware of it as it stands out plainly in the stats. Worth a check in the Hart Analytics Thread. His stats are nothing short of atrocious.

Too often we have possession in the opponents half, retain the ball bty passing back, often as far back as Hart, who then blasts it long to a similar position we started in but now we don't have the ball.
Against Madrid, he contributed to wave upon wave of Madrid attacks by giving the ball straight back to them.

stefano wrote:

john68 wrote:Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

there is only a way to improve GK distribution : sell hart and sign a GK wich has a good distribution.

Not strictly true - play less backpasses, it's a pet hate of mine. Players tend to use a backpass as a valid first choice in too many situations when they should be looking to get the ball at least sideways if not forward. It seems like a habit they've fallen into. I can't remember who played it, but there was a situation against Fulham in the first half when one of our players nodded the ball in Hart's general direction when he had no chance of getting to it before Fulham's striker and luckily for us it came to nothing but it illustrates my point.

Dameerto wrote:

stefano wrote:

john68 wrote:Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

there is only a way to improve GK distribution : sell hart and sign a GK wich has a good distribution.

Not strictly true - play less backpasses, it's a pet hate of mine. Players tend to use a backpass as a valid first choice in too many situations when they should be looking to get the ball at least sideways if not forward. It seems like a habit they've fallen into. I can't remember who played it, but there was a situation against Fulham in the first half when one of our players nodded the ball in Hart's general direction when he had no chance of getting to it before Fulham's striker and luckily for us it came to nothing but it illustrates my point.

for the teams playing possession football the goalkeeper is much more than a shot stopper, is in fact a playmaker. but to be a playmaker must have good feet, be very good at kicking. and that's a natural gift, or you have or do not have. no one can think of to teach how to kick a ball at a twenty-five years old guy.

bhfanatic wrote:"Roberto Mancini scoring with a class volley hooked high into the top corner"

Old lion can still bite.

He used to score goals like that for fun. im sure he still has that footy brain!

stefano wrote:

Dameerto wrote:

stefano wrote:

john68 wrote:Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

there is only a way to improve GK distribution : sell hart and sign a GK wich has a good distribution.

Not strictly true - play less backpasses, it's a pet hate of mine. Players tend to use a backpass as a valid first choice in too many situations when they should be looking to get the ball at least sideways if not forward. It seems like a habit they've fallen into. I can't remember who played it, but there was a situation against Fulham in the first half when one of our players nodded the ball in Hart's general direction when he had no chance of getting to it before Fulham's striker and luckily for us it came to nothing but it illustrates my point.

for the teams playing possession football the goalkeeper is much more than a shot stopper, is in fact a playmaker. but to be a playmaker must have good feet, be very good at kicking. and that's a natural gift, or you have or do not have. no one can think of to teach how to kick a ball at a twenty-five years old guy.

I think that was one of several reasons he lost his place to Given. Hart was whacking everything to the oppo wheras Shay was passing it out. Unfortunately he was passing it to Richard Dunne, who then either whacked it to the opposition or fell over, (hence his departure) but our distribution & ability to play a passing game from the back, improved by a shocking amount the second Joe was replaced. I often wonder if we'd have a better chance of regaining possession if our defenders just kicked the ball into row Z when under pressure rather than pass to Joe. At least we'd have the chance to mark up before the ball came back at us.

stefano wrote:

Dameerto wrote:

stefano wrote:

john68 wrote:Doug,
Though nobody seems to have bothered much with the Joe Hart playing analysis from last season, it is very noticeable that his distribution is somewhat worse than atrocious. It was very noticeable, especially when under pressure versus Madrid, that he constantly gave possession away with wild clearances and opened the door consistently to wave after wave of Mardrid attacks.

I know the keepers train separately but have you seen anyone working with Joe on this aspect of his game? It's a major weakness.

Ta Doug,

there is only a way to improve GK distribution : sell hart and sign a GK wich has a good distribution.

Not strictly true - play less backpasses, it's a pet hate of mine. Players tend to use a backpass as a valid first choice in too many situations when they should be looking to get the ball at least sideways if not forward. It seems like a habit they've fallen into. I can't remember who played it, but there was a situation against Fulham in the first half when one of our players nodded the ball in Hart's general direction when he had no chance of getting to it before Fulham's striker and luckily for us it came to nothing but it illustrates my point.

for the teams playing possession football the goalkeeper is much more than a shot stopper, is in fact a playmaker. but to be a playmaker must have good feet, be very good at kicking. and that's a natural gift, or you have or do not have. no one can think of to teach how to kick a ball at a twenty-five years old guy.

For teams playing with a back four as advanced as we should be doing (and as we did against Fulham) the backpass becomes too much of a risk as highlighted in the example I mentioned, therefore we should use it LESS.

Dameerto,
My original point was whether the distribution weakness in Hart's game was being addressed by the club in training. Your point regarding the outfield players (usually defenders) is a separate issue, though just as valid in highlighting a weakness in the interplay relationship between Hart and (usually) his defenders when we have and seek to retain the ball.

Stefano has a point regarding the role of the modern keeper being more than a shot stopper. Put together, this whole area of play needs to be worked on.

Doug often flags up the amount of time Mancini spends on defensive shape and positioning to stop opponents but never anything about work done once our defenders regain possession.