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by PrezIke » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:15 pm
In short...
Is City's transfer policy since Pep has arrived "naive?"
I posted a response in the Jorginho thread raising this question after I heard Ashan from 9320 ask this (he has before, I believe) and express it more strongly after the Jorgihno saga:
http://www.mancityfans.net/mcfnet/viewtopic.php?f=119&t=53894&p=917472#p917472Reportedly, City's transfer policy now is that an agreement is made with the player/agent and they won't go back and change it if another club comes in with a better offer. This played out, as we have heard from Sam Lee and is reported widely elsewhere -- with Alexis and Alves.
The 9320 Pod talked about this as being "naive" today where Ahsan raised the question I have -- despite understanding the reasoning for it -- about the concept of not being hosed in transfers as was our reputation since the takeover. I suspect this also has to do with profits -- aka FFP -- but Sam Lee also pointed to this being Pep's philosophy about wanting certain types of players who really want to be here.
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by Mase » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:16 pm
Not just since Pep arrived. Look at Hazard. We wouldn't pay £5 million to his agent. Was that a mistake?
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by CTID Hants » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:30 pm
I don't think the policy is scribed in stone as such with no degree of flexibility..... I beleive that it applies to "nice to haves" but should a truly world class must have player came along things would be different. Therefore i don't think it naive & it will show that we won't waste our time which can only be a good thing going forward.
We are now gettig to the point where players want to play for us over and above what they can make out of it i.e. we don't need to be convincing them to come anymore
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by South Stand Balti » Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:16 pm
I don't know if our policy is naive but it is flawed. We missed out on Fred who I think would have been perfect for us. We then missed out on Jorginho (slow as fuck, btw) with no back up plan in place. The transfer window closes as the season starts so there is little time to bring in top quality. That can't be good planning if the reports that Kovacic is of no interest to Pep are true. I also think we need a left back as Mendy is a proper sick note, just as he was before we bought him. TheSpafia should be embarrassed by this latest episode but Napoli and others have been sly as fuck.
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by Beefymcfc » Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:45 pm
I think it's a great policy, agree in principle and if they want to fuck off elsewhere then they didn't want to be here anyway and chose a higher payoff or preferred lifestyle over professional success.
Look at Jorge, although now playing for Italy, he is Brazilian from birth and with three Brazilian players on our books you'd think he'd settle right in. However, if his lifestyle is preferred to London, and the pull of Sarri going there, then do we really want a player who isn't 100% committed to the team? Pep only wants those who are willing to accept his leadership and leave everything out there.
That's what may have held this up as Jorge wasn't fully onboard so we left the offer there whilst he made his mind up.
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by South Stand Balti » Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:17 pm
Beefymcfc wrote:I think it's a great policy, agree in principle and if they want to fuck off elsewhere then they didn't want to be here anyway and chose a higher payoff or preferred lifestyle over professional success.
Look at Jorge, although now playing for Italy, he is Brazilian from birth and with three Brazilian players on our books you'd think he'd settle right in. However, if his lifestyle is preferred to London, and the pull of Sarri going there, then do we really want a player who isn't 100% committed to the team? Pep only wants those who are willing to accept his leadership and leave everything out there.
That's what may have held this up as Jorge wasn't fully onboard so we left the offer there whilst he made his mind up.
Not against any of that Beefy but we are left with only a 33 year old Fern who can play that role in the top games. We set our sights high.... to win the league and the chumps league. We now don't have cover for defensive midfield. Plan A (Fred) has already gone and plan B has been a bargaining chip in the deal to take Sarri to Chelsea. I don't think we have a plan C in place. Our transfer policy gives us some moral high ground but, unlike others, we have not strengthened the engine room.
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by Foreverinbluedreams » Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:23 pm
South Stand Balti wrote:Beefymcfc wrote:I think it's a great policy, agree in principle and if they want to fuck off elsewhere then they didn't want to be here anyway and chose a higher payoff or preferred lifestyle over professional success.
Look at Jorge, although now playing for Italy, he is Brazilian from birth and with three Brazilian players on our books you'd think he'd settle right in. However, if his lifestyle is preferred to London, and the pull of Sarri going there, then do we really want a player who isn't 100% committed to the team? Pep only wants those who are willing to accept his leadership and leave everything out there.
That's what may have held this up as Jorge wasn't fully onboard so we left the offer there whilst he made his mind up.
Not against any of that Beefy but we are left with only a 33 year old Fern who can play that role in the top games. We set our sights high.... to win the league and the chumps league. We now don't have cover for defensive midfield. Plan A (Fred) has already gone and plan B has been a bargaining chip in the deal to take Sarri to Chelsea. I don't think we have a plan C in place. Our transfer policy gives us some moral high ground but, unlike others, we have not strengthened the engine room.
Plan A was scrapped after it failed to materialise last January, are you seriously suggesting we went into the summer with just Jorginho in mind and no back up plan?
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by Foreverinbluedreams » Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:26 pm
South Stand Balti wrote:I don't know if our policy is naive but it is flawed. We missed out on Fred who I think would have been perfect for us. We then missed out on Jorginho (slow as fuck, btw) with no back up plan in place. The transfer window closes as the season starts so there is little time to bring in top quality. That can't be good planning if the reports that Kovacic is of no interest to Pep are true. I also think we need a left back as Mendy is a proper sick note, just as he was before we bought him. TheSpafia should be embarrassed by this latest episode but Napoli and others have been sly as fuck.
Mendy averaged 36/37 games a season with Monaco, had some injury issues but no more than most really, "proper sick note" is a bit ott.
Edit: just checked his Marseille stats and he averaged the same number of apps per season with them too.
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by South Stand Balti » Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:39 pm
Foreverinbluedreams wrote:South Stand Balti wrote:I don't know if our policy is naive but it is flawed. We missed out on Fred who I think would have been perfect for us. We then missed out on Jorginho (slow as fuck, btw) with no back up plan in place. The transfer window closes as the season starts so there is little time to bring in top quality. That can't be good planning if the reports that Kovacic is of no interest to Pep are true. I also think we need a left back as Mendy is a proper sick note, just as he was before we bought him. TheSpafia should be embarrassed by this latest episode but Napoli and others have been sly as fuck.
Mendy averaged 36/37 games a season with Monaco, had some injury issues but no more than most really, "proper sick note" is a bit ott.
Edit: just checked his Marseille stats and he averaged the same number of apps per season with them too.
Mendy missed 76 days in the 15/16 season and 83 days in the 16/17 season. He had a cruciate ligament injury amongst that. The source is transfermarket. I also remember him getting injured playing for France a couple of months before we signed him. The incident involved no physical contact with the opponent but he did his knee.
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by South Stand Balti » Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:47 pm
Foreverinbluedreams wrote:South Stand Balti wrote:Beefymcfc wrote:I think it's a great policy, agree in principle and if they want to fuck off elsewhere then they didn't want to be here anyway and chose a higher payoff or preferred lifestyle over professional success.
Look at Jorge, although now playing for Italy, he is Brazilian from birth and with three Brazilian players on our books you'd think he'd settle right in. However, if his lifestyle is preferred to London, and the pull of Sarri going there, then do we really want a player who isn't 100% committed to the team? Pep only wants those who are willing to accept his leadership and leave everything out there.
That's what may have held this up as Jorge wasn't fully onboard so we left the offer there whilst he made his mind up.
Not against any of that Beefy but we are left with only a 33 year old Fern who can play that role in the top games. We set our sights high.... to win the league and the chumps league. We now don't have cover for defensive midfield. Plan A (Fred) has already gone and plan B has been a bargaining chip in the deal to take Sarri to Chelsea. I don't think we have a plan C in place. Our transfer policy gives us some moral high ground but, unlike others, we have not strengthened the engine room.
Plan A was scrapped after it failed to materialise last January, are you seriously suggesting we went into the summer with just Jorginho in mind and no back up plan?
The point is we have been negotiating with Napoli for an age. There is just 4 weeks until the transfer window opens so I don't see there is time to sort it and I doubt there is a top class player happy to wait in the wings should the Jorginho deal fall through.
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by PrezIke » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:00 pm
Mase wrote:Not just since Pep arrived. Look at Hazard. We wouldn't pay £5 million to his agent. Was that a mistake?
Hmm. I can see what you're saying, but we paid quite a large fee for some players before his arrival that some thought was too high:
KDB (The "£55m Flop") Sterling, Stones, Mangala
Yet, we've also paid what some thought were inflated fees recently:
Walker, Mendy, Laporte
Now English players who can get into our team are (barring the Delph situation) always going to be overpriced for obvious reasons.
It seems, perhaps, we have our own valuation system where if they go over that value then we won't move. Yet, the 3 that we've missed on all reneged on their agreements with us after the player/agent got a better deal from another club and 2 of those times came while we were negotiating a lower fee with the club. The later part of that sentence in what may be part of the question at hand.
Had we just paid closer to what the selling club wanted we would have the players. I'm not saying that's the solution, but it is a competitive market, and right now -- in particular -- it is difficult to see us finding a player that we feel is worth a fee we are willing to pay as our future CDM. The alternatives we are hearing about are just not right, and I can see why we may not sign anyone .
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by Foreverinbluedreams » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:04 pm
South Stand Balti wrote:Foreverinbluedreams wrote:South Stand Balti wrote:Beefymcfc wrote:I think it's a great policy, agree in principle and if they want to fuck off elsewhere then they didn't want to be here anyway and chose a higher payoff or preferred lifestyle over professional success.
Look at Jorge, although now playing for Italy, he is Brazilian from birth and with three Brazilian players on our books you'd think he'd settle right in. However, if his lifestyle is preferred to London, and the pull of Sarri going there, then do we really want a player who isn't 100% committed to the team? Pep only wants those who are willing to accept his leadership and leave everything out there.
That's what may have held this up as Jorge wasn't fully onboard so we left the offer there whilst he made his mind up.
Not against any of that Beefy but we are left with only a 33 year old Fern who can play that role in the top games. We set our sights high.... to win the league and the chumps league. We now don't have cover for defensive midfield. Plan A (Fred) has already gone and plan B has been a bargaining chip in the deal to take Sarri to Chelsea. I don't think we have a plan C in place. Our transfer policy gives us some moral high ground but, unlike others, we have not strengthened the engine room.
Plan A was scrapped after it failed to materialise last January, are you seriously suggesting we went into the summer with just Jorginho in mind and no back up plan?
The point is we have been negotiating with Napoli for an age. There is just 4 weeks until the transfer window opens so I don't see there is time to sort it and I doubt there is a top class player happy to wait in the wings should the Jorginho deal fall through.
I get what you're saying but I find it hard to believe that the club wouldn't have put the feelers out on alternatives well in advance of the window opening.
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by PrezIke » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:05 pm
Foreverinbluedreams wrote:South Stand Balti wrote:Beefymcfc wrote:I think it's a great policy, agree in principle and if they want to fuck off elsewhere then they didn't want to be here anyway and chose a higher payoff or preferred lifestyle over professional success.
Look at Jorge, although now playing for Italy, he is Brazilian from birth and with three Brazilian players on our books you'd think he'd settle right in. However, if his lifestyle is preferred to London, and the pull of Sarri going there, then do we really want a player who isn't 100% committed to the team? Pep only wants those who are willing to accept his leadership and leave everything out there.
That's what may have held this up as Jorge wasn't fully onboard so we left the offer there whilst he made his mind up.
Not against any of that Beefy but we are left with only a 33 year old Fern who can play that role in the top games. We set our sights high.... to win the league and the chumps league. We now don't have cover for defensive midfield. Plan A (Fred) has already gone and plan B has been a bargaining chip in the deal to take Sarri to Chelsea. I don't think we have a plan C in place. Our transfer policy gives us some moral high ground but, unlike others, we have not strengthened the engine room.
Plan A was scrapped after it failed to materialise last January, are you seriously suggesting we went into the summer with just Jorginho in mind and no back up plan?
I hate to say it, but I think we thought it difficult to have both Plan A & B, given our stature as a club now, go tails up.
There are options as Plan C, but is it worth it to spend now or wait until better options arise as it's not entirely clear the ones we've heard about will really improve us.
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by Foreverinbluedreams » Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:08 pm
Plan A was off the table before this window started though Prez, well if you're to believe the press briefings from the club that is. That would mean Jorginho was plan A going into this window.
Edit: just checked there and it was March that press briefing that City had cooled their interest in Fred was reported.
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by City64 » Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:28 pm
Imagine if you had a transfer policy where you sold a player to Juventus for next to nothing then bought the useless cunt back for £90 million ?????
Oh and your team that has that said transfer policy wins fuck all ?????
Not really here
Fuck VAR
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by Pretty Boy Lee » Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:52 pm
On the flip side it’s weeding out bad apples. Hazard is rumored to have been amongst the Chelsea mutiny that got Jose the arse. Sanchez hasn’t exactly improved United while they move everyone to accolade him. I’m ok with not having these issues at our club tbh.
Tracking back is overrated.
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by Original Dub » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:02 am
Our transfers overall have been arguably the best in world football over the last few years.
The end.
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by Hazy2 » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:40 am
We have 100 pointers to getting more right than wrong, I have never understood the Hazard one though. Did he not attend the Derby was Bobby thwarted on RVP De Rossi and Bale because of agents fees?
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by Foreverinbluedreams » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:56 am
Hazy2 wrote:We have 100 pointers to getting more right than wrong, I have never understood the Hazard one though. Did he not attend the Derby was Bobby thwarted on RVP De Rossi and Bale because of agents fees?
And wage demands, our wage bill was a stupidly high percentage of turnover at that time, over 80% iirc. We couldn't compete with FFP looming.
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by Beefymcfc » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:02 am
I can't understand how anybody can criticise our transfer policy these days. Khaldoon said we'd made mistakes in the past and that we wouldn't be making the same mistakes going forward. Our recent signings have been of real quality and the ones we have, or are trying to conclude this season, follow the same criteria.
Put it this way, signing the likes of Mahrez after winning a title, rather than a Sinclair or Roswell, really does make me think we are now getting it right. And if a player chooses another club for whatever reason, then we really don't want him anyway.
In the words of my Old Man, "Life will never be the same without Man City, so get it in while you can".
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