New Super League

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Re: New Super League

Postby PeterParker » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:14 am

sheblue wrote:It will be really interesting to see what Pep has to say for himself Wednesday when interviewed about it.


"Villa were fantastic. They played so, so, so good. We were good in the first 15-20 minutes of every half, but they were so, so, so good. I love my players, they are excellent, so, so, so good. Life goes on, we will see what we will do next in the Cup final. A cup final is very important and Spurs are so, so, so good".
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Re: New Super League

Postby Nigels Tackle » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:30 am

sheblue wrote:It will be really interesting to see what Pep has to say for himself Wednesday when interviewed about it.


he will be interviewed today
he made his thoughts on a super league very clear a while ago.
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Re: New Super League

Postby Hazy2 » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:59 am

PeterParker wrote:
sheblue wrote:It will be really interesting to see what Pep has to say for himself Wednesday when interviewed about it.


"Villa were fantastic. They played so, so, so good. We were good in the first 15-20 minutes of every half, but they were so, so, so good. I love my players, they are excellent, so, so, so good. Life goes on, we will see what we will do next in the Cup final. A cup final is very important and Spurs are so, so, so good".


A bit like you repeat pause repeat !!! I hope we have the sense to withdraw ASAP. Damaged but doing the right thing before the Yanks hang us out to dry again. .
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Re: New Super League

Postby BlueinBosnia » Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:49 am

If the rumours are to be believed, and a CL ban is imminent, as things stand, next season's CL entries from the affected leagues would be as follows:

England: Leicester, West Ham, Everton, Leeds
Spain: Sevilla, Villareal, Real Betis, Real Sociedad
Italy: Atalanta, Napoli, Lazio, Roma

Also, it's almost guaranteed that 13th place in the Prem would be given a European berth for next season's competitions.

The question is, would UEFA see the obvious drop in global audiences as being worth the punishment they'll mete out, or would it be shooting themselves in the foot?
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Re: New Super League

Postby johnny crossan » Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:59 am

Martin Samuel letting rip this morning - here's what he says to save you clicking on the Daily Midden

MARTIN SAMUEL: Nobody who loves football can feel for the charlatan Super League clubs the same way again...

They have broken their social contract with fans, so it is NOT disloyal to turn your backs on them. Damn them all to HELL
• Nobody can love those that have tried to steal the pleasure from so many lives
• They are attempting to ruin a game to make already rich people insanely richer
• They say fine words about Leicester's progress but these sentiments are hollow
• Your club, if it is one of the six involved, has shown how much it cares about you
• Don't buy a shirt, don't buy a ticket, do not behave in a way to encourage them
By MARTIN SAMUEL - SPORT FOR THE DAILY MAIL

You hate our club.
Sports writers get that a lot. The accusation that we're biased against a team. Any team. Doesn't matter what team really. West Brom, once. I don't even know why anyone would think I cared about, let alone hated, West Brom, but there it was. And it isn't true. I love football, always have. And if you love football, you love football people and therefore football clubs.
Particularly the good ones. And, let's face it, the good ones tend to be the big ones. Manchester United, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Liverpool. How can you not love the skill, the artistry, the joy you have seen them bring? How can you not admire the work ethic, the relentless drive and ambition of serial champions, serial winners, those who never give up, never seem to know when they are beaten.

If you love football, you love football people and therefore football clubs, particularly the big ones, like Manchester United. How can you not admire the work ethic, the relentless drive and ambition of serial champions, serial winners like Liverpool? But all that changed on Sunday

So, no, I don't hate your club, I would say. And I meant it. And then, on Sunday afternoon, that changed. No matter how this shakes down, no matter where this ends, nobody who truly loves football can feel for these clubs the same way again.

Nobody can love the individuals and institutions that have tried to steal the pleasure from the lives of so many. That are attempting to ruin what began as, and remains, a game. The working man's ballet, as Alan Hudson had it. They are attempting to take that away from us and, for what? For money. And not money that would feed the poor, or change society or be used for humanitarian good.

Money to make insanely rich people, insanely richer. Men like Andrea Agnelli and Joel Glazer, born into extraordinary wealth, the members of royal families, businessmen and investors who have been successful in life beyond their most fevered dreams.

These are the people who were not satisfied with their ladle from football's pot; who would not share; who do not care for the very structure of the industry that supports them. Basic principles such as competition, or fair play that is more than just a marketing man's slogan.

They are attempting to make rich men like Andrea Agnelli (left) and Joel Glazer insanely richer. So damn them. Damn them all to hell. They think they can carry on as before. That we will still be interested in their ambitions and achievements. They are wrong. It is meaningless now, because we know the contempt that lies beneath. Tottenham and Manchester City will this weekend contest a final of a competition we know means nothing to them.

An event they would sacrifice with a signature on a contract and consign to the dustbin of history, along with the institution, the Football League, that relies on its existence and has stood since 1888. So why should we care who wins it? Why should we watch, or celebrate that victory? Sunday's announcement rendered it worthless. All of it.

We know this season is not what these clubs want, or care for. They say fine words about the progress of opponents like Leicester, or West Ham, but these sentiments are hollow. The rich despise interlopers, really. They have never forgiven Leicester for winning the league in 2016. While the rest of the nation celebrated one of sport's most inspiring narratives, their lips grew thinner, their expressions curdled.

Mine, they said. We're useless, but mine. We're not good enough, but mine. They're better than us, but mine. And this is their payback, their response to that wave of national, even global, joy. A spasm of pure greed, and hatred for the very essence of sport: competition.

Tottenham and Manchester City will this weekend contest a final of a competition we know means nothing to them, the League Cup

This has been coming. Coming since the very first mention of financial fair play two decades ago. This was always the end game. FFP sought to limit investment, and investment is one of the keys to competition. It is hardly a convoluted path to move from financial means of limiting challenge to purely practical means by announcing a closed shop. June 30, 2008, was the first column I wrote linking financial controls to this denouement. The most depressing aspect of cynicism is how often you get proved right.

I got a text from a friend of mine at Manchester City on Monday morning. It was very honest. He admitted: 'We had a choice.' And that's true of us all.. We've got choices. I was scheduled to go to Aston Villa versus Manchester City on Wednesday. I won't bother.

Right now, I don't care about City's title. Don't care how they play. Not interested in praising them if they win. Not interested in their title, their dreams, their ambitions. It's all a sham anyway. I'd turn up just in the hope they would lose, except that would let Manchester United in, and they're worse. Ian Wooldridge, who did this job with such great distinction, didn't much bother with football in the end. I used to find that strange.

How can you write about sport, but not the national sport? It's like doing mathematics but not the number three. This morning, I get it. His stance wasn't a battle that could be won. Football wasn't going to change, he knew that. But we all have the right to no longer feel moved, inspired or compelled by it. We all have the right to say: no thank you.

Including you. What a club has with its fans is a social contract. And these six clubs have broken it. 'The most important of all the least important things,' was Jurgen Klopp's definition of the game, because of what it means to communities and wider society. And he's right. Watch a funeral cortege pass and you will know the team favoured by the departed because of the colour of the flowers. A football club is an allegiance taken to the grave. A man can have four wives and no-one bats an eyelid, but if he changes his team his friends will be outraged.

They say fine words about the progress of opponents like David Moyes' West Ham, but these sentiments are hollow.

But not this time, perhaps. Not having reneged on the social contract. Your club, if it is one of the six, has shown how much it cares about you. Shown how much it respects the moments that were important in your life. And now you can show them something, too.
Just keep in mind a date. April 18, 2021. That's your free pass. Produce it and we'll understand. 'I was an Arsenal supporter, until April 18, 2021...I followed Chelsea, but then April 18, 2021 came along...' We get it. No-one will judge you. 'RIP LFC 1892-2021 - SHAME ON YOU' read a sign outside Anfield on Monday. And, of course, Liverpool supporters are not going to start attending Goodison Park. But Tranmere Rovers will always need fans. I went to Marine when they played Tottenham in the FA Cup and they seemed a lovely club. Are New Brighton still going?

FC United of Manchester was formed on June 14, 2005, by disillusioned supporters of Manchester United, with the Glazer takeover as the catalyst. It can happen. Followers of Wimbledon did not decamp to Milton Keynes in 2002 but remained and founded a phoenix club. These are revolutionary steps. Revolutions are ambitious, so let's start with resistance.

To consumerism, to merchandise, to ticket renewal programmes, to subscription services, to social media. Liverpool's website on Sunday contained the announcement of the Super League, but no comment from any Liverpool director. Quoted, though, was Joel Glazer of Manchester United.
That is the understanding Liverpool's owners have of their fans. They think they want to hear from a Manchester United man at a time when the club's history is in the trash, and its future is a plastic plaything for US venture capitalists. These people do not deserve you. They don't deserve your time, they certainly don't deserve your money.
They have never forgiven Leicester for winning the league in 2016, their lips grew thinner
How many matches do you think they have watched, the ones who are trying to steal our game? Actually watched by attending? Sheikh Mansour has been to one, we know that. Stan Kroenke? John W. Henry? Joel Glazer? Joe Lewis? These are, to a man, absentee owners. Some would barely run out of fingers counting the matches they have seen.
So it is not disloyal to turn your backs on them and the soullessness they represent. Your commitment is already so much greater than theirs. More than a club; this means more; these were all slogans, sales pitches. It was only ever the money, the money, the money, the money. It was only ever about them.
The pity is that fans are not allowed in stadiums to tell these creatures what they think. They cannot even make their voices heard outside because if Henry cannot be bothered to explain through club media channels, he is hardly going to be troubled venturing to Liverpool to hear protests in person.
Same with the Glazers in Tampa, the Sheikh in Abu Dhabi, Lewis in whatever tax haven houses him these days. It is a pity that, in the final two weekends when fans are allowed back, the numbers will be so small there will probably be enough cheerleaders to reach capacity. Still, wouldn't it be wonderful if nobody went? If Manchester City paraded their latest bauble to row after row of empty seats, mirroring its worth.
If Manchester United's fans delivered a verdict every bit as damning as the days of green and gold. If Liverpool walked alone to You'll Never Walk Alone. They had a song at FC United, to the tune of Mellow Yellow by Donovan. 'I don't care about Rio,' it began, 'Rio don't care about me...' It was a reaction to Rio Ferdinand's new contract, which came to symbolise the disconnect between players and supporters.
Yet the players were never the enemy. Most were working-class men rewarded at the going rate for exceptional talent. This is different. What talent have the venture capitalists brought to English football? What is their gift to us all? Theft. The theft of our game, its beauty and uniqueness.


How many matches do you think they have watched, the ones like Stan Kroenke (left) and John W. Henry who are trying to steal our game?
Some are still not understanding what risks being lost here. A Leicester supporter was interviewed coming out of his team's FA Cup semi-final on Sunday. 'Sounds like a good idea,' he said of the Super League. 'It's another trophy for us to win.' No, it isn't. It is specifically designed so you cannot win, so you can never win, so you will never win. The odds aren't even 5,000-1. There are no odds. You're not on the racecard.
There is talk of five places being awarded in this league each season on merit. So, yes, technically Leicester could surmount all obstacles. Yet the merit qualifiers are excluded from the commercial pot worth 15 per cent of income, and half of the shared pot, estimated at roughly £1.6 billion.
The fee for playing in the group stage - which the big 12 do not even have to qualify for - is roughly £155m, for winning the tournament the bonus is just £25m. At the moment the Champions League winner trumps a group stage participant by 300 per cent.
So were Leicester to qualify, and win, the entire competition, they would make half of what Real Madrid would receive for being entered in the group stage automatically. So, no, it isn't a good idea; it isn't another trophy for Leicester to win; and by hijacking the wealth of European competition, the rich clubs are ensuring Leicester will never trouble them again. And you're meant to be loyal, to this? Fascinated, by this? Impressed, by this?
Forget a takeover at Newcastle, forget thinking big at Everton or Leeds. Why bother? There will be no surprises in football anymore, no spice. Liverpool finish outside the top four? Who cares, they're in anyway.

The pity is that fans are not allowed in stadiums to tell these creatures what they think, because they cannot make their voices heard outside
Arsenal could continue their downward trajectory and it would make not one atom of difference. There would be no winners in North London, except club owners. The last five teams to eliminate Manchester City, Tottenham, Chelsea, Arsenal and Manchester United from European knock-out rounds are Lyon, Dinamo Zagreb, Bayern Munich, Olympiakos and Sevilla and not one of them are in this competition. How super. How convenient. How terrified of failure must these plastic titans of the universe be?
Ultimately, though, we have options. 'If you support a club who have secretly plotted this coup then you have a choice,' wrote Danny Baker. 'To submit and adapt to the will of your big business masters or withdraw your time and money from this insidious power grab made in your name. Don't start up with "but my grandad supported this team, so I have to". Your grandad would have spat on this travesty of his club. Your blind craven support is what the money men behind it depend on. Football will never forgive you.'
And he's right. Your grandad fought a war. Nobody is asking you to storm the Normandy beaches. Just don't buy a shirt, don't buy a ticket, do not behave in any manner that might be taken as encouragement by these charlatans. Think you can do that? Right. Good. Off we go.

Just don't buy a shirt, don't buy a ticket, do not behave in any manner that might be taken as encouragement by these charlatans
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sport ... again.html
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Re: New Super League

Postby Outcast » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:02 am

We could try put a positive spin on it, 6 out of the hateful 9, Eufa and all our haters have taken a massive dent to their reputations, the so called historic clubs are now hated more than us.
I think this was a missed opportunity for our club to not to join and gain public praise, can you imagine the media haters meltdown!. On the other hand, if this sticks, we could miss out and left behind. We can't have It both ways, if we want to remain an elite club then we got to dance with devil. All we can do is speculate at this point. I can't say I'm surprised, it doesn't feel like a shock, had a feeling it was coming, I suppose the timing was bit of a surprise.
I genuinely don't know how I feel about it all, I'm not happy the way it's heading for sure.
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Re: New Super League

Postby johnny crossan » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:11 am

Outcast wrote:We could try put a positive spin on it, 6 out of the hateful 9, Eufa and all our haters have taken a massive dent to their reputations, the so called historic clubs are now hated more than us.
I think this was a missed opportunity for our club to not to join and gain public praise, can you imagine the media haters meltdown!. On the other hand, if this sticks, we could miss out and left behind. We can't have It both ways, if we want to remain an elite club then we got to dance with devil. All we can do is speculate at this point. I can't say I'm surprised, it doesn't feel like a shock, had a feeling it was coming, I suppose the timing was bit of a surprise.
I genuinely don't know how I feel about it all, I'm not happy the way it's heading for sure.

The silence from our club is eloquent - they did have a choice and they chose damnation, what can they say to justify that?
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Re: New Super League

Postby City64 » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:22 am

I just can’t imagine for one minute our owners got into this without an ulterior motive ??? This yank cartel tried to stitch us up within UEFA right ???
Peps thoughts and words are going to be absolutely huge in the coming hours , he is a very passionate politically motivated man , I can’t for one minute think he was kept in the dark and thrown under a bus like the yank owners have done to Klopp and OGS ? Did pep find out and deliberately throw that FA cup semi final ? Incredible few hours ahead ........
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Re: New Super League

Postby johnny crossan » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:29 am

City64 wrote:I just can’t imagine for one minute our owners got into this without an ulterior motive ??? This yank cartel tried to stitch us up within UEFA right ???
Peps thoughts and words are going to be absolutely huge in the coming hours , he is a very passionate politically motivated man , I can’t for one minute think he was kept in the dark and thrown under a bus like the yank owners have done to Klopp and OGS ? Did pep find out and deliberately throw that FA cup semi final ? Incredible few hours ahead ........

There is no ulterior motive, they are simply cashing in. They know the pain they have caused us fans by this betrayal but just don't care.
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Re: New Super League

Postby Mase » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:30 am

johnny crossan wrote:
City64 wrote:I just can’t imagine for one minute our owners got into this without an ulterior motive ??? This yank cartel tried to stitch us up within UEFA right ???
Peps thoughts and words are going to be absolutely huge in the coming hours , he is a very passionate politically motivated man , I can’t for one minute think he was kept in the dark and thrown under a bus like the yank owners have done to Klopp and OGS ? Did pep find out and deliberately throw that FA cup semi final ? Incredible few hours ahead ........

There is no ulterior motive, they are simply cashing in. They know the pain they have caused us fans by this betrayal but just don't care.


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Re: New Super League

Postby johnny crossan » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:36 am

EVERTON BOARD STATEMENT:

Everton is saddened and disappointed to see proposals of a breakaway league pushed forward by six clubs.

Six clubs acting entirely in their own interests.

Six clubs tarnishing the reputation of our league and the game.

Six clubs choosing to disrespect every other club with whom they sit around the Premier League table.

Six clubs taking for granted and even betraying the majority of football supporters across our country and beyond.

At this time of national and international crisis - and a defining period for our game - clubs should be working together collaboratively with the ideals of our game and its supporters uppermost.

Instead, these clubs have been secretly conspiring to break away from a football pyramid that has served them so well.

And in that Pyramid Everton salutes EVERY club, be it Leicester City, Accrington Stanley, Gillingham, Lincoln City, Morecambe, Southend United, Notts County and the rest who have, with their very being, enriched the lives of their supporters throughout the game's history. And vice versa.

The self-proclaimed Super Six appear intent on disenfranchising supporters across the game - including their own - by putting the very structure that underpins the game we love under threat.

The backlash is understandable and deserved – and has to be listened to.

This preposterous arrogance is not wanted anywhere in football outside of the clubs that have drafted this plan.

On behalf of everyone associated with Everton, we respectfully ask that the proposals are immediately withdrawn and that the private meetings and subversive practises that have brought our beautiful game to possibly its lowest ever position in terms of trust end now.

Finally we would ask the owners, chairmen, and Board members of the six clubs to remember the privileged position they hold – not only as custodians of their clubs but also custodians of the game. The responsibility they carry should be taken seriously.

We urge them all to consider what they wish their legacy to be.

Everton FC Board of Directors
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Re: New Super League

Postby salford city » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:44 am

johnny crossan wrote:
City64 wrote:I just can’t imagine for one minute our owners got into this without an ulterior motive ??? This yank cartel tried to stitch us up within UEFA right ???
Peps thoughts and words are going to be absolutely huge in the coming hours , he is a very passionate politically motivated man , I can’t for one minute think he was kept in the dark and thrown under a bus like the yank owners have done to Klopp and OGS ? Did pep find out and deliberately throw that FA cup semi final ? Incredible few hours ahead ........

There is no ulterior motive, they are simply cashing in. They know the pain they have caused us fans by this betrayal but just don't care.


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Re: New Super League

Postby Dameerto » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:45 am

There's no ulterior motive, our owners have turned their backs on English football.
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Re: New Super League

Postby BlueinBosnia » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:45 am

johnny crossan wrote:
Outcast wrote:We could try put a positive spin on it, 6 out of the hateful 9, Eufa and all our haters have taken a massive dent to their reputations, the so called historic clubs are now hated more than us.
I think this was a missed opportunity for our club to not to join and gain public praise, can you imagine the media haters meltdown!. On the other hand, if this sticks, we could miss out and left behind. We can't have It both ways, if we want to remain an elite club then we got to dance with devil. All we can do is speculate at this point. I can't say I'm surprised, it doesn't feel like a shock, had a feeling it was coming, I suppose the timing was bit of a surprise.
I genuinely don't know how I feel about it all, I'm not happy the way it's heading for sure.

The silence from our club is eloquent - they did have a choice and they chose damnation, what can they say to justify that?


I'm still hoping, in my heart of hearts, that we're leading the others on, only to pull out at the last minute, and damn them to play the competition on their own. I know it isn't the case, but I'm still hoping.

I still think, in spite of the mega-bucks allegedly on offer, that it's a massive risk. What if players start to say "I'll cash in in the Super League once I turn 28, but play in the CL, etc. until I'm ready." or flat-out refuse to join a Super League club on principle, with fans (and therefore sponsors) admiring their stance? If non-ESL European clubs make a gentlemen's agreement to refuse to sign players who've played in the Super League, it'll risk starting to look like (and going in the direction of) NASL in the 80s after 5 or 6 seasons.
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Re: New Super League

Postby johnny crossan » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:52 am

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:
nottsblue wrote:Don’t really know where to start on this....Football will adapt to the ESL in due course and probably quicker than we would admit to liking, but football will survive. It the beautiful game after all

This needs to go to Classic posts.Amazing summary. From personal point of view sums up how I feel about it.
Agreed, thank you NB for setting out your thoughts so well.
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Re: New Super League

Postby Dimples » Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:56 am

The Rags were the first club to go private on the stock market. That was the beginning of the end of football as we know it. Because that moved football from community and 'football people' ownership into being commercial businesses. That was the start of local fans becoming irrelevant.

Take Liverpool as an example.
Approx 50K local fans who generate 'atmosphere'.
Global fan base of approx 500 million who pay subscriptions, day trippers and buy merchandise.
Do the maths.

All football evolution has been self serving and driven by money and profit.
The PL is a Product, it is a money driven business with 'dodgy' practices like VAR to protect and preserve income.
Same for the CL.

What I do not understand is that it has taken this ESL proposal for local fans to realize they are no longer very important to their clubs. Also, that are saying nothing should change which is a vote for a rotten to the core PL, CL, EUFA and FIFA.

What is needed is a root and branch review and a returning of the clubs to their communities.
The Germans, as usual, lead the way on this. Even Munich are 51% owned by their fans.
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Re: New Super League

Postby Green & Blue » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:05 am

If we’re not careful we will be playing 60 minute games broken into quarters but with all the advertisements and endorsements it’ll take about 3 hours to complete a game.
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Re: New Super League

Postby Dameerto » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:05 am

The only time I care about European football is when it impacts on City's domestic games - and why I'm surprised there aren't more people as angry as I am today.
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Re: New Super League

Postby Nigels Tackle » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:08 am

Sums things up for me...

“Right now, I don't care about City's title. Don't care how they play. Not interested in praising them if they win. Not interested in their title, their dreams, their ambitions. It's all a sham anyway. I'd turn up just in the hope they would lose, except that would let Manchester United in, and they're worse.”
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Re: New Super League

Postby johnny crossan » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:08 am

Dimples wrote:The Rags were the first club to go private on the stock market. That was the beginning of the end of football as we know it. Because that moved football from community and 'football people' ownership into being commercial businesses. That was the start of local fans becoming irrelevant.

Take Liverpool as an example.
Approx 50K local fans who generate 'atmosphere'.
Global fan base of approx 500 million who pay subscriptions, day trippers and buy merchandise.
Do the maths.

All football evolution has been self serving and driven by money and profit.
The PL is a Product, it is a money driven business with 'dodgy' practices like VAR to protect and preserve income.
Same for the CL.

What I do not understand is that it has taken this ESL proposal for local fans to realize they are no longer very important to their clubs. Also, that are saying nothing should change which is a vote for a rotten to the core PL, CL, EUFA and FIFA.

What is needed is a root and branch review and a returning of the clubs to their communities.
The Germans, as usual, lead the way on this. Even Munich are 51% owned by their fans.

All fans give their own clubs special dispensation from the general corruption, greed and sleaze that afflict everybody else - hard to maintain that illusion in circumstances like these for us.
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