Tactics will change

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Re: Tactics will change

Postby BobKowalski » Thu Oct 07, 2010 12:29 pm

Douglas Higginbottom wrote:
IanBishopsHaircut wrote:
Dameerto wrote:
london blue 2 wrote:Is it just me that thinks that Boateng is not and will never be an attacking full back?


He is comfortable on the ball and capable of some accurate deliveries, give him a few more matches and you might change your mind. (He had a bad game against Newcastle in my opinion, but he hasn't got much Prem experience yet)


Well for a start he's only just got back to full fitness and he is STILL miles ahead of Richards


Not on the Newcastle showing he isn't. It looked liked like Micah was his personal coach.


Well it was Boateng's first ever Premiership game so I think we should give him at least 1 more before we write him off as crap and never be an attacking fullback
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby mcfc1632 » Thu Oct 07, 2010 12:33 pm

london blue 2 wrote:Is it just me that thinks that Boateng is not and will never be an attacking full back?


Wow - I have exactly the opposite opinion - comfortable on the ball - has pace enough - good crosser (remember the Barry goal against Valencia) and can really link up well - because he seems to have a good football brain - seems to have everything needed

Surely not even us CITY fans would get dismissive about a player because of an initial 'so-so' performance on his return from injury and his 1st PL experience (still was better than Micah! - who has had plenty of chances to impress)
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby Lees Alter Ego » Thu Oct 07, 2010 12:37 pm

So basically if we get a rb and a lb in for a rb and a lb we will play more attacking football? Not going to happen if you ask me. Yes they may get forward a bit mor ebut at the end of the day they are defenders. We have Ade fit, a top striker imo, so why not play him if we want to play more positive football. Maybe he just doesnt rate Ade and when Mario gets back he will stick him up front with Tevez. I just hope he doesnt push Tevez out wide. Wasted out there.

I dont really mind whatever he plays as long as we win though......
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby Lees Alter Ego » Thu Oct 07, 2010 12:40 pm

mcfc1632 wrote:
london blue 2 wrote:Is it just me that thinks that Boateng is not and will never be an attacking full back?


Wow - I have exactly the opposite opinion - comfortable on the ball - has pace enough - good crosser (remember the Barry goal against Valencia) and can really link up well - because he seems to have a good football brain - seems to have everything needed

Surely not even us CITY fans would get dismissive about a player because of an initial 'so-so' performance on his return from injury and his 1st PL experience (still was better than Micah! - who has had plenty of chances to impress)


I am not going to judge him from his first couple of games back but he has not been better than Micah. Micah actually puts a tackle in rather than backing off 20 yards an letting them get a tackle/shot in
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby london blue 2 » Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:02 pm

three people have attempted to put words in my mouth.

I never said he was shit.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby 13021J » Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:09 pm

Lees Alter Ego wrote: I just hope he doesnt push Tevez out wide. Wasted out there.

I dont really mind whatever he plays as long as we win though......

I fear that Tevez will be starting out wide which will be a real shame. However he will have license to roam and I trust Mancini. His 'negative' tactics have got us into 2nd so far.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby brite blu sky » Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:13 pm

Ted Hughes wrote:
Douglas Higginbottom wrote:It will be interesting to see how things develop over the next months if we do get a fully fit squad. I do believe Mancini will have realised that he needs to be a little more commited to attacking and the Tevez incident will have really stressed the need to do so but more than anything it could well be the reason why he has come out and said something now.

I think we all know by nature Mancini is a cautious thinking coach and it isn't just having a few injuries that have tailored his approach to games.We still wait to see what his team and set up will be when everyone is available. We expect to see 2 full backs marauding down the wings but ,if it's 4.3.3, what will the team be? Will he leave Tevez in the middle up front or is that where Balotelli fits in? Will there be just one holding player in the middle or will he still play Nigel with either Yaya or Barry?

The bottom line is that he will have options and change things to suit the opposition but the key to it all is what Mancini tells the players to do in terms of attacking ambition.We can play all the attacking players we want or indeed all the defensive players in a line up but if the manager tells them to be cautious and that the most important thing is not to concede then we might not see much change.If he releases the shackles a little and lets players get forward and run beyond the " strikers" then we will see a real difference.



If the fullbacks do get forward successfully, his 3 so called 'defensive' midfielders then make sense because he could play 3 attackers, 2 attacking fullbacks & have the 3 man midfield behind the ball peotecting & joining in by making late runs rather than leading the charge. He could also put Silva in there to join the front 3 & have 2 sitting giving us 6 attacking players on the counter.

Imo our biggest problem isn't personel or formations atm though, it's a lack of cohesive purpose & final ball. One example being; players don't go into the 6 yard box because the ball never comes, therefore the ball never goes in because there's nobody there to get on the end of it. We have no Bellamy for counter attacking so we need to have more purpose & togetherness in other attacking areas. We can't just rely on Balotelli & fullbacks as they could all strruggle in their 1st season. (I don't think they will struggle mind you, I think Balotelli in particular will be fucking fantastic once 100% fit) They could get injured again.

We need plans B, C, & D not just plan A.


Personally i feel that enough has been said by Mancini to indicate that he has been aware of the need for attacking intent, before he came out and clarified this. He mentioned the possibility of 3 strikers, that he wants attacking football, he bought 2 forward thinking FBs and Balotelli, Silva, Milner and even Yaya. Imo all the evidence points the same way... forward.

I really dont think he imagined Adebayor to disappear like he did and it has given him a slight problem. So no wonder tempers frayed when he was criticised.
It is all well and good us lot stating that he should attack as the best form of defence and just tell the players to get forward more, but he is out to secure the title if he can.. and first and foremost that means defensive discipline. I dont think that he is wrong to insist on maintaining that and looking instead for an evolution towards better attacking play and formations as and when we have the players he sees as delivering that fit and able.

He is cautious, at least so far. Bear in mind though that he is also learning still about the prem and the teams we face. For all we know he may have had a game plan to bring on Adebayor and AJ against NC all along, as they began to lose energy. If so it is a good strategy against a team he has never played before. Bear in mind he got burnt last season by a couple of sides and is not prepared for that to happen again. I think he will continue to play it fairly safe until he can both field the sides he wants to and then see how they go on, tweak it and go from there.

Even if he is a cautious man it doesn't directly mean that he will play cautious football.. perhaps not leave things to chance but always playing defensive minded football no, there is no direct link to that, despite the evidence of what we have seen in games this season.

Imo he will not let the team go gung-ho for fear of them losing the defensive discipline.. both in any one particular game and generally over time. Ted suggests that with the FBs overlapping we can eventually field 3 up front and have the 3 midfielders in flexible roles, winning the ball back and picking up loose balls, also running in and joining the strikers.
That system not only requires the players fit to do it, it will also require a fair amount of work to get right and a fair amount of games to see who excels at it. When at that stage the rest of the squad and players like Micah can learn to try and emulate what is required, because they have seen it in action and been a part of it in training.

Just think for a minute that the Owners and the Club want to be challenging for not only the Prem but to seriously have the ability to win the CL. Mancini has been brought in to achieve that, he has to have a plan to do so. not just wishful thinking. The system that Ted describes is similar to Barca.. they are still without doubt the best footballing side around, that means if things go to plan we will be expecting to play them and have the ability to beat them.
The Club have fast-tracked their investment to build a team able to do that, the expectation therefore is that the players we have are going to be more or less the players that are expected to pull that off. imo the only spending will come if players like Ade dont fulfill their promise.

It is still very much early days, especially so as Bobby has hardly had the chance to field the players he really wants to. There is so much to come from this squad we wont believe it when it happens.

I would also like to say that a team that can deal with the English Prem and play a formation akin to Barca will be almost unstoppable. Mancini has to learn how to break down and beat teams like Stoke. It is my opinion that if Barca played in the Prem they would get regularly beaten by Stoke type teams or Prem defensive set ups. Why, because as we saw in the CL final they simply do not have as Ted is concerned about... a plan B, never mind C or D.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby Niall Quinns Discopants » Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:55 pm

It's all well and good but it was his decision not to buy anyone attacking to central midfield.
Sometimes we're good and sometimes we're bad but when we're good, at least we're much better than we used to be and when we are bad we're just as bad as we always used to be, so that's got to be good hasn't it?


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Re: Tactics will change

Postby ayrshireblue » Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:58 pm

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:It's all well and good but it was his decision not to buy anyone attacking to central midfield.

Yeah, we could do with someone like Yaya Toure or James Milner!!
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby Niall Quinns Discopants » Thu Oct 07, 2010 2:00 pm

ayrshireblue wrote:
Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:It's all well and good but it was his decision not to buy anyone attacking to central midfield.

Yeah, we could do with someone like Yaya Toure or James Milner!!


Oh for FUCKS sake. Yaya is fine fine box-to-box midfielder but he is no FUCKING playmaker. Sometimes I swear.... I don't know.

Milner hasn't really featured us in central midfield and he isn't someone who opens defences regularily.
Sometimes we're good and sometimes we're bad but when we're good, at least we're much better than we used to be and when we are bad we're just as bad as we always used to be, so that's got to be good hasn't it?


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Re: Tactics will change

Postby brite blu sky » Thu Oct 07, 2010 2:02 pm

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:It's all well and good but it was his decision not to buy anyone attacking to central midfield.



ha ha nice try !
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby ayrshireblue » Thu Oct 07, 2010 2:34 pm

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:Oh for FUCKS sake. Yaya is fine fine box-to-box midfielder but he is no FUCKING playmaker. Sometimes I swear.... I don't know.

I could have swore I saw him play a defence splitting pass against Juventus that resulted in a goal. In my book, that makes him a playmaker. Sometimes I swear.... you don't know.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby london blue 2 » Thu Oct 07, 2010 2:58 pm

ayrshireblue wrote:
Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:Oh for FUCKS sake. Yaya is fine fine box-to-box midfielder but he is no FUCKING playmaker. Sometimes I swear.... I don't know.

I could have swore I saw him play a defence splitting pass against Juventus that resulted in a goal. In my book, that makes him a playmaker. Sometimes I swear.... you don't know.


Barton did that once...
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby CityFanFromRome » Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:11 pm

Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:Oh for FUCKS sake. Yaya is fine fine box-to-box midfielder but he is no FUCKING playmaker. Sometimes I swear.... I don't know.

Milner hasn't really featured us in central midfield and he isn't someone who opens defences regularily.

Who did you want then, Kakà? Diego? Iniesta or Xavi? Or who else? We could have taken a shot at Van der Vaart, sure, but he's hardly world class, is he? Besides, isn't David Silva a playmaker?

I'm just saying that buying a top class playmaker is not as easy as it may seem, there are some good prospects around Europe but those who are already world class aren't going to come to us and with the young prospects I mentioned you are always taking a gamble.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby brite blu sky » Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:48 pm

CityFanFromRome wrote:
Niall Quinns Discopants wrote:Oh for FUCKS sake. Yaya is fine fine box-to-box midfielder but he is no FUCKING playmaker. Sometimes I swear.... I don't know.

Milner hasn't really featured us in central midfield and he isn't someone who opens defences regularily.

Who did you want then, Kakà? Diego? Iniesta or Xavi? Or who else? We could have taken a shot at Van der Vaart, sure, but he's hardly world class, is he? Besides, isn't David Silva a playmaker?

I'm just saying that buying a top class playmaker is not as easy as it may seem, there are some good prospects around Europe but those who are already world class aren't going to come to us and with the young prospects I mentioned you are always taking a gamble.


Go and revive the playmaker thread CFFR if you want to carry on that debate with nqdp ( he is just trying to wind everyone up ).
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby CityGer » Thu Oct 07, 2010 4:52 pm

I'm starting to get a bit puzzled by Bobby's regular referenes to our 'injury problems'. Yes, we have been unlucky with the lack of availability of key defenders and Mario being out but on Sunday we had as full a squad available to us as your likely to have over the course of a season. His comments and constant reference to this would have you believe that our squad has been ravaged by injury, it hasn't really and for Bobby to come out and say his style of play is being shaped by injuries to the squad is a bit of an odd one for me.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby Douglas Higginbottom » Thu Oct 07, 2010 5:14 pm

CityGer wrote:I'm starting to get a bit puzzled by Bobby's regular referenes to our 'injury problems'. Yes, we have been unlucky with the lack of availability of key defenders and Mario being out but on Sunday we had as full a squad available to us as your likely to have over the course of a season. His comments and constant reference to this would have you believe that our squad has been ravaged by injury, it hasn't really and for Bobby to come out and say his style of play is being shaped by injuries to the squad is a bit of an odd one for me.


I wondered when somebody would say this. I agree that he has made more of it than he should have. I suspect other teams have had more injuries and Spurs have for definite.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby Blue in the face » Thu Oct 07, 2010 7:32 pm

Douglas Higginbottom wrote:
CityGer wrote:I'm starting to get a bit puzzled by Bobby's regular referenes to our 'injury problems'. Yes, we have been unlucky with the lack of availability of key defenders and Mario being out but on Sunday we had as full a squad available to us as your likely to have over the course of a season. His comments and constant reference to this would have you believe that our squad has been ravaged by injury, it hasn't really and for Bobby to come out and say his style of play is being shaped by injuries to the squad is a bit of an odd one for me.


I wondered when somebody would say this. I agree that he has made more of it than he should have. I suspect other teams have had more injuries and Spurs have for definite.



I think Roberto deliberately makes statements like this with a bit of tongue in cheek, not to make excuses, but for disinformation for other people. A bit like saying chelsea are going to win the premiership. I believe that was to wind up baconface, not because he has given up already. Its possible he's playing mind games and is subtle enough that nobodys figured it out yet.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby Ted Hughes » Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:14 pm

The player he's missed most is Bellamy.

I wonder if he'll risk Balotelli v Arsenal (if fit) or whether it'll be a bench job? It would be very unboblike to drop one of his grafters against a passing team like Arsenal but their defence is very very dodgy & they know nothing about Balotelli, so he could turn them over. Wenger won't know what to tell his defenders re dealing with him. Difficult one.
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Re: Tactics will change

Postby brite blu sky » Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:42 pm

Ted Hughes wrote:The player he's missed most is Bellamy.

I wonder if he'll risk Balotelli v Arsenal (if fit) or whether it'll be a bench job? It would be very unboblike to drop one of his grafters against a passing team like Arsenal but their defence is very very dodgy & they know nothing about Balotelli, so he could turn them over. Wenger won't know what to tell his defenders re dealing with him. Difficult one.



I'd hazard a guess that if fit he may bring on Balotelli at about 60 mins when the Arse defence is a bit less perky.
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