Mancini

[Ted Hughes]

People thought he did well today? I find that astonishing! I thought that everything he's done well since he came to the club became a complete nonsense today. He changed both the team & the formation, so all the work he's done on the defense was completely undermined by a shambles in front of it & 3 changes to the usual organised back 4. He suddenly decided to start swapping the wingers around NOW in front of an untried back 4 rather than doing it in earlier games when we had a settled team that could work it & he also decided to suddenly play 2 up front, AT THE SAME TIME AWAY FROM HOME. Fucking stupid & unneccessary.

When he reverted to his usual system, we looked much better & scored ALL of our goals. Why not just try a few changes here & there in past games rather than being rigid as fuck & one dimensional then suddenly, one day change everything at once? It's like he let the press or fans pick his team/tactics, responding to criticisms rather than doing what he knows best & has built on.

I really believe that Mancini can win us everything but I also think that his biggest danger is purely himself. He makes his own job much much harder & undermines his own good work by sudden untried random changes rather than logical evolution of tactics/selection.

to be honest i love about 90% of your posts. And this isn't one of them. Mancini reacted to injuries to some key players and got 3 points. That's all.

cheers

cheers

There were changes which could have been avoided & didn't work at all on the day, cocking up our usual tightness. He could have played a more well rehearsed team by using Zabba &/ or Micah, or, he could have made less changes/experiments with the rest of the team so that the players ahead of them perform their tried & tested roles which, in other games, has involved being a tight unit when we've lost the ball. Instead, we suddenly had Milner & Johnson swapping over, Boateng racing off down the wing & no one covering, Blackpool running through the great big fucking gap with poor ol Vinny & Lescott trying desperately to come accross & cover it. Adebayor's inclusion had already meant we were a player down from our usual midfield formation.

I have nothing against ANY of those changes but no way should they all be suddenly happening on the same day, away from home. It's too much. Imo he didn't treat the threat of Blackpool with the respect they clearly deserved & only good fortune & Tevez rescued a situation which was very close to complete collapse at times. We soon have Kolarov & Balotelli coming back but imo if we suddenly make huge changes to tactics & formation to suit them, like we did yesterday, we're in danger of coming badly unstuck. We should have tried these things in more games earlier, but now, we should do it gradually, game by game, not all at once.

[dazby]

Ted, I'm pretty sure the formation we started with was the same formation we finished the barcodes game with.

[13021J]

I think Yaya's absence hit us hard, at times we were overun in midfield. The introduction of Silva was a masterstroke, but why not 20 mins earlier?

Ade was abysmal, hopefully another start on Thursday will get him going. I want him to succeed because when in form he is unstoppable. So I'm not a fan of the vitriol on this site. Yes his gait and general demeanour looks lazy but I'm sure he wants to succeed more than anyone. Would actually like to see him paired with RSC on Thursday (tin hat on!).

Anyway Mancini has done very well so far, remember we were unlucky against Bburn and Sunderland and we must have hit the post 3 or 4 times yesterday. The formation was wrong yesterday until Silvas arrival but so many have been moaning about another striker.

A win against Arse would really put the cat amongst the pigeons!!

[Ted Hughes]

Ted, I'm pretty sure the formation we started with was the same formation we finished the barcodes game with.

You're probably right but it hasn't been used much & we've then thrown it in front of a much changed defence. It's too much stuff to accommodate at once & we'll get spanked sooner or later if we keep making so many changes in one go. To me, it's a home formation or a chasing the game formation, (when we should have done it more in the past) not a tough away game formation. Mancini has done a lot of work on organisation & it's worked. We can still be very positive in attitude without chucking it away.

[Feed The Goat]

I'm still to be convinced. However it feels weird being as though we are sitting so nicely in the table. I might still be whinging as we win the title! He's got the results so far so maybe I should shut up.

I've been telling you for weeks to shut up. Moaning when we win makes you sound spoiled. It's not end to end stuff but it is normally 3 points for city.

[simon12]

If we win when we play like this, how good are we gonna be when it clicks? 3 points are what are important at the moment the rest will come.

[Douglas Higginbottom]

Interesting and overall there is a full balance of comments in this thread.
Colins post nice and positive and well considered.Ted's overpessimistic and somehow negative and then NQDP somehow brings Hughes into it.That takes talent Anti!

With regard to the BPool game Mancini had to make changes with the Toure's out and I guess he felt the time was right to go 2 up front to properly get at BPool as there defence is their weakness.It didn't work out as he had hoped and we will all have thoughts on why. Maybe it's down to Ade having a poor day, maybe it's just because the team are not used to the system or maybe it's just because BPool were a little better than they expected. Whatever Ade was taken off and the rest is history.

To suggest taking Ade off and putting Silva in his best role was a masterstroke is somewhat OTT. A blindman would have done that and the only question I and others raised was why it took him so long? Fair enough to give Ade a go but it had been clear it wasn't working for a long time.

As for Mancini overall the jury might still be out on some things but you can't argue that:
1) We are sitting 2nd and now almost everone ( scum fans apart) are citing us as the real challengers to Chelsea.
2) He has shown his authority within the camp. Maybe still not 100% unity but showing who is boss is very important.
3) Our "success" is based on sound defence which usually is how it has worked for all successful teams of the past.
4) We are winning games whilst not playing great which is maybe the sign of the right mentality he goes on about.
5) He has a good calm manner( most of the time) and deals with the press well ( saying very little)
6) Touch wood he is a lucky manager. Didnt he once say that is most important?

[MaineRoadMemories]

I've written on here plenty of times that winning and points is secondary to me and that entertainment is what I pay to see when I go home and away. I know its a extreme minority view but its a valid view nethertheless.

Yesterday's game was fantastically entertaining, end to end and some good individual pieces of skill from both sides. Throw in a heap of good luck and it was well worth the entrance fee. (The padded seats at the game helped too; Blackpool have padded seats don't you know!)

Mancini is doing very well at the moment, results wise and should be praised for that. On the other side, however, the team isn't as good as it should be at this stage of the season. Take a certain Mr Tevez out of our team and then we'd see how good Mancini is at the moment.

We should not be a one man team but currently are. Hopefully by Christmas that will no longer be the case.

[CityFanFromRome]

Regarding yesterdays game, Despite the fact that they had couple of decent chances, I always felt we'd grind it in the end. They huffed and puffed but we remained calm and sensible and knew that eventually chances would open. And if we had had decent striker there instead of Adebyor, we would've been three up in half time.

Also, taking Adebayor off and putting Silva there behind Tevez IN ATTACKING PLAYMAKER ROLE was a masterstroke and there was no question about the winner after that.

Robbie Manc, I salute you.

I knew we would win it when DJ Campbell missed that sitter and right after they got a disallowed goal which could have easily stood if Grandin hadn't been considered active in the action (which is debatable). And of course I agree regarding Silva, but after all, he IS a playmaker, and there was no doubt he would be employed there, considering that Johnson and Milner were still on the pitch ;)

[Ted Hughes]

I've written on here plenty of times that winning and points is secondary to me and that entertainment is what I pay to see when I go home and away. I know its a extreme minority view but its a valid view nethertheless.

Yesterday's game was fantastically entertaining, end to end and some good individual pieces of skill from both sides. Throw in a heap of good luck and it was well worth the entrance fee. (The padded seats at the game helped too; Blackpool have padded seats don't you know!)

Mancini is doing very well at the moment, results wise and should be praised for that. On the other side, however, the team isn't as good as it should be at this stage of the season. Take a certain Mr Tevez out of our team and then we'd see how good Mancini is at the moment.

We should not be a one man team but currently are. Hopefully by Christmas that will no longer be the case.

I agree with all of that but I think Mancini's very very close to producing the best team in the league & it's only one or two bizarre judgements which are slowing it down.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

Interesting and overall there is a full balance of comments in this thread.
Colins post nice and positive and well considered.Ted's overpessimistic and somehow negative and then NQDP somehow brings Hughes into it.That takes talent Anti!

With regard to the BPool game Mancini had to make changes with the Toure's out and I guess he felt the time was right to go 2 up front to properly get at BPool as there defence is their weakness.It didn't work out as he had hoped and we will all have thoughts on why. Maybe it's down to Ade having a poor day, maybe it's just because the team are not used to the system or maybe it's just because BPool were a little better than they expected. Whatever Ade was taken off and the rest is history.

To suggest taking Ade off and putting Silva in his best role was a masterstroke is somewhat OTT. A blindman would have done that and the only question I and others raised was why it took him so long? Fair enough to give Ade a go but it had been clear it wasn't working for a long time.

As for Mancini overall the jury might still be out on some things but you can't argue that:
1) We are sitting 2nd and now almost everone ( scum fans apart) are citing us as the real challengers to Chelsea.
2) He has shown his authority within the camp. Maybe still not 100% unity but showing who is boss is very important.
3) Our "success" is based on sound defence which usually is how it has worked for all successful teams of the past.
4) We are winning games whilst not playing great which is maybe the sign of the right mentality he goes on about.
5) He has a good calm manner( most of the time) and deals with the press well ( saying very little)
6) Touch wood he is a lucky manager. Didnt he once say that is most important?

My mum always told me I got talent. Point is though that exactly the same people who were gutted to see Hughes go are being overly critical on Mancini. Who, let's face it, is doing miles better job than Hughes was by anyone's standards. But let's leave it at that.

Regarding the other point, I both agree and disagree with you. While it was blatantly obvious Adebayor needed to be taken off, I'd say before the game, when Mancini decided his line up, there were good shouts for either to be given a start. Adebayor has been moaning about sitting on the bench and Tevez has been moaning about having to play up front on his own. So Mancini gave it a go. You'd expect Adebayor and Tevez come with mind blowing performance after getting their way, right? Once Mancini had given it a good go he threw Silva in there and we started performing. For me that was clear sign to moaning Tevez that "look, I'm willing to listen to other ideas but there's a reason why I'm manager with multiple titles and you are a player".

I wholehartedly agree with your six points too. I'd say only two things that go against him are occasionally setting the midfield in too negative manner and that League Cup fiasco. I can tolerate the entertainment value argument as succesfull football means different things to different people. And there's really no excuses for that back four in League Cup. But other than that, for me at least, he is doing sterling job.

[Douglas Higginbottom]

Interesting angle on the BPool formation/team.I was watching soccer saturday and it was said that City will pick the same team formation as they have all season and play the same way.After all why wouldn't they as they are second and it is working. Then the comment was made that it would be disrespectful to Bpool not to pick the same side! But there again it was Merson who said it!

I think it was a fairly logical game to try Ade with Tevez and I would love to know what Tevez thought about the selection before and after the game.I hope though that Tevez problem isn't about whether he has a " striker" on the pitch with him but more the fact that the other players too often don't get forward and in contact with him to play.

On the C Cup I too was disappointed we gave it away but just hope that everything else goes well( including Europe) to mitigate and justify what he did.

[Dameerto]

I pretty much agreed with the way he did things to be honest - he likes to keep either Silva or AJ on the bench until late in the second half to run at a tiring defence, he obviously wanted to start with AJ (out wide, naturally) and an extra man up front meaning he couldn't really fill Yaya's slot as a more advanced midfielder since Silva would have been the natural choice (Milner having to play wide opposite AJ). So circumstances and one eye on the next two games dictated a four man midfield. No one can argue with his substitutions, they changed the game.

[Ted Hughes]

Interesting angle on the BPool formation/team.I was watching soccer saturday and it was said that City will pick the same team formation as they have all season and play the same way.After all why wouldn't they as they are second and it is working. Then the comment was made that it would be disrespectful to Bpool not to pick the same side! But there again it was Merson who said it!

I think it was a fairly logical game to try Ade with Tevez and I would love to know what Tevez thought about the selection before and after the game.I hope though that Tevez problem isn't about whether he has a " striker" on the pitch with him but more the fact that the other players too often don't get forward and in contact with him to play.

On the C Cup I too was disappointed we gave it away but just hope that everything else goes well( including Europe) to mitigate and justify what he did.

My problem with it is changing to two up front, plus going through several other changes in formation on a day when we've already changed 3 of the back 4 (which I didn't agree with either as I would have played Micah & Zabba). In effect Mancini created almost a full 11 which had no idea what it was doing & each time it started to find out what it was doing, he switched the positions! After a while we'd started to randomly whack long balls down the pitch to nobody whilst Blackpool played the kind of football we normally try to play. It was utter nonsense & embarrassing imo. As soon as we went back to a system the players knew, with Silva in Yaya's position, we ran the game. If Silva hadn't come on, the comments on here today would be somewhat different! Imo there was no need for so much change.

I just don't get why Mancini seems to make his own job so much harder at times. He's pretty much done all the hard work & built the team. All he needs to do now is exercise a bit more common sense imo & he's cracked it. I find it very frustrating.

[Wooders]

We're doing great but I think one or two people are overlooking the fact that we are riding our luck?

2 of yesterdays goals were decidely "iffy" - one offside and one foul that should have stopped play before tevez scored - last week we were given a penalty that never was and they were denied a stonewaller....

2 games in a row were decisions have gone our way and there has been other games this season as well, where we have been backed by lady luck and come away with the points, rather than on skill and hardwork alone

[petrov]

Mancio sometimes drives me mental but the bottom line is we're 2 points behind Chelsea, sitting second after almost 1/4 of the season. Good enough for me. Mancini = frustrating at times, hard to watch at times, but always effecient. Our only defeat this season was a daft last minute peno against a Sunderland side who are excellent at home.

My opinion on him is changing, are we really lucky to be winning games without playing brilliantly? or maybe we've just got a good manager in charge who despite being negative, gets the job done almost each and every time.

[CityFanFromRome]

We're doing great but I think one or two people are overlooking the fact that we are riding our luck?

2 of yesterdays goals were decidely "iffy" - one offside and one foul that should have stopped play before tevez scored - last week we were given a penalty that never was and they were denied a stonewaller....

2 games in a row were decisions have gone our way and there has been other games this season as well, where we have been backed by lady luck and come away with the points, rather than on skill and hardwork alone

If anything, this is the biggest sign of us actually becoming one of the big boys. How many times what you pointed out has happened to the rags, or Chelsea, or Arsenal, not to mention Liverpool?

[Douglas Higginbottom]

Interesting angle on the BPool formation/team.I was watching soccer saturday and it was said that City will pick the same team formation as they have all season and play the same way.After all why wouldn't they as they are second and it is working. Then the comment was made that it would be disrespectful to Bpool not to pick the same side! But there again it was Merson who said it!

I think it was a fairly logical game to try Ade with Tevez and I would love to know what Tevez thought about the selection before and after the game.I hope though that Tevez problem isn't about whether he has a " striker" on the pitch with him but more the fact that the other players too often don't get forward and in contact with him to play.

On the C Cup I too was disappointed we gave it away but just hope that everything else goes well( including Europe) to mitigate and justify what he did.

My problem with it is changing to two up front, plus going through several other changes in formation on a day when we've already changed 3 of the back 4 (which I didn't agree with either as I would have played Micah & Zabba). In effect Mancini created almost a full 11 which had no idea what it was doing & each time it started to find out what it was doing, he switched the positions! After a while we'd started to randomly whack long balls down the pitch to nobody whilst Blackpool played the kind of football we normally try to play. It was utter nonsense & embarrassing imo. As soon as we went back to a system the players knew, with Silva in Yaya's position, we ran the game. If Silva hadn't come on, the comments on here today would be somewhat different! Imo there was no need for so much change.

I just don't get why Mancini seems to make his own job so much harder at times. He's pretty much done all the hard work & built the team. All he needs to do now is exercise a bit more common sense imo & he's cracked it. I find it very frustrating.

I sort of get what you are saying Ted but you are exagerating a bit too much.The plan with playing Ade with Tevez shouldnt actually be as much oif a big change as it seems. Tevez loves to drop deeper anyway but it's essential he gets plenty of movement around him so he can either play with them or use their movement and the space it creates. Sadly Ade just hasnt got it right yet either with the movement or the control when he does get involved.

Mancini needs whoever he plays to be able to fit into that sort of scenario. It will be fascinating to see how it works when mario joins the fray.Will he play up top or in a different wide striker role joining in at the right times.I wouldnt know whther he has a great touch or not yet but for sure we will see him shooting on sight when given the chance.

[Ted Hughes]

We're doing great but I think one or two people are overlooking the fact that we are riding our luck?

2 of yesterdays goals were decidely "iffy" - one offside and one foul that should have stopped play before tevez scored - last week we were given a penalty that never was and they were denied a stonewaller....

2 games in a row were decisions have gone our way and there has been other games this season as well, where we have been backed by lady luck and come away with the points, rather than on skill and hardwork alone

If anything, this is the biggest sign of us actually becoming one of the big boys. How many times what you pointed out has happened to the rags, or Chelsea, or Arsenal, not to mention Liverpool?

This is very true but I don't think we really need to rely on luck & ref's decisions in games like yesterday. We're just getting it wrong from the start in some games. We've got almost everything in place & Chelsea, rags etc don't look special to me. We just need to be a bit smarter all round & we could finish above them.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

We're doing great but I think one or two people are overlooking the fact that we are riding our luck?

2 of yesterdays goals were decidely "iffy" - one offside and one foul that should have stopped play before tevez scored - last week we were given a penalty that never was and they were denied a stonewaller....

2 games in a row were decisions have gone our way and there has been other games this season as well, where we have been backed by lady luck and come away with the points, rather than on skill and hardwork alone

If my aunt had balls and all that though. I mean it's impossible to tell what would've happened if those decisions had gone against us.

It has to be said though we had got our rub of green this season. Thing is though, these things will even themselves out in long term. We will have shocking decisions going against us this season, that I'm sure of.