Marwood Article

[Swales4ever]

It's a great read & I agree it probably signalled the end of Hughes but it also shows how the bosses have a plan to make the structure of the club run independantly of the manager which is something I've been calling for. if it means sacrificing a manager or two in order to achieve it then so be it. Mancini seems to be happy with it though.

I'd like to see it taken one step further. I'd like us to have a style of play built into the fabric of the club, like Barca do, so players at every age are taught to pass & move & have an attacking tradition just like Barca. Whoever takes on the managers job then has to win stuff in the tradition of the club. Barca have proved it can be done. We can adapt it for our football & be the English version. It sounds as if that model may be the one Marwood is following & that's fantastic. I won't slag him anymore!

Ted this 'style' thing smacks a bit of Arsenal. Lots of style, no trophies. Whilst Barca have an excellent crop of worldy players right now I'm not sure it was always the same nor will it be, it's just all come together. In the past they used the Real model of buying. And a certain team over the road had a very good crop of youngsters in the early 90s and bugger-all since, though some RAG journos still refer to their 'youth system'.

That said if we can avoid another Pearce then great!

I certainly can't see another English/British manager at the club for many years (not that I'm remotely arsed about this).

It didn't just 'come together' it was planned by Johann Cruyff. This run of success is a direct result of Cruyff overhauling the Barca youth system & instilling a method into the training at every level. They play the same at every level & they play the right way at every level so they fit together like clockwork when they reach the 1st team. It is similar to Arsenal but Wenger's signings to augment it are mostly overrated crap wheras Barca's are quality. The manager, Pep Guardiola is even a product of that system & has been promoted from the academy.

Signings are still crucial, even at academy level, but the signings are chosen to fit into the style & when they don't, like Ibrahimovic, they go. We can build a Premier League version. [highlight]Doesn't have to be identical to Barca, just the principals of pass & move & quality.[/highlight]

Glad You start to realize what modern winning football is about and the old glory 4-4-2 Forth Apache array is over since few later than 1966... lol

[Alioune DVToure]

It's a great read & I agree it probably signalled the end of Hughes but it also shows how the bosses have a plan to make the structure of the club run independantly of the manager which is something I've been calling for. if it means sacrificing a manager or two in order to achieve it then so be it. Mancini seems to be happy with it though.

I'd like to see it taken one step further. I'd like us to have a style of play built into the fabric of the club, like Barca do, so players at every age are taught to pass & move & have an attacking tradition just like Barca. Whoever takes on the managers job then has to win stuff in the tradition of the club. Barca have proved it can be done. We can adapt it for our football & be the English version. It sounds as if that model may be the one Marwood is following & that's fantastic. I won't slag him anymore!

Ted this 'style' thing smacks a bit of Arsenal. Lots of style, no trophies. Whilst Barca have an excellent crop of worldy players right now I'm not sure it was always the same nor will it be, it's just all come together. In the past they used the Real model of buying. And a certain team over the road had a very good crop of youngsters in the early 90s and bugger-all since, though some RAG journos still refer to their 'youth system'.

That said if we can avoid another Pearce then great!

I certainly can't see another English/British manager at the club for many years (not that I'm remotely arsed about this).

It didn't just 'come together' it was planned by Johann Cruyff. This run of success is a direct result of Cruyff overhauling the Barca youth system & instilling a method into the training at every level. They play the same at every level & they play the right way at every level so they fit together like clockwork when they reach the 1st team. It is similar to Arsenal but Wenger's signings to augment it are mostly overrated crap wheras Barca's are quality. The manager, Pep Guardiola is even a product of that system & has been promoted from the academy.

Signings are still crucial, even at academy level, but the signings are chosen to fit into the style & when they don't, like Ibrahimovic, they go. We can build a Premier League version. Doesn't have to be identical to Barca, just the principals of pass & move & quality.

In a sense though he's right to say that this isn't a guarantee of success. When Guardiola was at Barcelona, they had a few dodgy periods where they struggled to even qualify for the UEFA. They also made a few iffy or inconsistent signings in those days, such as Patrick Kluivert and our very own Geovanni. They're on much surer footing now, but to have three players with the raw talent of Messi, Xavi and Iniesta at once is something of a Godsend.

By the way, the level of considered debate this Saturday morning seems sky high. Might have to get up more frequently at the weekend.

[Ted Hughes]

It's a great read & I agree it probably signalled the end of Hughes but it also shows how the bosses have a plan to make the structure of the club run independantly of the manager which is something I've been calling for. if it means sacrificing a manager or two in order to achieve it then so be it. Mancini seems to be happy with it though.

I'd like to see it taken one step further. I'd like us to have a style of play built into the fabric of the club, like Barca do, so players at every age are taught to pass & move & have an attacking tradition just like Barca. Whoever takes on the managers job then has to win stuff in the tradition of the club. Barca have proved it can be done. We can adapt it for our football & be the English version. It sounds as if that model may be the one Marwood is following & that's fantastic. I won't slag him anymore!

Ted this 'style' thing smacks a bit of Arsenal. Lots of style, no trophies. Whilst Barca have an excellent crop of worldy players right now I'm not sure it was always the same nor will it be, it's just all come together. In the past they used the Real model of buying. And a certain team over the road had a very good crop of youngsters in the early 90s and bugger-all since, though some RAG journos still refer to their 'youth system'.

That said if we can avoid another Pearce then great!

I certainly can't see another English/British manager at the club for many years (not that I'm remotely arsed about this).

It didn't just 'come together' it was planned by Johann Cruyff. This run of success is a direct result of Cruyff overhauling the Barca youth system & instilling a method into the training at every level. They play the same at every level & they play the right way at every level so they fit together like clockwork when they reach the 1st team. It is similar to Arsenal but Wenger's signings to augment it are mostly overrated crap wheras Barca's are quality. The manager, Pep Guardiola is even a product of that system & has been promoted from the academy.

Signings are still crucial, even at academy level, but the signings are chosen to fit into the style & when they don't, like Ibrahimovic, they go. We can build a Premier League version. [highlight]Doesn't have to be identical to Barca, just the principals of pass & move & quality.[/highlight]

Glad You start to realize what modern winning football is about and the old glory 4-4-2 Forth Apache array is over since few later than 1966... lol

City played pass & move quality football in 1968 with 11 Englishmen in the team & Mercer & Allison in charge. Just because a load of wankers have fucked it up since, doesn't mean it's anything new.

[Swales4ever]

Glad You start to realize what modern winning football is about and the old glory 4-4-2 Forth Apache array is over since few later than 1966... lol

City played pass & move quality football in 1968 with 11 Englishmen in the team & Mercer & Allison in charge. Just because a load of wankers have fucked it up since, doesn't mean it's anything new.

That's just what I was deeming by "few later than 1966", which indeed is quite before than when The Clockwork Orange teached the world what actually modern is...
Anyway, as usual with You Ted, I am overly glad to stand correct in that sense... :-)

And hey, I wasn't born in UK nor I have Saxons Blood in my veins, neither I live in Antarctica...:-) but the football played by Mercer & Allison's Legends is one of the first footy momories of mine too. Btw.

[mcfc1632]

makes me think Marwood isn't a wanker, although i've no idea why i thought he was anytway.

Know what you mean Bingo - I think that it is because he has been 'in the shadows' - there has been a lot of mistrust - and you have to think why - lots of us affected by it - he seems to have been blamed for all sorts - including Bellamy - for no obvious reason other than people want to blame someone

But we need to go forward with a strategy - a plan - we are not 'liddle city' anymore - good to read that - more evidence that we have these strategies and plans

BTW - OT - but as I am typing this - Dunnie just put in another OG - god - love him - but I do not miss that

[ronk]

This is a brilliant article - and surprisingly revealing. It also suggests to me that Marwood's arrival and the job they had earmarked for him was the death knell for Hughes. Italian managers are used to this kind of intrusion from people behind the scenes, whereas British managers like either total control or all their own people in jobs around them.

It's a fascinating read.

I wouldn't talk of "intrusion" - if I may - but teamwork.
What should be spotted is that - even if for us fans football is still a romantic passion - for Clubs' Owners is - since a couple of decades at least -[highlight]a very demanding "Corpotate Investment"[/highlight].
Therefore - being absolutely bright and clear that a trust of brains and different qualifications works better and more efficiently that the very best of the best single person - it is plain that a Company which invests billions of GBPs cannot be runned by a single person alone [even more truer if such a single is not a Stanford PhD but a former footballer].

On a side line I have no problem to agree with You that my poor country is a very big mess as brightly reflected from the Country's Government downward.... but the supposed single plenipotentiary managing model is a joke for any top Club in the World. Apart from the Swamp maybe, but the last years events seems to enforce my argument even there.

Fair enough yeah. When I say "intrusion" I'm thinking of how British managers might see the appointment of such individuals. They tend to be control freaks. With their jobs so unstable, they like to surround themselves with their own people so not to be undermined. The continent is different and Italy in particular, where many characters behind the scenes have a say in a manager's treasured realm: transfer policy. It's the same at Real Madrid, although they seem to have invested a lot more authority in José Mourinho than they ever did in Schuster, for example.

As for the bit I've underlined, fair enough but I never said anything along those lines to either agree or disagree with. Don't want people to start thinking I'm anti-Italian!

Hughes was part of an entire management team that came in together to take over the running of the club. That was his method, and it made replacing him mid-season that bit more difficult. As Marwood said, he worked hard for us but his ethos was at odds with the long term plan. We need a system that's bigger than any individual, you can see the same with Chelsea. They've chopped and changed managers without having to go out and make big squad changes or transform the way they play. They have an essential character.

It will be interesting to see how things pan out in terms of "life skills" for young players. It's easier said than done and we've certainly not been immune on that front, Ireland and Barton are proof enough but there's also been guys like Bradley Wright-Phillips. Getting that attitude right will be essential for the long term development of the club. You can see the sorts of things we've been doing in terms of mixing uber-professional players with youth who might benefit from the leadership (Adam Johnson, Micah Richards).

You can very much see the effects of the moral collapse of many English players in terms of what's been going on with the English national side and the players therein. Shrek just played the ultimate taboo card in order to get himself a bigger pay deal when he was already on what was a fair package.

[Mase]

Winter is a shithouse and has stuck the knife in many a time since we've been taken over. Saying that this is a nice piece of insight in to goings on in the background at City.
Good to see about the Johnson - Moses decision. Definitely made the right choice there. We need to be patient with Johnson though, and like Marwood says "keep his feet on the ground".
With regards to the Milner comment, it seems like Marwood likes to get to know the players personally rather than just sign them and then leave the rest to Bobby which in my opinion is a good thing. If the players feel wanted and know they're being looked after, that message will get passed on when they're on international duty to players from other clubs.

All in all quite a good insight.

[Wonderwall]

Winter is a shithouse and has stuck the knife in many a time since we've been taken over. Saying that this is a nice piece of insight in to goings on in the background at City.
Good to see about the Johnson - Moses decision. Definitely made the right choice there. We need to be patient with Johnson though, and like Marwood says "keep his feet on the ground".
With regards to the Milner comment, it seems like Marwood likes to get to know the players personally rather than just sign them and then leave the rest to Bobby which in my opinion is a good thing. If the players feel wanted and know they're being looked after, that message will get passed on when they're on international duty to players from other clubs.

All in all quite a good insight.

Milners article the other week was very good also. He doesn't want to go out drinking as ha has seen how players have got themselves into trouble and in a mess because of it. He said he understands the playing side of his career is relatively short and he is going to do all he can to maximise it. I wish all pro's would have that attitude, unfortunately in England, Milner is a rare commodity.

[Ted Hughes]

Winter is a shithouse and has stuck the knife in many a time since we've been taken over. Saying that this is a nice piece of insight in to goings on in the background at City.
Good to see about the Johnson - Moses decision. Definitely made the right choice there. We need to be patient with Johnson though, and like Marwood says "keep his feet on the ground".
With regards to the Milner comment, it seems like Marwood likes to get to know the players personally rather than just sign them and then leave the rest to Bobby which in my opinion is a good thing. If the players feel wanted and know they're being looked after, that message will get passed on when they're on international duty to players from other clubs.

All in all quite a good insight.

Winter may have put out some critical articles but he's also put out more pro-City stuff like this, than just about any other writer for the nationals except perhaps Martin Samuel & has argued our case on radio & tv on numerous occasions. He may give us a slating occasionally but him & Samuel are the nearest thing we've got to neutral honest reporters in the national media when it comes to City .

[Ted Hughes]

Glad You start to realize what modern winning football is about and the old glory 4-4-2 Forth Apache array is over since few later than 1966... lol

City played pass & move quality football in 1968 with 11 Englishmen in the team & Mercer & Allison in charge. Just because a load of wankers have fucked it up since, doesn't mean it's anything new.

That's just what I was deeming by "few later than 1966", which indeed is quite before than when The Clockwork Orange teached the world what actually modern is...
Anyway, as usual with You Ted, I am overly glad to stand correct in that sense... :-)

And hey, I wasn't born in UK nor I have Saxons Blood in my veins, neither I live in Antarctica...:-) but the football played by Mercer & Allison's Legends is one of the first footy momories of mine too. Btw.

Fair enough.

[Swales4ever]

This is a brilliant article - and surprisingly revealing. It also suggests to me that Marwood's arrival and the job they had earmarked for him was the death knell for Hughes. Italian managers are used to this kind of intrusion from people behind the scenes, whereas British managers like either total control or all their own people in jobs around them.

It's a fascinating read.

I wouldn't talk of "intrusion" - if I may - but teamwork.
What should be spotted is that - even if for us fans football is still a romantic passion - for Clubs' Owners is - since a couple of decades at least -[highlight]a very demanding "Corpotate Investment"[/highlight].
Therefore - being absolutely bright and clear that a trust of brains and different qualifications works better and more efficiently that the very best of the best single person - it is plain that a Company which invests billions of GBPs cannot be runned by a single person alone [even more truer if such a single is not a Stanford PhD but a former footballer].

On a side line I have no problem to agree with You that my poor country is a very big mess as brightly reflected from the Country's Government downward.... but the supposed single plenipotentiary managing model is a joke for any top Club in the World. Apart from the Swamp maybe, but the last years events seems to enforce my argument even there.

Fair enough yeah. When I say "intrusion" I'm thinking of how British managers might see the appointment of such individuals. They tend to be control freaks. With their jobs so unstable, they like to surround themselves with their own people so not to be undermined. The continent is different and Italy in particular, where many characters behind the scenes have a say in a manager's treasured realm: transfer policy. It's the same at Real Madrid, although they seem to have invested a lot more authority in José Mourinho than they ever did in Schuster, for example.

As for the bit I've underlined, fair enough but I never said anything along those lines to either agree or disagree with. Don't want people to start thinking I'm anti-Italian!

I do appreciate Your posts since a while Alioune and I never thought You are anti (in general) nor anti-Italian in particular.

On the other hand, it just takes to read the history of our contemporary becoming as a "Social Comunity", from destruction of the inheritage of our common law to the build-up of the World's hugest public debt (in relative terms) along with the constant thread of our passion for "Men of Destiny" to draw a fair assessment.
Well, we still have terrific landscapes, more than half the Monuments of the World, some passionate and brave people [including the City Manager], pizzas and mandolins... but... :-(

[craigmcfc]

He's got bloody good eyesight has Marwood if he's "surveying the impressive set-up at Manchester City's Platt Lane Academy" from that photo. He's looking out from the bleeding spirals at CoMS!

Good article nevertheless

[Alioune DVToure]

He's got bloody good eyesight has Marwood if he's "surveying the impressive set-up at Manchester City's Platt Lane Academy" from that photo. He's looking out from the bleeding spirals at CoMS!

Good article nevertheless

Haha. I clocked that as well - he's clearly on the spiral of either Bell or East. He's got particularly good vision if he's outside East.

[craigmcfc]

He's got bloody good eyesight has Marwood if he's "surveying the impressive set-up at Manchester City's Platt Lane Academy" from that photo. He's looking out from the bleeding spirals at CoMS!

Good article nevertheless

Haha. I clocked that as well - he's clearly on the spiral of either Bell or East. He's got particularly good vision if he's outside East.

Must be looking at the reflection in McDonalds window

[Alioune DVToure]

This is a brilliant article - and surprisingly revealing. It also suggests to me that Marwood's arrival and the job they had earmarked for him was the death knell for Hughes. Italian managers are used to this kind of intrusion from people behind the scenes, whereas British managers like either total control or all their own people in jobs around them.

It's a fascinating read.

I wouldn't talk of "intrusion" - if I may - but teamwork.
What should be spotted is that - even if for us fans football is still a romantic passion - for Clubs' Owners is - since a couple of decades at least -[highlight]a very demanding "Corpotate Investment"[/highlight].
Therefore - being absolutely bright and clear that a trust of brains and different qualifications works better and more efficiently that the very best of the best single person - it is plain that a Company which invests billions of GBPs cannot be runned by a single person alone [even more truer if such a single is not a Stanford PhD but a former footballer].

On a side line I have no problem to agree with You that my poor country is a very big mess as brightly reflected from the Country's Government downward.... but the supposed single plenipotentiary managing model is a joke for any top Club in the World. Apart from the Swamp maybe, but the last years events seems to enforce my argument even there.

Fair enough yeah. When I say "intrusion" I'm thinking of how British managers might see the appointment of such individuals. They tend to be control freaks. With their jobs so unstable, they like to surround themselves with their own people so not to be undermined. The continent is different and Italy in particular, where many characters behind the scenes have a say in a manager's treasured realm: transfer policy. It's the same at Real Madrid, although they seem to have invested a lot more authority in José Mourinho than they ever did in Schuster, for example.

As for the bit I've underlined, fair enough but I never said anything along those lines to either agree or disagree with. Don't want people to start thinking I'm anti-Italian!

I do appreciate Your posts since a while Alioune and I never thought You are anti (in general) nor anti-Italian in particular.

On the other hand, it just takes to read the history of our contemporary becoming as a "Social Comunity", from destruction of the inheritage of our common law to the build-up of the World's hugest public debt (in relative terms) along with the constant thread of our passion for "Men of Destiny" to draw a fair assessment.
Well, we still have terrific landscapes, more than half the Monuments of the World, some passionate and brave people [including the City Manager], pizzas and mandolins... but... :-(

Thanks for the kind words. And remember, MANCIO4EVER, there are only two things in this world that Alioune DVToure hates: Those intolerant of other cultures and the 'Antarcticans.' :)

I know from when I did my European Studies degree (not to mention the hundreds of Italian Erasmus students I've met) that Italy is a shit place to be a social democrat/democratic socialist or any other type of progressive. That said, you beat us hands down on women, weather, food, drink, art, architecture et cetera, ad infinitum.... So take the rough with the smooth!

Back on topic...

[Alioune DVToure]

He's got bloody good eyesight has Marwood if he's "surveying the impressive set-up at Manchester City's Platt Lane Academy" from that photo. He's looking out from the bleeding spirals at CoMS!

Good article nevertheless

Haha. I clocked that as well - he's clearly on the spiral of either Bell or East. He's got particularly good vision if he's outside East.

Must be looking at the reflection in McDonalds window

The crafty bastard. No wonder Milner's afraid to stay up beyond 9pm or eat crisps.

[ronk]

Thanks for the kind words. And remember, MANCIO4EVER, there are only two things in this world that Alioune DVToure hates: Those intolerant of other cultures and the 'Antarcticans.' :)

I know from when I did my European Studies degree (not to mention the hundreds of Italian Erasmus students I've met) that Italy is a shit place to be a social democrat/democratic socialist or any other type of progressive. That said, you beat us hands down on women, weather, food, drink, art, architecture et cetera, ad infinitum.... So take the rough with the smooth!

Back on topic...

What have the Romans ever done for Latin?