Mancini (The Ted Hughes and BBS thread)

[superkev8705]

I'd just like to know how many/which games have actually got people out of their seats thinking, that was awesome, or very good, or even good?

If you can, then put them down.

First half v West Brom away on Sunday. At the moment thats all i can think of.

And Chelsea Away 4-2

[CityFanFromRome]

We've drawn with the most consistent side in the league, a team thats unbeaten. They played crap against everyone else and won, played well against us and couldnt beat us and people are still moaning. Its not like a home draw against Rochdale. Way too much whinging round here. It was a good result, we defended brilliantly and we contained a United team who were kicking into gear.

This. I would have loved for us to win last night, but a draw is still better than a loss.

[Douglas Higginbottom]

I'd just like to know how many/which games have actually got people out of their seats thinking, that was awesome, or very good, or even good?

If you can, then put them down.

For me the answer is none.But I am guessing that's what Chelsea fans thought with Jose M. Certainly that's how it will have been as he started there and was on the way to winning things.Now Chelsea are deemed to be the strongest side in England and on good days murder teams and are great to watch but it wasn't always that way.

[CityFanFromRome]

Keeping this on Mancini, I still think his position is basically untenable. He's turned into Ranieri - if he doesn't get us to top 4, he'll get sacked, but if he does, we'll stand a chance of attracting a 'top' coach and he'll be out as soon as the contract's agreed.

I think the one thing which could save him is to play decent football, the sort you'd expect for several hundred million investment. If he makes us look like Barca and we're still winning, why would anyone want to change it and the fans would be happy, the stadium would sell out more qickly, people in Nepal would be buying de Jong replica tops, we'd be convinced he could win a title and everything would be rosy.

As I can't see the middle paragraph happening, he'll be gone in summer either way.

I have a feeling you're wrong on that account. He won't be gone in the summer because he'll bring us to top four and will be given the possibility to fight for the title for a longer time.

[Scatman]

I'd just like to know how many/which games have actually got people out of their seats thinking, that was awesome, or very good, or even good?

If you can, then put them down.

For me the answer is none.But I am guessing that's what Chelsea fans thought with Jose M. Certainly that's how it will have been as he started there and was on the way to winning things.Now Chelsea are deemed to be the strongest side in England and on good days murder teams and are great to watch but it wasn't always that way.

and look how many managers they got to sack on the way to achieving it. Who says it doesn't work?

[Beeks]

The thing is who would we get in the summer?

The Special One?

He plays exactly the same type of football as Bobby

[Beefymcfc]

I'd just like to know how many/which games have actually got people out of their seats thinking, that was awesome, or very good, or even good?

If you can, then put them down.

For me the answer is none.But I am guessing that's what Chelsea fans thought with Jose M. Certainly that's how it will have been as he started there and was on the way to winning things.Now Chelsea are deemed to be the strongest side in England and on good days murder teams and are great to watch but it wasn't always that way.

No Doug, under Mourinho they played good possession football that even though it wasn't the prettiest, it did have drive and enthusiasm to get a goal. Chelsea under everyone else have evolved and become a team that dominates games with incise passing and strong athletic footballers. We also have those qualities within our squad, it's just a pity they are not seen unless the perfect 11 are out on the field.

[superkev8705]

I'd just like to know how many/which games have actually got people out of their seats thinking, that was awesome, or very good, or even good?

If you can, then put them down.

For me the answer is none.But I am guessing that's what Chelsea fans thought with Jose M. Certainly that's how it will have been as he started there and was on the way to winning things.Now Chelsea are deemed to be the strongest side in England and on good days murder teams and are great to watch but it wasn't always that way.

I dont think we have that fear factor either. When teams play Chelsea away they talk about keeping the score down etc but from looking at other teams forums before we play the Blackburns, Birminghams, Boltons etc they still think they can come and take a point or even take all 3. Proved by the fact that some sides never stick 10 men behind the ball all game when they play us as they think we are beatable (which we are)

[Beefymcfc]

The thing is who would we get in the summer?

The Special One?

He plays exactly the same type of football as Bobby

This is the thing mate, I, and many I talk to, do not want to get rid of Mancini as there isn't many who have a track record like him. The problem for me is the style and performance that the team pushes out.

Mancini must succeed, and by the points total so far is doing a good job. But fuck me, it's going to kill my spirit to watch if he carries on with the same old boring shit that I've seen for nearly 12 months (yes, a year). I may find myself staying on the concourse a bit longer now talking to my good friends Foster and Heini!

[CityFanFromRome]

I'd just like to know how many/which games have actually got people out of their seats thinking, that was awesome, or very good, or even good?

If you can, then put them down.

All those where City has won, for me. Any game when City wins is a good game by my book, if City wins against teams like ARsenal, Pool, Chelsea, the rags then it's very good/awesome. And no, it wouldn't be the same to just see the result at the end, because I would miss the pleasure and thrill of going through the game watching the lads play it.

So for me the 3-0 win on Liverpool and the 1-0 win on Chelsea were awesome/very good this season.

[john68]

Beefy,
1...I understand your concern mate and like you, Ted, Piccs and a few others I agree that what we are seeing NOW isn't great and Like you, I want to see us not only swashbuckling our way to 3pts each week but sometimes at least appearing to want to win. I don't think anyone, given the choice would disagree. But as I have said in other threads, at present we are a half built house and in the middle of a still changing project.
2...Mancini is under pressure, more so than most other managers, he has been instructed to qualify for the CL and he is not allowed to fail. Qualification is his holy grail above everything else.

Looking at the squad, he has a reliable defence which hopefully will be even more efficient when Boateng and Kollarov get a few more games under their belts and get up to full speed. I think he also feels comfortable with the midfield and has a solid defensive strategy that this season now has an outlet in Silva. It is up front that he needs to strengthen and he knows that. He has made no secret of his wish to buy another top quality striker to compliment Tevez and remember that even Mario isn't considered as the final jigsaw piece. I am certain he will return to signing Torres, Dzeko, Rooney or AN Other.

Though we may not agree with it, nor like it, this present set up is not the final squad and there is no reason to consider that his present tactics and strategies are the ones he will employ when he has the strikers he wants in place. As much as I agree with you that I am not comfy with what happened last night, I am hopeful that this is a temporary phase that will change for the better in the future and am willing to sit tight and see how/if it develops.

[Ted Hughes]

The thing is who would we get in the summer?

The Special One?

He plays exactly the same type of football as Bobby

Tbf he doesn't. Real Madrid still look just like Real Madrid now but are a bit stronger at the back. I have no interest in him at the moment though.

I want to see Bob given time. I don't think he's negative in every game, quite the opposite in fact, sometimes he's gone mental in an attacking sense & left us wide open. I just think he makes the wrong decisions at times & those times have been quite often up to now. So long as he improves us significantly in each department as we go along though, I'd be willing to accept him staying even if we missed 4th, provided we look the part by the end of the season.

In the meantime though, I think I'm entitled, along with others, to criticise the failings when they occur, of a bloke who has an easier opportunity to create a football team than anyone in history. He should get it right & he should be open to criticism when he doesn't.

[Beefymcfc]

Beefy,
1...I understand your concern mate and like you, Ted, Piccs and a few others I agree that what we are seeing NOW isn't great and Like you, I want to see us not only swashbuckling our way to 3pts each week but sometimes at least appearing to want to win. I don't think anyone, given the choice would disagree. But as I have said in other threads, at present we are a half built house and in the middle of a still changing project.
2...Mancini is under pressure, more so than most other managers, he has been instructed to qualify for the CL and he is not allowed to fail. Qualification is his holy grail above everything else.

Looking at the squad, he has a reliable defence which hopefully will be even more efficient when Boateng and Kollarov get a few more games under their belts and get up to full speed. I think he also feels comfortable with the midfield and has a solid defensive strategy that this season now has an outlet in Silva. It is up front that he needs to strengthen and he knows that. He has made no secret of his wish to buy another top quality striker to compliment Tevez and remember that even Mario isn't considered as the final jigsaw piece. I am certain he will return to signing Torres, Dzeko, Rooney or AN Other.

Though we may not agree with it, nor like it, this present set up is not the final squad and there is no reason to consider that his present tactics and strategies are the ones he will employ when he has the strikers he wants in place. As much as I agree with you that I am not comfy with what happened last night, I am hopeful that this is a temporary phase that will change for the better in the future and am willing to sit tight and see how/if it develops.

We are in near full agreement mate, but if a manager cannot get our current group of players to perform at a higher level than that then I'm afraid for the future of his sides. It's OK saying he hasn't got his players whereas in reality he took of a very decent squad, failed to attain the goal he was set and then went out and bought half a squad to suit his own picture. I'm sure even I, or you, could have relative success with what resources have been supplied to him.

And from your last line it seems you also have no real faith either, instead opting to go with the belief that with more high calibre players it will push us further up the table and performances will get better.

I have the fortitude to stick this out mate, and support the manager. What I can't do is say that I am impressed or believe at this moment that he's done anything of note to appease my worry of what he is aiming to achieve - the players can do that on their own.

As you know, I'm not usually critical of any manager or pessimitic in my views, however I just don't see any progress being made in terms of performance or in real points. I'm going to be watching the Brum game with real optimism with a view to changing my outlook, but if it's as dire as some of the other games, well, I might just give up on the topic all together.

[sandman]

I ask myself the following questions when I am feeling doubtful;

1. Am I confident we will have our highest finish in the Premier League?

Yes

2. Am I confident we will be playing Champions League Football next year?

Yes

3. Has the manager had sufficient time (full season with HIS team?)

No

4. Is there anybody else available that is proven at his level but in this league?

No

5. Is there anybody else AVAILABLE that is proven better than his level in any other league?

No

6. Have we taken points off our benchmark (Top of the league)?

Yes... 3

7. Am I impressed with the majority of his signings?

Yes

[john68]

Beefers,
The only point we differ on is our possible perception of the future. Like you, I don't KNOW where it will take us. I can only make my opinion on what I see or hear and should we buy a Torres, a Dzeko or a (God forbid) a Rooney, I cannot for the life of me believe mancini will not use them with Tevez. If Mancini does land such a player, I cannot for the life of me believe that he would use that firepower in a more positive set of tactics.
I am not convinced by many of the things mancini has done up to this stage but can see (hope) where it will possibly develop. For that reason and that reason alone I am not happy but willing to put up with the present (over) caution until such time as we see what Mancini does when he gets lands heavier artillery.

[superkev8705]

I ask myself the following questions when I am feeling doubtful;

1. Am I confident we will have our highest finish in the Premier League?

Yes

2. Am I confident we will be playing Champions League Football next year?

Yes

3. Has the manager had sufficient time (full season with HIS team?)

No

4. Is there anybody else available that is proven at his level but in this league?

No

5. Is there anybody else AVAILABLE that is proven better than his level in any other league?

No

6. Have we taken points off our benchmark (Top of the league)?

Yes... 3

7. Am I impressed with the majority of his signings?

Yes

Cant argue with that

[carl_feedthegoat]

The thing is who would we get in the summer?

The Special One?

He plays exactly the same type of football as Bobby

I take it you dont watch RM matches then mate.

Its a myth all this Boring football that he plays.....anyway - I dont want him here just yet....Ill give Mancini some time and see where we are come end of the season..but having said that, along the way we need to stay in the top 4 and we need to excel in the F.A cup and Europa cups

Im still not convinced he has the dressing room on his side and IMO there are still some players who are just not on the same wavelengh with each other..professionally and/or personally.

[blues2win]

I still think we're a couple of players short of a really good side. I hate Tevez up front on his own. He's always running back to the play rather than looking to get behind the defence. If we had midfielders who got in behind it wouldn't matter so much but how many times did you see Toure, Silva, Milner or Barry look to get behind Vidic and Ferdinand? The result was that United played a high line and were able to squeeze the space to virtually zero.

My conclusion is that we have a solid spine with Hart Vinnie Kolo Nigel and Tevez. We have two full backs Boateng and Kolarov who'll be fine given time. What we lack is a young Didier Drogba or a Torres who can really take the game to our opponents and a midfielder who gets PAST the ball and gives our passing midfielders options when they need them. Yaya and Silva had no options yesterday that's why they looked bad.

So on Saturday whoever plays in midfield just occasionally make some aggressive forward runs so that Silva and Yaya (and for that matter the wide midfielders and overlapping full backs) can pick you out. If you do that we'll win and win well. And of course when they make those runs they need to be covered by another player.

[colonel_muck]

we have better players than tottenham. but they look better than us, don't throw the current league table at us i'm talking about attacking performance. and it's down to team spirit. last year apart from the head to head at the end, we both had home derbies, tottenham hadn't beaten arsenal in the premier league since 1993 and pulled it out of the bag. we let in a last minute winner in one the most boring manchester derbies i've ever seen, until last night. i want a manager who knows how to get the players riled up in the right way. the tactics were questionable last night (wrong in my eyes but it worked against chelsea). should man city really be happy with hoping to catch the big teams off guard in these games for a single goal? for me no. i will never be happy with that mentality. i've seen nothing in his game that suggests he is other than a typical italian manager which i feared. i think under hughes we clicked superbly at home going forward and he was the man who should have been given time. plus craig bellamy would have played lasy night with tevez instead of YAYA TOURE. Just quit roberto and do me a favour.

[The Man In Blue]

we have better players than tottenham. but they look better than us

i'll take our 6 PL clean sheets and comfortable 4th to their 1 clean sheet and lagging behind tbh - and the spuds fans i know tell me they would do the same.