The Yaya Toure 'Munich' song

[ant london]

[carl_feedthegoat]

[Im_Spartacus]

http://www.redcafe.net/f6/club-treatmen ... rs-107202/

Some very interesting comments about Harry Gregg's book. Should really be mandatory reading for rags, because they clearly have no idea at all what their club did.

[Beefymcfc]

[King Kev]

[twosips]

ffs - twice on this forum i've tried to reply to this over the past few days but for each time as i've pressed submit this forum has asked me to login again - when i login i take me back to the reply window with an empty box. SO very frustrating. I have my reason.

My main point in response though is 'so what? what has this got to do with United's morals? its about or own'

i've never once said United's morals are impeccable or anything. They're not - but just cos theirs are shit, why should we lower ourselves to their level? It's a childish 'well he does it so why can't i!' attitude. Something I grew out of when i was about 12. If you can't see the validity in your own actions without comparing them to someone elses then what's the fucking point.

I never once implied the rags morals' were impeccable. I was looking at our actions. I couldn't give a fuck about what happens over at Old Trafford. I'll just look at our behaviour and isolate it as it is.

(I seriously wrote fucking loads, and i can't be arsed typing it out again - stupid forum)

Oh and the daily mail thing with balotelli - i'll give you all that. it is ridiculous. While I don't believe the Mail have an agenda with US in particular, i feel they have an agenda with whoever the most headline grabbing club happens to be (which sadly is us) and whoever the public enemy no.1 and most headline grabbing player is (Balotelli sadly)...its a despicable paper. It writes reactionary things and loves to tarnish anything that the majority of the public fear. And let's be honest, we're no longer everyone's favourite little City. We're an easy target often making ourselves even easier to strike.....despite all this, I still think the Mail were right to write about the Munich chants. Wrong about the Balo incident, yes, but right on that one thing.

[saulman]

It'll be interesting to hear if the chant gets sung today. Also, if it does, if the word gets replaced.

[BlueMoonAwoken]

i hear comedians making poor refrence to joseph fritzel and his daughter, i dont see front page news of these comedians taking the piss out of a innocent girl that has been consistently raped all her life and think thats what happens when you grow up!

City fans making refrence by saying the word "munichs" is absolutely nothing if i was a rag makes me shudder thinking about it, but if i was and i was called a munich, i would just reply with yeah your massive or bitters etc..........
It is a "word" nothing else.

Twosips did you complain to the bbc when russel brand and johnathan ross slagged off manuel? you sound extremely touchy an over the top over a word m8.

[twosips]

Of course I didn't give a shit about Ross and Brand. Completely irrelevant really. Two unfunny pricks anyway if we're gonna raise that issue - sure we can always agree on that?

Thing is - i'm not a risky comedian who relies on tasteless jokes to get kicks, and most City fans aren't trying to be funny when singing these songs. They're just singing them to piss United fans off. Tis all just a little bit too hateful. That's the distinction imo.

I'm not some overly PC mong. I've joked about Fritzl etc like pretty much everyone else has. I've got a sense of humour. I just think this is all a bit 'hmmmm' and doesn't really paint us very well. It's not really about humour too is it?

The 'just a word' argument is a bit silly too really isn't it? It's like saying nothing ever should be offensive ever cos they're only words. Doesn't work that way and it never will.

[walmai]

I once went to see City play, with a mate, at Selhurst Park, and you got the whole of the lower tier of the stand opposite the dug-outs. Think it was a promotion push. Your support was, as ever, all over the place, in the ground and outside.

Of the two loudest noises of the afternoon were:

1. The cheer that went up when it was confirmed that West Ham had won at Old Trafford (Defoe scored it), and
2. The song that nobody around me had any kind of compunction at all in singing. It was simple, despite being totally confusing to anyone but the singers. It was Town full of Munichs (you're just a town full of Munichs). We were in the pub afterwards. Palace fans were just non-plussed by it. I don't recall anyone expressing any feelings of offence.

When I was a bin, we'd sing the song about the disaster to Man United. I wouldn't be surprised if I learnt about the incident by singing that song. Of course, it is - if taken at face value - a fairly ugly idea, to sing a song of hate about a disaster, but that's what football was like those days. If it had a place in the 80's and its arguable it didn't, it hasn't got one now; tribal hatred dictated by geography has all but fizzled out for most people.

File under Harry Roberts.

[guv111]

I'm not sure if this has already been addressed, but is anyone apart from me totally indifferent to these chants/songs?

It seems you either sing them and love them for their wind-up potential, or you hate them with a passion because it's insensitive and nasty, and because Frank Swift died. Personally, I would never sing a Munich song, but if someone sung them because of the way the Rags have turned a tragedy into "Munich 1958 PLC" I'd have little to condemn anyone for. Torino lost an entire championship-winning squad to a similar air crash - a far worse one - but they haven't rammed it down people's throats for a lifetime. Nor have they turned it into a money-making and fan-recruiting exercise, to the best of my knowledge.

[john68]

I'm sorry TwoSips but your replies "so what, what has this got to do with Uniteds morals?" or that you don't give a shit about Ross and brand, are totally inadequate. You consider only the morals of City fans...but on what authority? What makes you the conscience of City fans?
I have no problem with nor is this a criticism of your own morals but those are your own. If you wish to preach to others about their lack of morals, surely that should apply to all and not just to a small group who you choose to select for your attacks.

Regarding the United morals, it actually has everything to do with it. You attacked KK for his view without knowing, nor semingly caring why that view was held, nor did you seem interested. I know that KK's opinion is very much driven by the disrespect shown by United to their own, whilst demanding respect to be shown by everyone else. In that, the actions of United, far from having nothing to do with it, actually have everything to do with it.

If you are, as you put yourself forward as, a defender of morals, then you should be defending those morals whereever they are compromised. You seem to be only concerned with the morals of individuals wearing sky blue, whilst ignoring those held by the rags and the media.

You are in fact guilty of exactly the same crime as the rags and the media.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

[john68]

Antti,
Arjan will probably admit openly to have been wasted in many places.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

[King Kev]

City fans were singing "We'll Sing What We Want" today, good to see some have retained a sense of humour.

[twosips]

[BlueMoonAwoken]

Twosips for as much as i agree with what your trying to say, it just sounds like your asking for a perfect world. Last year at the semi final at coms when the rags let flares go when the lights went out the whole stadium started shouting at once "munichs" "munichs" i looked around and it was nearly every fan.

at the time i was thinking all the anger and hatred for that club stems from how they handled and treated the munich air survivors and used it to build their fanbase across the globe. As well as everything else they do all summed up into 1 word "munichs".....

I wasnt alive when it happened and anytime i have sang it with the rest of the supporters i wasnt thinking about how it would piss them off it was just a label for them, as they dont see how shite their own club is.

Im no historian and as much as id love no horrible things to be sang at football or horrible things that go on after the game, or horrible things in the world for that matter. I just think its part of football and your wasting your energy mate.

But you are right.

[Original Dub]

Just watching a shit Irish TV show called Katherine Lynch's Wagon's Den.

She fancies herself as a bit of a comedian - she just said her mother had all her teeth taken out, but it was fine because she's a hooker... then she said "50 euro and you get more head than Lady Di's dashboard".

When the audience gasped and groaned she said "Its a joke, relax. Comedy is tragedy plus time, its 15 years ago, get over it".

I'm not sure what side of the argument this helps, or if it helps at all, I just found it relevant to thread so I thought I'd share!

[BlueMoonAwoken]