Foreign Satellite Decoders Allowed In Pubs

[zuricity]

I have no problem with

A. A free market, as in the US. Where no license fees are required, pure advertising and voluntary payments or endowments ( for PBS or NPR for example).

B. Having to put up with adverts.

I wish the government would remove the license fee for the beeb and allow the beeb to advertise. That might help against sky.

I can never get my head around having to pay for a decoder to watch adverts ! I thought i was paying to watch football.

Anyway did the cheapskate pub owner pass her discounts onto her customers in a reduction in prices ? Probably not.

The uk tv / radio market is not a free market at all.

[Bluez]

This is all over the place at the moment so I wouldn't make any assumptions here. There are hundreds of different scenarios but the one that stands out for me is that, as far as this country goes, it may be that nothing has changed after all.

It states that the graphics are copywrite of the Premier League & can only be used with the consent of the Pl. Whenever I see PL games on foreign channels, they almost always have the PL graphics on the broadcast. If those channels were to block the graphics, the PL may refuse to sell them the games, so therefore, if you show the game without permission you are infinging on the copywrite of the PL.

This, all they will do is ensure the PL logo is always (or regularly visible) and nothing will change. Placing it in the center circle would make it impossible to photoshop out so pubs will be in exactly the same situation now.

[ronk]

This is all over the place at the moment so I wouldn't make any assumptions here. There are hundreds of different scenarios but the one that stands out for me is that, as far as this country goes, it may be that nothing has changed after all.

It states that the graphics are copywrite of the Premier League & can only be used with the consent of the Pl. Whenever I see PL games on foreign channels, they almost always have the PL graphics on the broadcast. If those channels were to block the graphics, the PL may refuse to sell them the games, so therefore, if you show the game without permission you are infinging on the copywrite of the PL.

This, all they will do is ensure the PL logo is always (or regularly visible) and nothing will change. Placing it in the center circle would make it impossible to photoshop out so pubs will be in exactly the same situation now.

We have one match on TV this month, 2 next. During that time we have 11 matches scheduled so far. We're of huge interest at the moment. We have a system at the moment where matches aren't on TV all that often, but the rights are huge.

We're paying massively over the odds for really poor service (in comparison to best practice in other sports).

[Crossie]

As far as im aware you can watch a stream with no implications, its the person at source who is breaking broadcasting copyright rules.

[Mark (Blue Army)]

As far as im aware you can watch a stream with no implications, its the person at source who is breaking broadcasting copyright rules.

Does that still apply if you pay for the stream mate?

[zuricity]

This is all over the place at the moment so I wouldn't make any assumptions here. There are hundreds of different scenarios but the one that stands out for me is that, as far as this country goes, it may be that nothing has changed after all.

It states that the graphics are copywrite of the Premier League & can only be used with the consent of the Pl. Whenever I see PL games on foreign channels, they almost always have the PL graphics on the broadcast. If those channels were to block the graphics, the PL may refuse to sell them the games, so therefore, if you show the game without permission you are infinging on the copywrite of the PL.

This, all they will do is ensure the PL logo is always (or regularly visible) and nothing will change. Placing it in the center circle would make it impossible to photoshop out so pubs will be in exactly the same situation now.

We have one match on TV this month, 2 next. During that time we have 11 matches scheduled so far. We're of huge interest at the moment. We have a system at the moment where matches aren't on TV all that often, but the rights are huge.

We're paying massively over the odds for really poor service (in comparison to best practice in other sports).

The pub i go to when i'n not back home watching city at the etihad stadium, has invested about 100,000 chf in new equitment, to get
Any game being played in all the top leagues on any day of thecweek. So i can see city everyweek.

[john@staustell]

Why dont they all watch it on the internet like we do, and my pub does?

Personally I leave the pub to watch football at home as it's cheaper, you can hear and see it without some idiot dancing about, and you can remember it afterwards.

Also although we on here all speak about 'everyone watching in the pub' what percentage of the population actually do this? Bugger all really. A few hundred in each town maybe, of many thousands. Maybe even a few thousand in Manchester, with a huge population. maybe even 100 in that pub in Portsmouth.

Less than 1%?

As they found when SKY came in, anything that expands interest and brings it toa wider audience, expands the game, not contracts it.

[BlueinBosnia]

Also although we on here all speak about 'everyone watching in the pub' what percentage of the population actually do this? Bugger all really. A few hundred in each town maybe, of many thousands. Maybe even a few thousand in Manchester, with a huge population. maybe even 100 in that pub in Portsmouth.

Less than 1%?

Nonsense.

I think I pulled up figures on this recently, and, if I remember correctly, about 3.5% of the population regularly watch football in bars in Britain. That's about 2.15 million people. Say they consume, on average, 3 pints and a packet of crisps (a low estimate, considering a large number of people stay to watch both televised games, that's about a tenner spent per person. Now obviously not all of these people watch every game, but say, for example, the average person described above goes to the pub to watch football once every three weeks, that's still 7 million quid being pumped into pubs on the weekend, at times when they would otherwise have little-to-no business.

The best figure I could get for the number of Sky viewers is just over 9 million (I assume that's people, not households). Obviously, not all of them will have Sky Sports. So, if we generously assume that 2/3 Sky subscribers have the Sports package, that means that 1 in 10 people have regular access to televised Premier League football at home.

When I worked in a bar/nightclub in Britain, I used to manage the place on sundays. About 95% of our income between 3pm and 9pm was due to us screening football, equating to between 400 and 1000 quid, depending on fixtures. That was from a crowd of maybe 30-60 people, with wives and mates popping in for the occasional drink throughout the course of the games, in a town of 40,000 people. Add to that the fact the bar wasn't even in the top 5 most popular places in the town to watch football, and you're starting to see that it's a lot more of the population than you think. I'd hazard a guess that over 1,500 people watch football in pubs each weekend there.

[Ted Hughes]

Lawyer on Talkshite basically saying she lost the case.

As I said earlier in the thread, if you show PL in the pub you are infringing the copywrite. Also the next PL deal needs to be sold as a whole package, not just a country by country basis, as I said; pan European sales. Sky win.

Keyes recons the prices will go up.

[gilford]

I don't know why Sky dont introduce a "club channel" and you then pay for that. If there was a "CityTV" channel on Sky which showed all the games I would pay a lot of money a month to watch it as going to games is just not possible all of the time. I think the PPV system would be ideal and would sort stuff like this out.

There is the age old saying where as if they aired the 3pm kick off's they would lose shit loads on the turnstiles, I feel that is totally untrue and I would relish in the chance to watch all games in HD whenver I wanted, I would even pay the same price as a ticket to watch the game!

I think the TV companies etc are really missing a trick here............

[Mark (Blue Army)]

I don't know why Sky dont introduce a "club channel" and you then pay for that. If there was a "CityTV" channel on Sky which showed all the games I would pay a lot of money a month to watch it as going to games is just not possible all of the time. I think the PPV system would be ideal and would sort stuff like this out.

There is the age old saying where as if they aired the 3pm kick off's they would lose shit loads on the turnstiles, I feel that is totally untrue and I would relish in the chance to watch all games in HD whenver I wanted, I would even pay the same price as a ticket to watch the game!

I think the TV companies etc are really missing a trick here............

This.^^^ I've been saying for years sky should have a channel for each team or do a ppv so you can pay to watch the match.

[Ted Hughes]

I don't know why Sky dont introduce a "club channel" and you then pay for that. If there was a "CityTV" channel on Sky which showed all the games I would pay a lot of money a month to watch it as going to games is just not possible all of the time. I think the PPV system would be ideal and would sort stuff like this out.

There is the age old saying where as if they aired the 3pm kick off's they would lose shit loads on the turnstiles, I feel that is totally untrue and I would relish in the chance to watch all games in HD whenver I wanted, I would even pay the same price as a ticket to watch the game!

I think the TV companies etc are really missing a trick here............

This.^^^ I've been saying for years sky should have a channel for each team or do a ppv so you can pay to watch the match.

Because that would effectively mean an end to the collective of the Premier League. This will be one of the reasons Americans etc have been taking over our clubs; the hope that eventually they can sell their own games but the PL operates as a collective, so one club can't negotiate their own deals..

How long for instance do you think the rags would be willing to share their income with the rest of the Premier League when it becomes evident that they are earning 150 times as much money as Fulham or WBA but not allowed to keep it? Then they force Sky & the Premier League to renegotiate so they get most of their money from their broadcasts. Then, why not just sell their own product on their own channel & leave the other clubs to rot ?

[DoomMerchant]

How does Sky sell packages or matches?

Here in the US satellite company DirecTV sell a "Sunday Ticket" for about USD$300 or so and you see every single american football match that wouldn't be aired on other networks. It's quite a deal really, especially since, much like European football, you are likely to only get to see 5 of the 13 or so games being played on any given sunday, and if you don't have a sellout for home games the local team has a blackout on TV coverage locally so the only way to see the game is to get up off your ass and get to the stadium.

Does Sky offer a similar package for the Prem?

cheers

[Ted Hughes]

How does Sky sell packages or matches?

Here in the US satellite company DirecTV sell a "Sunday Ticket" for about USD$300 or so and you see every single american football match that wouldn't be aired on other networks. It's quite a deal really, especially since, much like European football, you are likely to only get to see 5 of the 13 or so games being played on any given sunday, and if you don't have a sellout for home games the local team has a blackout on TV coverage locally so the only way to see the game is to get up off your ass and get to the stadium.

Does Sky offer a similar package for the Prem?

cheers

With Sky, you subscribe to the Sports channels & you just get whatever they decide to show you on whichever channel. If you subscribe to all 4 plus ESPN, you can see any live match which they broadcast but that is only a few games per weekend, which start at times designed not to clash with the rest of the usual schedule. You can normally watch more or less the full game recorded later in the evening by using a 'match choice' thing.

It's against PL rules for the televised games to be shown at the same time as the normal Saturday schedule.

[carl_feedthegoat]

How does Sky sell packages or matches?

Here in the US satellite company DirecTV sell a "Sunday Ticket" for about USD$300 or so and you see every single american football match that wouldn't be aired on other networks. It's quite a deal really, especially since, much like European football, you are likely to only get to see 5 of the 13 or so games being played on any given sunday, and if you don't have a sellout for home games the local team has a blackout on TV coverage locally so the only way to see the game is to get up off your ass and get to the stadium.

Does Sky offer a similar package for the Prem?

cheers

With Sky, you subscribe to the Sports channels & you just get whatever they decide to show you on whichever channel. If you subscribe to all 4 plus ESPN, you can see any live match which they broadcast but that is only a few games per weekend, which start at times designed not to clash with the rest of the usual schedule. You can normally watch more or less the full game recorded later in the evening by using a 'match choice' thing.

It's against PL rules for the televised games to be shown at the same time as the normal Saturday schedule.

One of the beauties of living in Latin America is the live football....ESPN 1 and 2 show live games...Foxsports show live games..basically there are 4 live games every Saturday and also Sunday plus the Monday match...Man City has been shown Live every single game they have played apart from 1 that was delayed.

Brilliant football coverage and its on Direct TV or the Latin version of Sky..either one is great.

[DoomMerchant]

How does Sky sell packages or matches?

Here in the US satellite company DirecTV sell a "Sunday Ticket" for about USD$300 or so and you see every single american football match that wouldn't be aired on other networks. It's quite a deal really, especially since, much like European football, you are likely to only get to see 5 of the 13 or so games being played on any given sunday, and if you don't have a sellout for home games the local team has a blackout on TV coverage locally so the only way to see the game is to get up off your ass and get to the stadium.

Does Sky offer a similar package for the Prem?

cheers

With Sky, you subscribe to the Sports channels & you just get whatever they decide to show you on whichever channel. If you subscribe to all 4 plus ESPN, you can see any live match which they broadcast but that is only a few games per weekend, which start at times designed not to clash with the rest of the usual schedule. You can normally watch more or less the full game recorded later in the evening by using a 'match choice' thing.

It's against PL rules for the televised games to be shown at the same time as the normal Saturday schedule.

One of the beauties of living in Latin America is the live football....ESPN 1 and 2 show live games...Foxsports show live games..basically there are 4 live games every Saturday and also Sunday plus the Monday match...Man City has been shown Live every single game they have played apart from 1 that was delayed.

Brilliant football coverage and its on Direct TV or the Latin version of Sky..either one is great.

for real...i think i have more access to footy on TV here in the States than i would if i lived in the UK. Crazy really.

Plus i have a reasonable Bundesliga, La Liga, and Serie A match every weekend as well as 4 live PL matches, plus whatever match ESPN is showing on the weekend.

Only 1 City match this season hasn't been on TV -- the Cup tie vs Brum i believe. 1 other was tape delayed.

Why on earth doesn't Sky do something like the NFL does here in the States and show every fucking game at a package price? odd.

cheers

[Kladze]

How does Sky sell packages or matches?

Here in the US satellite company DirecTV sell a "Sunday Ticket" for about USD$300 or so and you see every single american football match that wouldn't be aired on other networks. It's quite a deal really, especially since, much like European football, you are likely to only get to see 5 of the 13 or so games being played on any given sunday, and if you don't have a sellout for home games the local team has a blackout on TV coverage locally so the only way to see the game is to get up off your ass and get to the stadium.

Does Sky offer a similar package for the Prem?

cheers

With Sky, you subscribe to the Sports channels & you just get whatever they decide to show you on whichever channel. If you subscribe to all 4 plus ESPN, you can see any live match which they broadcast but that is only a few games per weekend, which start at times designed not to clash with the rest of the usual schedule. You can normally watch more or less the full game recorded later in the evening by using a 'match choice' thing.

It's against PL rules for the televised games to be shown at the same time as the normal Saturday schedule.

One of the beauties of living in Latin America is the live football....ESPN 1 and 2 show live games...Foxsports show live games..basically there are 4 live games every Saturday and also Sunday plus the Monday match...Man City has been shown Live every single game they have played apart from 1 that was delayed.

Brilliant football coverage and its on Direct TV or the Latin version of Sky..either one is great.

for real...i think i have more access to footy on TV here in the States than i would if i lived in the UK. Crazy really.

Plus i have a reasonable Bundesliga, La Liga, and Serie A match every weekend as well as 4 live PL matches, plus whatever match ESPN is showing on the weekend.

Only 1 City match this season hasn't been on TV -- the Cup tie vs Brum i believe. 1 other was tape delayed.

Why on earth doesn't Sky do something like the NFL does here in the States and show every fucking game at a package price? odd.

cheers

I'm guessing that the crucial difference is in the proximity of the armchair fans to the stadia in question.

An NFL game from NYC could be shown live in NY state and many of the viewers would still live a long way from the stadium.

Here they could show a Liverpool v Everton derby match and I only live 30 odd miles away even though I'm in Manchester.

[Ted Hughes]

It's not just about the effect it would have on attendances at the games shown live & the PL, it's about the effect it could have on the whole of the football programme in this country; on attendances in every league down to non league.

It was all discussed when the idea of live broadcasts was 1st mooted. The agreement with the PL, FA & Football League was that 3pm on a Saturday would be a no go area for live broadcasts so as not to encourage fans to stay at home watching Maan Uuuu rather than Southend or York or whoever. We are unique in the number of fans who go to lower league games & they want to keep it that way.

[DoomMerchant]

It's not just about the effect it would have on attendances at the games shown live & the PL, it's about the effect it could have on the whole of the football programme in this country; on attendances in every league down to non league.

It was all discussed when the idea of live broadcasts was 1st mooted. The agreement with the PL, FA & Football League was that 3pm on a Saturday would be a no go area for live broadcasts so as not to encourage fans to stay at home watching Maan Uuuu rather than Southend or York or whoever. We are unique in the number of fans who go to lower league games & they want to keep it that way.

very interesting. makes a lot of sense when you think about it, but seems awfully out of step with modern technology and the media coverage, etc. Esp. with the money it seems you could make from an offering like i mentioned.

i could see if i lived in the UK how i'd want to wander down to the local lower league side and see some football in a small stadium and just enjoy it. I can see it being a really fun time to be honest.

What percentage of folks on this board attend a lower league team's matches regularly do you think?

cheers

[Kladze]

It's not just about the effect it would have on attendances at the games shown live & the PL, it's about the effect it could have on the whole of the football programme in this country; on attendances in every league down to non league.

It was all discussed when the idea of live broadcasts was 1st mooted. The agreement with the PL, FA & Football League was that 3pm on a Saturday would be a no go area for live broadcasts so as not to encourage fans to stay at home watching Maan Uuuu rather than Southend or York or whoever. We are unique in the number of fans who go to lower league games & they want to keep it that way.

That's more or less the point I was, badly, trying to make above.

Why would I want to pay to go and watch Bury, about 8 miles away, when I could stay in and watch the merseyside derby or Chelsea v Spurs, or whatever?