Herman Won't Contest/AWOL in Argie

[Blue Since 76]

Was he told 100% "he could not go" or was he told to "speak to Mancini" and he couldnt be contacted?

From what Herman said, albeit it's obviously been translated incorrectly, he was told to speak to Mancini. He tried, left several messages but couldn't get hold of him, so went anyway.

If he'd just gone for a couple of days without permission but had still been at training when required, it could be put down to a mis-understanding. However that he hasn't turned up for training and has made no attempt to return since the 'mis-understanding' was identified, I'd say he's in serious trouble.

[Mark (Blue Army)]

Was he told 100% "he could not go" or was he told to "speak to Mancini" and he couldnt be contacted?

It doesn't matter ether way, he wasn't told he could go so he should still be in Manchester end of. Think about it, if you were thinking of going somewhere and was told to ask your boss if you could have the time off and tried to ring him and couldn't get through what would you do?

A) Just stay, as you haven't been told you can go and you can't get in touch with your boss.

or

B) Just say fuck it I'm going I tried ringing.

I know for a fact I wouldn't have a fucking job when I got back home if I went for option B and neither should he.

[Dameerto]

Was he told 100% "he could not go" or was he told to "speak to Mancini" and he couldnt be contacted?

That's not the right question - the most important question is whether he was told to be at training on Weds - everything I've read points to an explicit 'yes'. Now he faces the consequences.

[shortagain]

Personally I hope he stays in Argentina till his transfer is concluded and in the meantime we can stop paying his wages. I would seriously doubt he has been prudent with his earnings from football especially with that leech attached to him so it won't be long before he's skint. Wonder how long the entourage will follow him around then, especially his advisors who will no longer be earning from him. Perhaps he will end up a broken man and it couldn't happen to a nicer person!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Ted Hughes]

I've been thinking about this & come to the conclusion that he's not just thick, or calculating, he's genuinely mentally unstable. That's how Kia has managed to wind him round his little finger in the past but now he's going over the edge & even Kia can't control him.

There's absolutley no telling what this bloke will do next. He could come back tomorrow & beg for forgiveness then 2 days later, walk out of a treaining session & disappear for a month. He's another Gazza but he doesn't need the alcohol or drugs.

[gillie]

City twice refused him permission to go back to Argentina and they will probably have recorded either on paper or CCTV yes CCTV its everywhere these days so expect us to unviel a DVD if he calls our bluff on this.

[Green & Blue]

I've been thinking about this & come to the conclusion that he's not just thick, or calculating, he's genuinely mentally unstable. That's how Kia has managed to wind him round his little finger in the past but now he's going over the edge & even Kia can't control him.

There's absolutley no telling what this bloke will do next. He could come back tomorrow & beg for forgiveness then 2 days later, walk out of a treaining session & disappear for a month. He's another Gazza but he doesn't need the alcohol or drugs.

He has to be a simpleton its the only logical explanation for his behaviour.The whole situation has completely spiralled out of control for him.I feel he has really lost any grasp of reality and is in it so deep now he really does not know what to do next, hes not thinking rationally or thinking ahead at all for that matter.

[Plain Speaking]

Was he told 100% "he could not go" or was he told to "speak to Mancini" and he couldnt be contacted?

From what Herman said, albeit it's obviously been translated incorrectly, he was told to speak to Mancini. He tried, left several messages but couldn't get hold of him, so went anyway.

If he'd just gone for a couple of days without permission but had still been at training when required, it could be put down to a mis-understanding. However that he hasn't turned up for training and has made no attempt to return since the 'mis-understanding' was identified, I'd say he's in serious trouble.

I'm not a Tevez supporter I'm just trying to establish if our management team have been crystal clear in explaining their expectations from Tevez. I'm sure our legal teamwill examine all communications. I would like the club to be whiter than white in this very public dispute.

[Reckers]

It's funny looking back at the first comments in this thread. Boy were we wrong that this was all over...

[Blue Since 76]

I'm not a Tevez supporter I'm just trying to establish if our management team have been crystal clear in explaining their expectations from Tevez. I'm sure our legal teamwill examine all communications. I would like the club to be whiter than white in this very public dispute.

Last time it was Bob speaking after the match and he should probably have not said anything but you can fully understand his outburst. This time it's been dealt with by HR and lawyers in a calm fashion. If they didn't do it properly, they want sacking.

[dazby]

Through all this the comment that sticks in my head is mancio saying "this is Carlo.". The way he said it was dripped in pathos and hurt.

[Alex Sapphire]

Through all this the comment that sticks in my head is mancio saying "this is Carlo.". The way he said it was dripped in pathos and hurt.

the comment that sticks in mine was Souness's "One Bad Apple" monologue. He spoke for me

[Hazy2]

The Tevez clan is the problem, he does not have the brains to book a ticket to fly home. This is all a game to them, fuck his contract, fuck MCFC and fuck the fans, he already has his next club lined up IMHO, this is about taking the piss until he leaves, will he come back to Manchester, what is the point, he is not gonna play. Well he is if playing about acting like a cunt is ok.

[Patrick]

His actions seem to make it much easier for city to fire him, hold onto his registration and sue him for loss of value. A course of action most people would support, but why?

Personally I'm going for the fact he is a lot more fragile that you'd think, was deeply unhappy with the situation, and knee jerked like the spoilt brat we know he is........but I still have a nagging doubt that the puppet master has a plan

[Hazy2]

His actions seem to make it much easier for city to fire him, hold onto his registration and sue him for loss of value. A course of action most people would support, but why?

Personally I'm going for the fact he is a lot more fragile that you'd think, was deeply unhappy with the situation, and knee jerked like the spoilt brat we know he is........but I still have a nagging doubt that the puppet master has a plan

You have a point about his mental state, I said the same some time ago. However mate, his people must have had his request, warned him,booked the flight a week or so ago, and in the same breath thought where are the crash helmets, The player is great no doubt, the man is fooked up with wealth, power and an ability to think fuck it whatever the fallout, he typifies as Souness pointed out what is so wrong about Football. Worse than that he does not give a toss, for me he is gone in the mind the body might fly back but I doubt it .

[Plain Speaking]

I'm not a Tevez supporter I'm just trying to establish if our management team have been crystal clear in explaining their expectations from Tevez. I'm sure our legal teamwill examine all communications. I would like the club to be whiter than white in this very public dispute.

Last time it was Bob speaking after the match and he should probably have not said anything but you can fully understand his outburst. This time it's been dealt with by HR and lawyers in a calm fashion. If they didn't do it properly, they want sacking.

I wasnt thinking so much of HR procedures following him "not being present at the club on Wednesday" but making it clear that he was "definitely required to attend the club on Wednesday". From what Tevez's camp has said Tevez seems to have been trying to obtain permission to leave from a number of management staff before he left.

On the face of it the incident is not quite as bad as Robinho's departure from Mark Hughes' training camp in Tenerife in 2009, where Robinho didnt seem to have been sought permission to return to Brazil.

My concern is that our management /coaching staff should let him know "exactly" what they expect from him. To be unclear is unprofessional and open to dispute as was found to be the case with the touchline dispute at Bayern.

I am not on Tevez' side I just dont want our club to be open to criticism. I dont think we should demonise Tevez, we should try and understand him and ideally sell him for the best price in January. We are losing huge sums of money on Tevez's sale price by such incidents. Disputes should be avoided where possible by clear communications.

[feedthegreek]

youll do anything if your not happy in a job,
im not saying he should,nt be happy, but ive packed at least 3 jobs in
and walked off at a minutes notice. and got a job where i was happy.
tevez might not be happy with kia joorabcian and might be hoping kia
gets rid of him, then tevez might be happy.
like most on here we all think hes behind it all.
if you think hes had everything at city he didnt have at scum, regular in the side
worshipped by us city fans, top scorer golden boot, fa cup winner.
why would he want to leave it must be his agent, making all this happen.
they asked him at the end of season awards would he be here next season
he said he didnt know. i mean as an individual you know what you want.
unless your not in charge of your own life.

[Hazy2]

I'm not a Tevez supporter I'm just trying to establish if our management team have been crystal clear in explaining their expectations from Tevez. I'm sure our legal teamwill examine all communications. I would like the club to be whiter than white in this very public dispute.

Last time it was Bob speaking after the match and he should probably have not said anything but you can fully understand his outburst. This time it's been dealt with by HR and lawyers in a calm fashion. If they didn't do it properly, they want sacking.

I wasnt thinking so much of HR procedures following him "not being present at the club on Wednesday" but making it clear that he was "definitely required to attend the club on Wednesday". From what Tevez's camp has said Tevez seems to have been trying to obtain permission to leave from a number of management staff before he left.

On the face of it the incident is not quite as bad as Robinho's departure from Mark Hughes' training camp in Tenerife in 2009, where Robinho didnt seem to have been sought permission to return to Brazil.

My concern is that our management /coaching staff should let him know "exactly" what they expect from him. To be unclear is unprofessional and open to dispute as was found to be the case with the touchline dispute at Bayern.

I am not on Tevez' side I just dont want our club to be open to criticism. I dont think we should demonise Tevez, we should try and understand him and ideally sell him for the best price in January. We are losing huge sums of money on Tevez's sale price by such incidents. Disputes should be avoided where possible by clear communications.

I think his antics, reduce the value, in turn this will mean more options for his agent, a tactic of his clans doing.Not knowing what the owner of our club is thinking but second guessing, We draw 35 mill no loan deals he will arrange his flight for him using his own plane to make sure he gets there. on the communication problem again that is a tactic to cloud the waters and confuse the issue, which at the end of the day is Tevez, once again acting up on instructions the idiot. Pro's like Zabba, must be thing wtf are you on leave me out of this shit you lunatic. I think he is at Madrid in Jan for 32,000,000.

[Ted Hughes]

I'm not a Tevez supporter I'm just trying to establish if our management team have been crystal clear in explaining their expectations from Tevez. I'm sure our legal teamwill examine all communications. I would like the club to be whiter than white in this very public dispute.

Last time it was Bob speaking after the match and he should probably have not said anything but you can fully understand his outburst. This time it's been dealt with by HR and lawyers in a calm fashion. If they didn't do it properly, they want sacking.

I wasnt thinking so much of HR procedures following him "not being present at the club on Wednesday" but making it clear that he was "definitely required to attend the club on Wednesday". From what Tevez's camp has said Tevez seems to have been trying to obtain permission to leave from a number of management staff before he left.

On the face of it the incident is not quite as bad as Robinho's departure from Mark Hughes' training camp in Tenerife in 2009, where Robinho didnt seem to have been sought permission to return to Brazil.

My concern is that our management /coaching staff should let him know "exactly" what they expect from him. To be unclear is unprofessional and open to dispute as was found to be the case with the touchline dispute at Bayern.

I am not on Tevez' side I just dont want our club to be open to criticism. I dont think we should demonise Tevez, we should try and understand him and ideally sell him for the best price in January. We are losing huge sums of money on Tevez's sale price by such incidents. Disputes should be avoided where possible by clear communications.

Imo, it is unlikely after this latest outburst, that anyone will pay even £20 mil for Tevez in January. If it was an isolated incident it would be different but it's one of a series going back over a year & probably the straw that breaks the camel's back. Would Real or Barca want such a player permanently in their dressing rooms when fighting tooth & nail for the title & the Chump's Lg ? Why ?

Surely if any one of the major clubs come in for Tevez, they will want to take him on loan, not spend £20 mil on him in January ? The only people willing to spend that money, imo, would be smaller clubs looking to make a statement of intent, like we did with Robinho. How many of them want to make that statement in January though, & would he play in Russia for example ?

What happens if we let him off yet again, & are unable to do a deal to sell him in Jan ? Is it really the safest option to bank on transferring him out ? Imagine if he's still here in Feb.

Cancel his contact, save the money on his wages & sue him.

[Plain Speaking]

I'm not a Tevez supporter I'm just trying to establish if our management team have been crystal clear in explaining their expectations from Tevez. I'm sure our legal teamwill examine all communications. I would like the club to be whiter than white in this very public dispute.

Last time it was Bob speaking after the match and he should probably have not said anything but you can fully understand his outburst. This time it's been dealt with by HR and lawyers in a calm fashion. If they didn't do it properly, they want sacking.

I wasnt thinking so much of HR procedures following him "not being present at the club on Wednesday" but making it clear that he was "definitely required to attend the club on Wednesday". From what Tevez's camp has said Tevez seems to have been trying to obtain permission to leave from a number of management staff before he left.

On the face of it the incident is not quite as bad as Robinho's departure from Mark Hughes' training camp in Tenerife in 2009, where Robinho didnt seem to have been sought permission to return to Brazil.

My concern is that our management /coaching staff should let him know "exactly" what they expect from him. To be unclear is unprofessional and open to dispute as was found to be the case with the touchline dispute at Bayern.

I am not on Tevez' side I just dont want our club to be open to criticism. I dont think we should demonise Tevez, we should try and understand him and ideally sell him for the best price in January. We are losing huge sums of money on Tevez's sale price by such incidents. Disputes should be avoided where possible by clear communications.

I think his antics, reduce the value, in turn this will mean more options for his agent, a tactic of his clans doing.Not knowing what the owner of our club is thinking but second guessing, We draw 35 mill no loan deals he will arrange his flight for him using his own plane to make sure he gets there. on the communication problem again that is a tactic to cloud the waters and confuse the issue, which at the end of the day is Tevez, once again acting up on instructions the idiot. Pro's like Zabba, must be thing wtf are you on leave me out of this shit you lunatic. I think he is at Madrid in Jan for 32,000,000.

I agree with what you say, particularly about Zaba, "a model professional." :-))

Personally I think some people are looking too deep into Tevez' actions for some sort of conspiracy theory? IMO he's an uneducated, selfish, egotistical man that thinks he's the best player in the world. He believes he should be the first player on the team sheet and every one should bend over backwards to keep him happy and bow to his every wish.

He was upset on the bench at Munich that Mancini was "stupid enough" to take off a striker and put on a defensive player instead of the "world's greatest player" when we were 2 goals behind and he spit out his dummy. Following Munich he feels he has been wrongly portrayed and since coming back to training he feels he deserves to have a rest by going "home" when there are very few players at Carrington. He tried many times to obtain permission to go home but eventually ran out of patience and said "sod it, I'm going home anyway".

Tevez may be a stupid man who seems to live on another planet, but he is not a demon and he remains an incredibly talented player we should recognize his frailities and try to understand his mindset so we can avoid any more disputes and we can sell him for the most money come January.