Mancini has to go?

[EEE]

I fully agree with the long term vision.

For me, we need to bring through young players into a championship and cup winning team for them to be tested at the highest level and to be benchmarked against championship winning players in their position.

In my opinion, before we can start bringing youngsters through we need to have a core of 20 players who have a couple of championships under their belt, the club is the leading club in England, and progressing to cup finals and winning them becomes the norm.

Then youngsters will know what the highest standard is and they're challange will be to displace the winners that are already there.

We need to become winners first before the long term vision can kick in, and not just one FA cup, my bare minimum target for next seasons would be a title win, a cup final, and QF at least in the Champions League.

I dont care who gets us there, Mancini, Mourinho, me, you, it doesnt matter to me. We just have to get there.

I think the best way there is to get Mourinho. If not, stick with Mancini. Your view is different. But as long as one of us is right, we'll both be happy.

Ultimately I don't care who gets us there. Success for the club comes first. However, I rather (If I can choose) do it with a manager who´s not a prick. One can argue though that by being a bit of a prick (call that mind games, easing the pressure of the team etc) Mourinho achieves success. However, the main reason I don't want Mourinho to come in is that I believe he's off after 2-3 years. I want someone that wants to be here the coming ten years. I believe Mancini wants that, and I still believe that he can do the job for us. If he hast lost the dressing room (which I don't believe at all) he obviously needs to be replaced, and if he can't mobilize the team to end the season on a positive note - I would consider swapping him. If there's a better option out there who's in it for the long haul.

All in all I'm with you though.

Regarding the long term vision - you're right that success (trophies) is an ingredient that needs to be in place in order to get it working. Don't agree that we need to have reached all that success before we can bring in youngsters though. If they´re good enough they should be given a chance and it must be (and should be if we're making progress) easier to break into the City of 2011/2012 than the City of say 2014/2015. Guidetti should be given a chance in the squad next season.

[carl_feedthegoat]

I asked why he continues making tactical mistakes and noone knows why but he keeps on making them.........he also keeps on talking SHITE to the media and continuously backtracks on what he said previously.

Tevez - will never play for the club again.

Ballotelli will be sold and wont play the rest of the season.

The first is playing again and he has just back tracked on saying Ballo wont play again.

Surely the guy has lost credibilityand that cannot be tolerated at a club like ours.

Time to have those secret talks with Mourinho...if they havent already been had.

[Renato_CTID]

Some of his comments after the game were pretty close to unacceptable from a manager. (In my unqualified opinion).

The same for me, mate! How could he seriously tell he never watched the 1st terrible foul of Mario? Why didn't he replace Mario as soon as possible with Tevez, AJ or Dzeko? Did Mancio understand he's working in Premier League, not in our stupid overrated Serie A?

He also ensured we would receive low bids from Italy for Mario in the summer rather than market rate.

THIS !

Napoli much more than Inter or AC looks to be favourite to sign him!

[Grob]

I can. I don't think you neccessarily have to be both at the top level, especially if your coaches can take care of it.

I don't think Brian Clough was a great man manager either, just enigmatic & unpredictable, but he got results & was a great football manager, for a period.

The fact we have been comeback kings recently & slaughtered teams for half an hour (exactly as the rags have done at their best) is exactly why I'm so pissed off about yesterday; as I tried to explain to Mancio on the other thread, imo it's exactly what was required & we've proved we can do it from bad positions on days when we are struggling.

The fact that he'll do that when we're being outplayed by Porto & Sunderland & are several goals behind but at 0-0 v Arsenal has to be an Italian football tactical genius pisses me off no end. It's just spineless. We're level and haven't lost yet so lets worry about the opposition instead of making them change the way they arte playing & worry about us ? Only attack full tilt if you have no other choice ? Bollocks.

Cant comment on Clough as its before my time but winning the league and a european cup with an unfashionable team and beating teams with much larger resources must have been a miricle if he couldnt man manage.

Agree about the spineless tactics yesterday but going 3-1 and 2-0 behind at home to Sunderland and Sporting cant be acceptable positions in the first place can they, regardless of the comebacks? I wasnt entirely chuffed about failing to reorganise untill half time against the scum and basically handing them 2 goals. The lack of urgency prior to Tevez's arrival against Chelsea also flustrated me. All recent events apart for the United debacle. And thats just the home form!

[Blue Since 76]

For me, Mancini should be sacked for his performance, however, to avoid a Wolves situation, I'd only get rid once a contract was signed with a replacement.

For his replacement, I think we need someone with PL experience. There are plenty of decent managers in europe but we've seen how that doesn't always translate to working in the PL or even someone like Le Guen in Scotland. That would there concern me about Pep who's ne'er seen life outside Barca

We therefore either take a chance on a manager who looks ready to step up to the top level and hope they can cut it e.g. O'Neil or Moyes or we look to someone who's won stuff. Assuming Taggart is off the list, that means Benitez, Mourinho, Wenger and Capello (hopefully an understanding of English football).

Wenger wouldn't come and if he did, we'd be on for a seventy year project that doesn't produce anything. Benitez - please no. I didn't like Mourinho's football at Chelsea and his Madrid team have been a disgrace, but he'd win stuff. I'd be concerned he wouldn't stay, but more concerned that he wouldn't build for the future. If it was him, you'd need a strong youth development manager who built the B team for him to take players from later.

Capello is just looking for a last payday, so wouldn't build either.

I think we'd therefore have to go for the next level down. However, how hard is the step up into the top 4 and to win the PL or CL? O'Neil has won a few things in England and Scotland, but has he really got what it takes at the very top? Without the chance we'll never know, but do we want to be the guinea pigs? Same goes for Moyes - done well on a limited budget, but never won anything and could he manage the egos of the top players (plus he's a twat).

Mourinho is the only manager who looks like he can compete with Taggart and I'm sure he could beat him again. But at what cost?

In short, till Taggat retires, I think we're screwed unless we go with Mourinho. Once he's gone, it'll be a level playing field in England and it's just then finding a manager who can win in Europe, which Taggart has struggled with as well. So if not Mourinho, we may as well stick with Mancini and keep our fingers crossed he can learn, even though there's no evidence of it.

[Ted Hughes]

I asked why he continues making tactical mistakes and noone knows why but he keeps on making them.........he also keeps on talking SHITE to the media and continuously backtracks on what he said previously.

Tevez - will never play for the club again.

Ballotelli will be sold and wont play the rest of the season.

The first is playing again and he has just back tracked on saying Ballo wont play again.

Surely the guy has lost credibilityand that cannot be tolerated at a club like ours.

Time to have those secret talks with Mourinho...if they havent already been had.

http://newsthump.com/2012/04/09/player- ... s-mancini/

[Ted Hughes]

I can. I don't think you neccessarily have to be both at the top level, especially if your coaches can take care of it.

I don't think Brian Clough was a great man manager either, just enigmatic & unpredictable, but he got results & was a great football manager, for a period.

The fact we have been comeback kings recently & slaughtered teams for half an hour (exactly as the rags have done at their best) is exactly why I'm so pissed off about yesterday; as I tried to explain to Mancio on the other thread, imo it's exactly what was required & we've proved we can do it from bad positions on days when we are struggling.

The fact that he'll do that when we're being outplayed by Porto & Sunderland & are several goals behind but at 0-0 v Arsenal has to be an Italian football tactical genius pisses me off no end. It's just spineless. We're level and haven't lost yet so lets worry about the opposition instead of making them change the way they arte playing & worry about us ? Only attack full tilt if you have no other choice ? Bollocks.

Cant comment on Clough as its before my time but winning the league and a european cup with an unfashionable team and beating teams with much larger resources must have been a miricle if he couldnt man manage.

Agree about the spineless tactics yesterday but going 3-1 and 2-0 behind at home to Sunderland and Sporting cant be acceptable positions in the first place can they, regardless of the comebacks? I wasnt entirely chuffed about failing to reorganise untill half time against the scum and basically handing them 2 goals. The lack of urgency prior to Tevez's arrival against Chelsea also flustrated me. All recent events apart for the United debacle. And thats just the home form!

We have struggled recently that's undeniable & we can criticise whoever for that but my biggest positive in recent times has been our comebacks. We never used to be able to play that kind of kitchen sink, up & at 'em football & pretty much all title winning sides over here have been able to do that. The fact we never even tried it v Arsenal has left me feeling cheated.

[Grob]

Ultimately I don't care who gets us there. Success for the club comes first. However, I rather (If I can choose) do it with a manager who´s not a prick. One can argue though that by being a bit of a prick (call that mind games, easing the pressure of the team etc) Mourinho achieves success. However, the main reason I don't want Mourinho to come in is that I believe he's off after 2-3 years. I want someone that wants to be here the coming ten years. I believe Mancini wants that, and I still believe that he can do the job for us. If he hast lost the dressing room (which I don't believe at all) he obviously needs to be replaced, and if he can't mobilize the team to end the season on a positive note - I would consider swapping him. If there's a better option out there who's in it for the long haul.

All in all I'm with you though.

Regarding the long term vision - you're right that success (trophies) is an ingredient that needs to be in place in order to get it working. Don't agree that we need to have reached all that success before we can bring in youngsters though. If they´re good enough they should be given a chance and it must be (and should be if we're making progress) easier to break into the City of 2011/2012 than the City of say 2014/2015. Guidetti should be given a chance in the squad next season.

Thats fair enough re. Mourinho.

I think the quickest way to get to the top is by using players that are already established. Mancini clearly agrees. In 2 and a half years he's brought through precisely 0 young players into the regular first team squad.

The youth movement is the long term vision but the short term aim is to win, and win now. And the best way is with experiance IMO.

Of those young players who train regulally with the first team, i'd be interested to hear if any look ready for action. Doug would be the man to ask of course but I havent heard him clamouring for Suarez or Rekik for exmple to be fast tracked into the first team just yet.

Guidetti is a different animal as hes prove himself at a first team level in a second tier european league. I'd be willing to try him out. Maybe he will be the first to break through. I doubt Mancini will put him in regulally though given his track record of bringing through youngsters over the last 2 and a half years. I hope im wrong as theres nothing better than seeing an academy talent making it to the first team, regardless of nationality.

[carl_feedthegoat]

I asked why he continues making tactical mistakes and noone knows why but he keeps on making them.........he also keeps on talking SHITE to the media and continuously backtracks on what he said previously.

Tevez - will never play for the club again.

Ballotelli will be sold and wont play the rest of the season.

The first is playing again and he has just back tracked on saying Ballo wont play again.

Surely the guy has lost credibilityand that cannot be tolerated at a club like ours.

Time to have those secret talks with Mourinho...if they havent already been had.

http://newsthump.com/2012/04/09/player- ... s-mancini/

Heres a real quote

The manager said: “He will not play in our last six games, we have six left.”

[DoomMerchant]

I asked why he continues making tactical mistakes and noone knows why but he keeps on making them.........he also keeps on talking SHITE to the media and continuously backtracks on what he said previously.

Tevez - will never play for the club again.

Ballotelli will be sold and wont play the rest of the season.

The first is playing again and he has just back tracked on saying Ballo wont play again.

Surely the guy has lost credibilityand that cannot be tolerated at a club like ours.

Time to have those secret talks with Mourinho...if they havent already been had.

http://newsthump.com/2012/04/09/player- ... s-mancini/

Heres a real quote

The manager said: “He will not play in our last six games, we have six left.”

he's expecting him to get suspended for 6 games I believe.

i thought his comments were pathetically weak.

When i have someone risky on my team who i've back who drops a bollock i have to stand up and take the fucking arrow. That's what leaders do...you don't hide and throw that person under the bus and act like a little cunt. No one respects that. You took the risks and sometimes you win and sometimes you don't. My team would eat me alive if i didn't know when to push them and when to surrender to them when they are right. It's how you earn their respect otherwise you are just some douche running around barking orders, and i think Mancini is clearly falling in to the profile of the latter with his hypocrisy and garbage comments.

[carl_feedthegoat]

I asked why he continues making tactical mistakes and noone knows why but he keeps on making them.........he also keeps on talking SHITE to the media and continuously backtracks on what he said previously.

Tevez - will never play for the club again.

Ballotelli will be sold and wont play the rest of the season.

The first is playing again and he has just back tracked on saying Ballo wont play again.

Surely the guy has lost credibilityand that cannot be tolerated at a club like ours.

Time to have those secret talks with Mourinho...if they havent already been had.

http://newsthump.com/2012/04/09/player- ... s-mancini/

Heres a real quote

The manager said: “He will not play in our last six games, we have six left.”

he's expecting him to get suspended for 6 games I believe.

i thought his comments were pathetically weak.

When i have someone risky on my team who i've back who drops a bollock i have to stand up and take the fucking arrow. That's what leaders do...you don't hide and throw that person under the bus and act like a little cunt. No one respects that. You took the risks and sometimes you win and sometimes you don't. My team would eat me alive if i didn't know when to push them and when to surrender to them when they are right. It's how you earn their respect otherwise you are just some douche running around barking orders, and i think Mancini is clearly falling in to the profile of the latter with his hypocrisy and garbage comments.

Too true..you lose credibility if you go down the mancini route.

I always admit when Im wrong..its what a real leader does...although to be fair Im very rarely fuckign wrong.

[lets all have a disco]

So in the last 24 hours weve created 'doing a Mancini' in regards to fucking up.

Happy days.

[EEE]

Thats fair enough re. Mourinho.

I think the quickest way to get to the top is by using players that are already established. Mancini clearly agrees. In 2 and a half years he's brought through precisely 0 young players into the regular first team squad.

The youth movement is the long term vision but the short term aim is to win, and win now. And the best way is with experiance IMO.

Of those young players who train regulally with the first team, i'd be interested to hear if any look ready for action. Doug would be the man to ask of course but I havent heard him clamouring for Suarez or Rekik for exmple to be fast tracked into the first team just yet.

Guidetti is a different animal as hes prove himself at a first team level in a second tier european league. I'd be willing to try him out. Maybe he will be the first to break through. I doubt Mancini will put him in regulally though given his track record of bringing through youngsters over the last 2 and a half years. I hope im wrong as theres nothing better than seeing an academy talent making it to the first team, regardless of nationality.

Fair enough and now I get what you meant. I think there´s two reasons as to why no youngster been given regular game time from Mancini.

1. None of our youngster has been good enough to be given game time based on merits.

2. Mancini has been pressured to deliver according to the objectives set by the owners, top 4 finish last year etc. This one correlates to point 1; namely - when putting the best 11 players at his disposal - none of the young guns has been good enough (at least according to Mancini).

Since I'm not living in England I haven't had a chance to get a glimpse of the players in the youth team (except for one or two highlights clips from the city website). But according to Dougs and others reports; Suarez and especially Rekik could make it over the coming years. Since I'm from Sweden I've followed Guidetti a bit closer and I have no doubts he has the right attitude to make it on the top level. From what he has performed this season I think he should be given a chance as one of our 4 strikers next season. If he performs when given the chance I'm sure Mancini will give him playing time. If he's not performing at the level required - fair enough, then he and we'll be better of with him playing in another club.

[Sideshow Bob]

for all of the mourinho lickers: take note that real's once 10-pt lead has now shrunk to 4, with el stupido classico still left to play.

[Dameerto]

He gave Balotelli a chance, and probably the greatest motivator/man manager in the modern game came to the conclusion that he was unmanageable.

Mancini gave Balotelli his chance surely?

A chance, not HIS chance.

[Bluez]

As pissed off as I am, I think we should give Mancini another season. This could well be our moment, the one Ferguson had in 1991-92 season. He blew it at the end and was kept. The critical turning point in our season was Kompanys red card and the games we played Savic. Missing out on two cups from one card was a blow. with better center back cover we will be much better off.

When looking for replacements, the fact is hardly any manager has got the better of Ferguson over a season. I don't see the point in giving Manchini experience and then bringing in someone new who has to start over in the PL triyng to win it.

[Beefymcfc]

As pissed off as I am, I think we should give Mancini another season. This could well be our moment, the one Ferguson had in 1991-92 season. He blew it at the end and was kept. The critical turning point in our season was Kompanys red card and the games we played Savic. Missing out on two cups from one card was a blow. with better center back cover we will be much better off.

When looking for replacements, the fact is hardly any manager has got the better of Ferguson over a season. I don't see the point in giving Manchini experience and then bringing in someone new who has to start over in the PL triyng to win it.

Another season for me, also.

[carl_feedthegoat]

As pissed off as I am, I think we should give Mancini another season. This could well be our moment, the one Ferguson had in 1991-92 season. He blew it at the end and was kept. The critical turning point in our season was Kompanys red card and the games we played Savic. Missing out on two cups from one card was a blow. with better center back cover we will be much better off.

When looking for replacements, the fact is hardly any manager has got the better of Ferguson over a season. I don't see the point in giving Manchini experience and then bringing in someone new who has to start over in the PL triyng to win it.

So all the fuckign mistakes he has made and has not yet learnt from them (which he proved on a match to match basis) he will now suddenly change for next season ?

What makes you think he will change?

[gillie]

As pissed off as I am, I think we should give Mancini another season. This could well be our moment, the one Ferguson had in 1991-92 season. He blew it at the end and was kept. The critical turning point in our season was Kompanys red card and the games we played Savic. Missing out on two cups from one card was a blow. with better center back cover we will be much better off.

When looking for replacements, the fact is hardly any manager has got the better of Ferguson over a season. I don't see the point in giving Manchini experience and then bringing in someone new who has to start over in the PL triyng to win it.

So all the fuckign mistakes he has made and has not yet learnt from them (which he proved on a match to match basis) he will now suddenly change for next season ?

What makes you think he will change?

Carl Mancini wont change he is too fuckin stubborn and thats why we ended our game yesterday with ten men.

[Pretty Boy Lee]

Maybe a performance appraisal is the way.

Ask the following and see how hd answers.

Will you prepare accordingly for the Everton games and beat them for a change?

Will you attack when we need it?

Will you find a way to get our side playing like they give a shit against smaller teams?

How will you improve our away form?

Will you work on your man management?