MUFC: The Biggest Club In The Cayman Islands

[Exiled]

So each share has 1/10th of the voting rights compared to Glazer's shares.
No dividend until debt is cleared or at least much more manageable.
Investors to consider the ROI in future years rather than the dividend itself.
Will the TV revenue bubble burst? Can it get much higher?
Fergie is their key asset who will be retiring in a year or two.
Struggling to compete for the best players around.

If I was a potential investor I would be very hesitant about going near these shares.

[Dameerto]

So each share has 1/10th of the voting rights compared to Glazer's shares.
No dividend until debt is cleared or at least much more manageable.
Investors to consider the ROI in future years rather than the dividend itself.
Will the TV revenue bubble burst? Can it get much higher?
Fergie is their key asset who will be retiring in a year or two.
Struggling to compete for the best players around.

If I was a potential investor I would be very hesitant about going near these shares.

It's more aimed at the 'sentimental investor' in the form of their global following than as an actual serious level headed investment opportunity. Basically it's another way to fleece the (armchair) fans.

[Florida Blue]

I personally will be shorting the stock the minute it goes public. Nothing like a sinking ship to make money off of greedy reds.

[david yearsley]

I personally will be shorting the stock the minute it goes public. Nothing like a sinking ship to make money off of greedy reds.

You sound like a broker - I hope so - should mean sentiment is the same on the big boards globally. Short it , crush it!

[Nigels Tackle]

So each share has 1/10th of the voting rights compared to Glazer's shares.
No dividend until debt is cleared or at least much more manageable.
Investors to consider the ROI in future years rather than the dividend itself.
Will the TV revenue bubble burst? Can it get much higher?
Fergie is their key asset who will be retiring in a year or two.
Struggling to compete for the best players around.

If I was a potential investor I would be very hesitant about going near these shares.

It's more aimed at the 'sentimental investor' in the form of their global following than as an actual serious level headed investment opportunity. Basically it's another way to fleece the (armchair) fans.

nail on the fucking head

pretty sure there were folk on here who bought city shares... these rag shares will go the same way....

[Ted Hughes]

To any of you stock market types; would I be correct in reading this particular move as having a hint of desperation about it ?

[Beefymcfc]

To any of you stock market types; would I be correct in reading this particular move as having a hint of desperation about it ?

You don't have to be an expert to deduce that this is just a highly worded 'Begging Letter' aimed at the 650 million so called Rag fans. No chance of real profit, no chance of a dividend and no chance of a say in the future. Nothing, nada, fuck all, that's their real worth.

The Glazer's are going cap in hand and telling people accordingly. Their finances are fucked and the lack of silverware and early exit from the CL has put them in a spin. They need money to finance other investments but the cash-cow has now been bled dry.

If they make £100 mil from the sale, how much do you think will make it back to United or pay the debts? I'd say nowhere near that after the Glazer's have took their 'Admin Fees'.

[Swales4ever]

To any of you stock market types; would I be correct in reading this particular move as having a hint of desperation about it ?

I am certainly not, but that's my very same feeling and assessment of it. Also it seems pretty accorded with the whole history of the Glazer's ownership: a shrewd, cynically planned, drainage of financial potential of the Rags' brand.
also agree that huge question marks are to be raised over the success of this move: the huge rise of EPL tv rights income want be enough if the brand appeal will continue its fading curve accorded with lack of major success, because gloryhunters, who generated the major part of the Rags income, are very unfaithfull animals.

Big credit and thanks to Spartacus for the fine analisys posted above, that I read avidly. cheers for that.

[john68]

Flo,
What do you mean by "SHORTING THE MARKET" ?

...And THANKS Spartacus, Those explanations were excellent.

[blues-clues]

Ha fucking ha.

If a few financially savvy blokes on an internet forum can spot a lame duck you can be fairly sure that the underwriters of the sale will be thinking the same. Rag shares with no voting rights and no dividends are about as much use as Wayne Rooney in an England shirt. Cannot see these shares selling, reckon they thought the same in the Far East so now they are trying something more modest.

We are in the middle of a financial crisis people are looking for safe havens for whatever savings they have. Even rags fans around the world will be wary of the Glazers now.

[zuricity]

is the P/E rate fixed

[david yearsley]

is the P/E rate fixed

The rags should get diamond Bob pitching the offer as he´s a free agent. If he can fix Libor then an IPO should be a fuclin doddle

[Exiled]

What do you mean by "SHORTING THE MARKET" ?

Selling short means working the shares with the expectation that the price will go down rapido. The Glaziers still have to go on roadshows in the US to sell the IPO. They've valued the club too high before, which meant the likes of Morgan Stanley previously walked away. If they value it too high now, the IPO could be a flop and still might not go ahead.

Dunno if this has already been mentioned earlier (sorry not checked) but the way this IPO is being done would not be allowed on the London Stock Exchange but can do in the US. I might be wrong but I'm fairly positive that they will also be paying higher corporation tax by doing this in the US rather than the UK but the Glaziers seem to feel that it is still worth it (to retain almost total control).

[Scatman]

Do they pay any corporation tax in the UK? I would have thought all of those interest payments would pretty much wipe out any profits they had in the first place (and also the possibility that the interest payments were designed in such a way as to help them reduce profits low enough to not pay and UK corporation tax anyway).

[Beefymcfc]

Do they pay any corporation tax in the UK? I would have thought all of those interest payments would pretty much wipe out any profits they had in the first place (and also the possibility that the interest payments were designed in such a way as to help them reduce profits low enough to not pay and UK corporation tax anyway).

I read somewhere that it is approx 8% higher in the US, ours approx 28%, which begs the question, why?

It's clear that it's aimed at fans rather than investors yet they choose to float in the US. It's all about the type of share they want issuing as they can't do the same in the UK as the US. In the UK the shares would have to have equal voting rights rather than in the US where they can change the rights to suit their needs, ie. a diminshed voting right (only 10%) on the shares issued compared to the ones they own. Basically, if one person bought the full shares they would still only have 0.7% voting rights compared to the Glazer's 99.3%.

[Ted Hughes]

Do they pay any corporation tax in the UK? I would have thought all of those interest payments would pretty much wipe out any profits they had in the first place (and also the possibility that the interest payments were designed in such a way as to help them reduce profits low enough to not pay and UK corporation tax anyway).

I read somewhere that it is approx 8% higher in the US, ours approx 28%, which begs the question, why?

It's clear that it's aimed at fans rather than investors yet they choose to float in the US. It's all about the type of share they want issuing as they can't do the same in the UK as the US. In the UK the shares would have to have equal voting rights rather than in the US where they can change the rights to suit their needs, ie. a diminshed voting right (only 10%) on the shares issued compared to the ones they own. Basically, if one person bought the full shares they would still only have 0.7% voting rights compared to the Glazer's 99.3%.

So they could sell Rooney's hair but not the rest of him ?

[Beefymcfc]

Do they pay any corporation tax in the UK? I would have thought all of those interest payments would pretty much wipe out any profits they had in the first place (and also the possibility that the interest payments were designed in such a way as to help them reduce profits low enough to not pay and UK corporation tax anyway).

I read somewhere that it is approx 8% higher in the US, ours approx 28%, which begs the question, why?

It's clear that it's aimed at fans rather than investors yet they choose to float in the US. It's all about the type of share they want issuing as they can't do the same in the UK as the US. In the UK the shares would have to have equal voting rights rather than in the US where they can change the rights to suit their needs, ie. a diminshed voting right (only 10%) on the shares issued compared to the ones they own. Basically, if one person bought the full shares they would still only have 0.7% voting rights compared to the Glazer's 99.3%.

So they could sell Rooney's hair but not the rest of him ?

Depends. You've heard of Samson and Delilah haven't you?

[Beefymcfc]

On a sidenote what's happening behind the scenes. Just read that Fryers could be off the Spurs and with them losing Pogba and Morrison from their up and coming there seems to be an air of 'Sinking Ship' going on. Seems nobody wants to take up their offers.

Manchester United defender Ezekiel Fryers is on the verge of completing his move to Tottenham after deciding not to sign a new deal with the Champions League side.

[blues-clues]

Just looking at the accounts it is hard to tell the true story -surprise surprise

Manchester Untied Ltd appear to have paid £65m in taxes in the last three years

Their parent company though, Red Football Ltd only report taxes of £45m in the last three years but their parent company

Red Joint Venture Ltd and their parent, Red Football Shareholder Ltd seem to have have tax rebates totalling about £5m in the last two years and to have paid only £10m in taxes in total in the last three years.

Seems they have got to grips with the system and are now getting the UK taxpayer to help fund the Glazers too!

[Ted Hughes]

On a sidenote what's happening behind the scenes. Just read that Fryers could be off the Spurs and with them losing Pogba and Morrison from their up and coming there seems to be an air of 'Sinking Ship' going on. Seems nobody wants to take up their offers.

Manchester United defender Ezekiel Fryers is on the verge of completing his move to Tottenham after deciding not to sign a new deal with the Champions League side.

This is odd.

And good.