2010 Financials

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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby BmoreBlue » Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:07 pm

Socrates wrote:
Fish111 wrote:I haven't a clue what amortisation is so i will just bury my head in the sand and hope it all works out in the end.


it's the writing off of what we pay for players we buy spread over the lifetime of their contracts.


i believe we can write the entire transfer fee off as a one time expense (realised in FY 2010), instead of amortising over the life of the contract - this will lead to massive losses this year (the ones just released) and next year (when the transfers of Silva/Toure/etc are added in), but assuming we don't continue to buy 6+ players every year, we should be just fine.

remember the rules don't kick in for a few years yet - city is spending big now with that idea in mind - the fact that television, sponsor, and merchandise revenues are up so high is what people should be focusing on - add in champions league money and we'll meet the fair play regs no problem - remember also that teams can continue to operate at a loss (albeit smaller than 121m) for several years, at least until 2018.
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby Socrates » Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:18 pm

BmoreBlue wrote:
Socrates wrote:
Fish111 wrote:I haven't a clue what amortisation is so i will just bury my head in the sand and hope it all works out in the end.


it's the writing off of what we pay for players we buy spread over the lifetime of their contracts.


i believe we can write the entire transfer fee off as a one time expense (realised in FY 2010), instead of amortising over the life of the contract - this will lead to massive losses this year (the ones just released) and next year (when the transfers of Silva/Toure/etc are added in), but assuming we don't continue to buy 6+ players every year, we should be just fine.

remember the rules don't kick in for a few years yet - city is spending big now with that idea in mind - the fact that television, sponsor, and merchandise revenues are up so high is what people should be focusing on - add in champions league money and we'll meet the fair play regs no problem - remember also that teams can continue to operate at a loss (albeit smaller than 121m) for several years, at least until 2018.


we don't appear to have written them off in one go in 2010, I suspect we have assurances from UEFA that they can simply be discounted from calculations if they originate from before the start of the new rules coming in. Don't forget that the accounts themselves only form the basis of the UEFA calculation, some expenses can already be discounted such as costs of stadium developments and academy expenditure. So there may be provision for further adjustment on amortisation.
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby mcfc1632 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:18 pm

Beefymcfc wrote:I like it........like it a lot. Especially as we've won nowt.............yet!

Corporate partnership revenue increasing by £25.9m to £32.4m

Ticketing revenues increasing by £2.8m (18.6%) to £18.2m

Season ticket revenues up by £0.9m to £9.6m

Television rights fee income increasing by £5.7m (11.8%) to £54m

Match day hospitality revenue growing by £0.7m (13%) to £6.1m

Retail sales and merchandise revenue increasing by £2.9m (60%) to £7.9m



These are the key elements - and the reason I bang on about the importance of Cook - verbal gaffes are bollocks in comparison with the importance of his business acumen and people should stop going on about the trivia- also the work with the local authorities could be of major importance

That 'partnership' (sponsorship) growth is in excess of 400% (staggering business result) - along with CL revenues this is where we will meet the regulations - if this can be doubled again over the next couple of years - but CL is a must - we need to maximise all matchday revenues (part of the reason I was miffed about the league cup approach)
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby john68 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 2:53 pm

We have recently added Disney to our list of partners. I take it that none of this deal is included in the report.
Can anyone play around with figures to show the potential of this deal and its implications for our future...please...ta.
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby DoomMerchant » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:04 pm

john68 wrote:We have recently added Disney to our list of partners. I take it that none of this deal is included in the report.
Can anyone play around with figures to show the potential of this deal and its implications for our future...please...ta.


their office is like a mile from me...lemme walk over John and demand some fuclin answers!

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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby john68 » Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:17 pm

DoomMerchant wrote:
john68 wrote:We have recently added Disney to our list of partners. I take it that none of this deal is included in the report.
Can anyone play around with figures to show the potential of this deal and its implications for our future...please...ta.


their office is like a mile from me...lemme walk over John and demand some fuclin answers!

Hi Ho. Hi Ho...

cheers


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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby ronk » Fri Oct 01, 2010 6:00 pm

Beefymcfc wrote:I like it........like it a lot. Especially as we've won nowt.............yet!

Corporate partnership revenue increasing by £25.9m to £32.4m

Ticketing revenues increasing by £2.8m (18.6%) to £18.2m

Season ticket revenues up by £0.9m to £9.6m

Television rights fee income increasing by £5.7m (11.8%) to £54m

Match day hospitality revenue growing by £0.7m (13%) to £6.1m

Retail sales and merchandise revenue increasing by £2.9m (60%) to £7.9m


So corporate partnership is worth about the same as ticket sales, merchandise, retail and matchday hospitality combined. Incredible! Even with big growth in those. It's actually breathtaking.

What's going on with hospitality and the increase in service quality in boxes could lead to a situation where the next accounts would, if published, reveal that hospitality has passed out season ticket sales in terms of revenue.

There's good and bad about that. The season ticket holders' cash becomes a less important consideration for the club so they may feel marginalised, the good would be that even doubling season ticket prices wouldn't add a lot to the bottom line so there'd be little need to increase prices steeply when they make up a small fraction of total revenue, especially when the consequences of such a strategy are so obvious at the swamp.
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby blootoof » Fri Oct 01, 2010 9:38 pm

Thought I'd post this here

Alan Sugar fears for United and Liverpool

Former Tottenham chairman Lord Alan Sugar has delivered a biting analysis of the financial state of global giants Manchester United and Liverpool.

Lord Sugar, who headed the Labour Government's taskforce on business affairs, forecast a doomsday scenario for both elite clubs and the former Spurs chairman also had his say on the controversial issue of foreign owners.

''If you are asking me if foreign owners are good for football then I would have to split them into two categories,'' Lord Sugar told ESPNsoccernet. "There is Roman Abramovich and that bloke from the Middle East [Sheikh Mansour bin Zayed al Nahyan at Manchester City]. To a certain extent [Fulham's] Mohammed Al-Fayed and, although I was not a foreign owner, I would include myself in this category of owners who use their own money to buy football clubs.

"How can you say anything about these foreign owners? Roman Abramovich is passionate about Chelsea and football and he is putting up the money to buy the best players in the world, and now Manchester City are doing the same. Yes, it might be unfair to everyone else, but that's life, and it hasn't done much harm to their football clubs, now has it?

"But there is another type of foreign owner: The Glazers and those guys at Liverpool, Hicks and Gillett. Now, I am sorry to have to say this, but they are done. They are gone. They have big problems ahead.

"When you buy big clubs like Manchester United and Liverpool without using your own money and lumber the club with enormous interest repayments on the debt, then you are asking for problems, and both clubs have got them."

Manchester City posted the second highest one year loss on Friday (at £121 million), with Abramovich's Chelsea the top of the list in 2004-05 (at £141 million), but as Lord Sugar maintains it is meaningless in terms of the clubs' business plan, as they are supported by their owners own cash.

"Reckless lending caused the demise of the banking industry throughout the world, and banks were irresponsible in lending to these guys to enable them to buy such big football clubs,'' he said. "They have used the club as an asset against the loans and that has resulted in big interest repayments on the debt.

"Here's the bad news: One day the Glazers, the Gilletts and Hicks' will find its payback time and, when that day comes, if they haven't got the money, they default, and it's a nightmare scenario for the clubs.

"A bank somewhere is going to own the football club and hope desperately that some investor will take over the debt. But why would they? I wouldn't. Absolutely not. Football is not good business. An electrical company, a food chain, yes, why not, but football, you've got to be joking.''

With his own experiences of owning Tottenham behind him, Lord Sugar has nothing but fear for United and Liverpool's current situation.

"Manchester United is funding £50 million a year in interest repayments with a debt of £700 million plus,'' he said. ''If it didn't then that £50 million a year would be spent on players and the club. Same at Liverpool, £40 million a year on interest repayments. That leaves me really, really worried for those clubs.

"What a great institution Liverpool is, what a great football club, but my forecast is that the owners will inevitably default on their loans, it puts the bank in an embarrassing position, and the bank will write off a large chunk of the debt to make it viable for an investor to step in and take it over.

"Liverpool don't need to build a stadium straight away, that's not the priority, the priority is to find the right business model to enable it to buy players and stay where they are, and challenge for the top four places. To do that they need to wipe their debts clear of the bank.''

Lord Sugar cites the example of Leeds United, who dropped to League One because of their financial problems as a warning from the past, but thinks that history could repeat itself.

"It would be an unbelievable travesty if Liverpool would slip away like Leeds and end up in the second division,'' he said. ''That will happen if they are not careful. Manchester United have more time, the Glazers have given themselves more breathing space as their loans are not up until 2016.''

However, he does not believe that the Red Knights' bid to save United from the Glazers is the answer to their problems.

"This Red Knights fiasco, well that is rubbish,'' he said. ''Supporters might have passion and love their club but it would be out of the frying pan into the fire, with other debts to the banks, as I doubt whether it will be their own money.

"It's all very well saying the Glazers are horrible people with no passion and they borrowed far too much money, but the Red Knights are not the answer.

"I can see the Glazers selling up and they must be waiting until the world economy improves or some mad Russian or Chinese comes along and gives them £2 billion for the club. I cannot believe they turned down £1.5 billion, as they would love to get themselves out of their debt, I am sure.

"They realise now that whatever prompted them to buy Manchester United they got it wrong, They need to find someone with many billions to spare who just wants to own Manchester United."
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby crossan » Mon Oct 04, 2010 2:15 pm

Who's bothered about what debt we are in!! we are 2nd in the premier league,the owner can afford it can't he with the millions at his disposal,even if it was twice that its no problem,we have to pay wages high enough to attract all of the mercanaries that are queing up to join our club.................hey ho.
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby Moonchesteri » Thu Aug 02, 2012 6:49 am

Anyone know when the Annual report from 2011-12 will be published ?
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby Invisible Man Fan » Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:33 am

Assuming City's Financial Year End is still 31st May, then they don't have to file their accounts until January 2014 for May just gone, as it falls into the Tax Year 6th April 2012-5th April 2013....which in turn will mean January 2014.

I doubt they will leave it that long, but you never know
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"If we think we can fix the problem by buying expensive players - We'll become City"
"If we remember the good times to entertain us during the bad times - We'll become Liverpool"

So, keep calm and do it the United way


"We invest in young players, That is what we are good at — we’re not like other clubs who can spend fortunes on proven goods. We know that Manchester City are going to pay stupid money, pay silly salaries and all that. We can’t do anything about it. We concentrate on what we can do to try to bring players in for the right reasons. We invest in those who will be with the club for a long time, who will create the character of the club, who will create excitement for our fans. We are very proud of that and we are going to continue that way" - Alex Ferguson 14th May 2012
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby Socrates » Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:28 am

City aren't a sole trader mate! Regular limited companies (i.e. not plcs) have to file accounts with Companies House by 9 months after the year end, so they are due by 28/02/2013. They were released much earlier last year though and I would magine they will be again.
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Re: 2010 Financials

Postby Slim » Fri Aug 03, 2012 4:30 am

Socrates wrote:City aren't a sole trader mate! Regular limited companies (i.e. not plcs) have to file accounts with Companies House by 9 months after the year end, so they are due by 28/02/2013. They were released much earlier last year though and I would magine they will be again.


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