Proposals to Extend FFP to Premier League Itself

[Ted Hughes]

I am of the feeling that we will be close enough to breaking even this year or even making a small profit that all this FFP won't be an issue.We have had about 49% growth in the past two years so even if we achieve half of that we are well on target.

Agreed - due to the good management of Kahldoon and his team(s) we are going to be OK - but the doors will be closed to others

FFP in both THE EPL and UeFA give the old cartel what they want and whilst I am happy for us to be through due to the immense good fortune of attracting the Sheik and his team - still does not change the fact that it is a disgrace a) the rest are fucked and b) how these regs are still able to be portrayed by the scum and their cohorts as other than just a self-serving strcuture of protectionof the status quo

It doesn't matter whether we comply or not, we are still fucked unless we either match Utd's income or find a loophole.

They will just spend more than us & leave us behind. That is what the whole thing is designed for.

Don't think that could happen.
We have already overtaken them regarding some income streams and started using the loopholes already.
E.g.
Premier League broadcasting payments for 2011/12
Arsenal £56.2m
Aston Villa £42.1m
Blackburn £40.3m
Bolton £40.6m
Chelsea £54.4m
Everton £48.9m
Fulham £47.4m
Liverpool £54.4m
Manchester City £60.6m
Manchester United £60.3m
Newcastle £54.2m
Norwich £45.6m
QPR £43.3m
Stoke £43.6m
Sunderland £44.4m
Swansea £45.9m
Tottenham £57.3m
West Brom £46.6m
Wigan £42.8m
Wolves £39.1m
Total £968.2m

You do realise that the stats you have given are just for Premier League prize money & that the clubs'income is much much more don't you ?

Here is the actual list from last year. We are probably similar to Liverpool/Shalke now. Meaning Utd potentially have 160 million Euros more to play with PER YEAR according to Platini/Gill etc. Meaning they can destroy us as competitors if they ever get taken over or the Glazers get a partner to pay the debt. Even without that, they will be able to outspend us if they prove they can borrow more & pay it off.



1. Real Madrid: 479.5m euros
2. Barcelona: 450.7m euros
3. Man Utd: 367m euros
4. Bayern Munich: 321.4m euros
5. Arsenal: 251.1m euros
6. Chelsea: 249.8m euros
7. AC Milan: 235.1.m euros
8. Internazionale: 211.4m euros
9. Liverpool: 203.3m euros
10. Schalke: 202.4m euros

[john68]

Ted,
Those figures cover the 12010/11 season and City are listed at 12th with a total of 169.6M Euros, leaving us around 200M Euros behind the rags and 100M Euros (give or take a few quid) behind both Chelsea and Arsenal.

Any Prem FFPR would see us struggling massively to keep pace.

[Rag_hater]

I am of the feeling that we will be close enough to breaking even this year or even making a small profit that all this FFP won't be an issue.We have had about 49% growth in the past two years so even if we achieve half of that we are well on target.

Agreed - due to the good management of Kahldoon and his team(s) we are going to be OK - but the doors will be closed to others

FFP in both THE EPL and UeFA give the old cartel what they want and whilst I am happy for us to be through due to the immense good fortune of attracting the Sheik and his team - still does not change the fact that it is a disgrace a) the rest are fucked and b) how these regs are still able to be portrayed by the scum and their cohorts as other than just a self-serving strcuture of protectionof the status quo

It doesn't matter whether we comply or not, we are still fucked unless we either match Utd's income or find a loophole.

They will just spend more than us & leave us behind. That is what the whole thing is designed for.

Don't think that could happen.
We have already overtaken them regarding some income streams and started using the loopholes already.
E.g.
Premier League broadcasting payments for 2011/12
Arsenal £56.2m
Aston Villa £42.1m
Blackburn £40.3m
Bolton £40.6m
Chelsea £54.4m
Everton £48.9m
Fulham £47.4m
Liverpool £54.4m
Manchester City £60.6m
Manchester United £60.3m
Newcastle £54.2m
Norwich £45.6m
QPR £43.3m
Stoke £43.6m
Sunderland £44.4m
Swansea £45.9m
Tottenham £57.3m
West Brom £46.6m
Wigan £42.8m
Wolves £39.1m
Total £968.2m

You do realise that the stats you have given are just for Premier League prize money & that the clubs'income is much much more don't you ?

Here is the actual list from last year. We are probably similar to Liverpool/Shalke now. Meaning Utd potentially have 160 million Euros more to play with PER YEAR according to Platini/Gill etc. Meaning they can destroy us as competitors if they ever get taken over or the Glazers get a partner to pay the debt. Even without that, they will be able to outspend us if they prove they can borrow more & pay it off.



1. Real Madrid: 479.5m euros
2. Barcelona: 450.7m euros
3. Man Utd: 367m euros
4. Bayern Munich: 321.4m euros
5. Arsenal: 251.1m euros
6. Chelsea: 249.8m euros
7. AC Milan: 235.1.m euros
8. Internazionale: 211.4m euros
9. Liverpool: 203.3m euros
10. Schalke: 202.4m euros

Sorry if I did not make myself clear but I did only mean some forms of income.Sure you are right that the fuckers are miles ahead of us overall but as a begining we are starting to overtake them.I have read that the Sheikh wants to get our turnover around the 400million a year mark.What the Sheikh wants the Sheikh gets.That's why we got this Sorrano guy.
in my view the people who have sponsered us and our ground being called what it is and the 350 mill for whatever seem loopholes to me but maybe I am wrong.

[Ted Hughes]

I think you are correct but Platini & his cronies are threatening to stop us from doing stuff like that or at least to devalue such deals.

Imo, if we are to comply with this ridiculous, bent ruling, then in the short term, we will have to produce many more such deals to bridge the gap between us & the likes of Real Madrid.

The big problem comes, imo, if Platini, Gill etc try to impose sanctions on us for doing that.

I don't think we will stand for it it & I think we are collecting some of the top legal experts ready to do battle should that happen.

[Socrates]

If the FFP for the Prem is the same as for UEFA then this really doesn't make that much difference to City, beyond removing the option of dropping out of UEFA comps for a couple of years while we straighten the books - which is an unlikely scenario. What it does do is completely entrench all clubs into their current position in the hierarchy. It's wrong and I'm against it but not just from a City p-o-v, from an ethical stand point too. It is also bad for football as a whole to put a cap on the aspirations of 99% of clubs and 90% of supporters, that way lies falling attendances and falling incomes across the board...

[Redna]

La Liga must be a G14 sweet dream. 2 teams battling it out forever. Maybe Spain like this thing. Watching a football gamein La Liga is like watching a bull fight. It's drama, it's flair but you most defenitely know who's gonna win.
May I say I always supports the bull ;)
CTID!!

[Im_Spartacus]

If the FFP for the Prem is the same as for UEFA then this really doesn't make that much difference to City, beyond removing the option of dropping out of UEFA comps for a couple of years while we straighten the books - which is an unlikely scenario. What it does do is completely entrench all clubs into their current position in the hierarchy. It's wrong and I'm against it but not just from a City p-o-v, from an ethical stand point too. It is also bad for football as a whole to put a cap on the aspirations of 99% of clubs and 90% of supporters, that way lies falling attendances and falling incomes across the board...

It would have been fine doing this 20/25 years ago, when the gulf between the biggest clubs and the smaller ones in the league was a few million per year in turnover - eg, 1988 United's turnover was about 10m, city's about 7m

That sort of gap whilst the rags had 50% greater income, can be overcome with shrewd signings and good management. However there is absolutely no possibility that if all else was equal (eg, no debt) Liverpool, with £200m turnover, could ever keep up with a club which has £360m - that is a gap that can't be bridged by good management.

The bird has flown on this as soon as the PL, then CL came into the picture. Any measures now will unfortunately as you say, do no more than maintain the status quo.

[Ted Hughes]

If the FFP for the Prem is the same as for UEFA then this really doesn't make that much difference to City, beyond removing the option of dropping out of UEFA comps for a couple of years while we straighten the books - which is an unlikely scenario. What it does do is completely entrench all clubs into their current position in the hierarchy. It's wrong and I'm against it but not just from a City p-o-v, from an ethical stand point too. It is also bad for football as a whole to put a cap on the aspirations of 99% of clubs and 90% of supporters, that way lies falling attendances and falling incomes across the board...

It would have been fine doing this 20/25 years ago, when the gulf between the biggest clubs and the smaller ones in the league was a few million per year in turnover - eg, 1988 United's turnover was about 10m, city's about 7m

That sort of gap whilst the rags had 50% greater income, can be overcome with shrewd signings and good management. However there is absolutely no possibility that if all else was equal (eg, no debt) Liverpool, with £200m turnover, could ever keep up with a club which has £360m - that is a gap that can't be bridged by good management.

The bird has flown on this as soon as the PL, then CL came into the picture. Any measures now will unfortunately as you say, do no more than maintain the status quo.

We will be in the same position as Liverpool; totally left behind by Real Madrid & the rags etc unless we get our income to the same level. That's the difference it will make.

[Risby]

I think you all have a good point. We are behind in terms of turnover and at this moment in time we are probably going to get out wrists slapped by UEFA for our spending over recent years.
But I do think the club are exploring every possible avenue and I also believe that as long as we have the success on the pitch, our turnover will continue to grow.
What worries me is the reason fans abroad started supporting us in the first place. It was because we were different, we wanted the best players and we brought in marquee players. This enticed fans and businesses to sit up and take notice.
If we stop causing a splash, and let everything settle down, we could lose potential fans to Chelsea or god forbid, the rags. We need exposure and that is caused by winning and the players we bring in.

[Ted Hughes]

I think you all have a good point. We are behind in terms of turnover and at this moment in time we are probably going to get out wrists slapped by UEFA for our spending over recent years.
But I do think the club are exploring every possible avenue and I also believe that as long as we have the success on the pitch, our turnover will continue to grow.
What worries me is the reason fans abroad started supporting us in the first place. It was because we were different, we wanted the best players and we brought in marquee players. This enticed fans and businesses to sit up and take notice.
If we stop causing a splash, and let everything settle down, we could lose potential fans to Chelsea or god forbid, the rags. We need exposure and that is caused by winning and the players we bring in.

No way are we just going to sit there & get shafted. We will either find huge sponsorship or we will call their bluff.

[Risby]

No way are we just going to sit there & get shafted. We will either find huge sponsorship or we will call their bluff.

I agree, the men in charge of our club will be wise to any regulations we need to abide by and will do their best to meet them.
We already have a huge spinsterhood deal and we are trying to break into foreign countries and markets. But essentially it is our team of stars that will lead the way. Our brand is our team and the success it achieves. We need to keep bringing in the top quality players to entice new fans and maybe the big businesses. This way our cash flow will continue to grow faster than that we are spending.

[Bianchi on Ice]

UNITED WANT FAIR FIGHT

daily express headline
So brazen in their greed and self interest

Dave whelan "i think City have shaken them up a little bit" yeh right...its not fair wah wah wah

[lets all have a disco]

Dont worry # and Soriano will sort these cunts out.

Debt-good.
Rich owner who is building a team and a legacy for his/our club in East Manchester-Bad.

[Swales4ever]

Dont worry # and Soriano will sort these cunts out.

Debt-good.
Rich owner who is building a team and a legacy for his/our club in East Manchester-Bad.

Absolutely This.

[Blue Blood]

The FA are to nominate David Gill as their candidate for the Uefa executive.
Twatini would have a side-kick for is FFP plans

http://www.thefa.com/News/2012/jul/2012/aug/david-gill-uefa-executive.aspx


FA Board nominate David Gill as its candidate for UEFA Executive Committee.
The FA Board on Thursday agreed to nominate David Gill as its candidate for the upcoming UEFA Executive Committee membership election.

Gill, Chief Executive of Manchester United Football Club and an FA Board member, has been proposed ahead of next year’s elections at UEFA Congress in London.

Geoff Thompson, who has represented The FA on UEFA’s Executive Committee since 2000, steps down in May leaving a vacant position for an elected representative.

Staggering decision.

I don't think any person with a vested interest at club level should ever be voted onto any Executive Committee with the power to influence the game at club level.

If you believe people like Gill are going to do anything but enhance the power of their respective clubs in these positions, you are mad.

Gill and Platini and their FFP ideals aren't protecting football, it's just an excuse to protect their own interests, it's Anti-competitive and morally disgusting to stop major investment in lesser teams, so I hope City resist this completely for the sake of all other clubs dreaming of a fairy tail like ours. Checks on owners need to be tightened for sure and money guarantees to the club from owners need to be enforced but new investment in football should not be so harshly punished and discouraged.

It's condemning the poor to always be poor and the rich to always be rich. How is that fair? Rich owners should be allowed to shake things up, I mean it's not like poor old United, Bayern and Real have grown their clubs from the grass roots without major investment.

The whole FFP thing is just wrong. Not just because it stifles us, it also is a big fuck you to any team who has ambition to go beyond their station.

FFP is just another term for dictatorship in my book. Absolute joke that it has got so far.