Our Recent Signings, Non-Signings And Sales

[bluebananamilksheikh]

When assessing transfer targets & players we ha brought you look at them & think would any of the players get into the top sides in England & indeed Europe.

2012-2013 Main Transfers

Players in :- Nastisic might well get in a lot of the top teams squads, if not starting ( one for the future )
Garcia, Rodwell, Sinclair - Never & given his age and current fitness/speed Maicon no.
Richard Wright ??

Players out :- Balo & De Jong, at their best they would get in most teams in the Prem & are now playing for AC at present.

That's how rightly or wrongly have judged our transfers, if they are not going to get in other clubs's 1st teams how are they going to improve our team.
We have bought squad players who have no chance of playing in the 1st team barring a injury crisis, we needed player to give us options to overcome loss of form and to give us alternative tactics.
We have kept basically the same 1st team as last year, last year we may hit our maximum level with the players we have, so you bring in players to counteract loss of form and suitable cover for injuries.
We did neither, so bad planning or execution of plans ?
Or maybe the FFP People have got their wish?

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

I've never quite understood the economics of the NDJ thing. If we had given him the wages he wanted, it must have been a considerable amount cheaper than a fat transfer fee and wages for Garcia.
Add in that Nige worked for us, and Garcia looks a little poor so far, and it makes even less sense.
Bob didn't seem to want to play him that often and presumably thought a defensive wrecker was easily replaced. Add in that he has been after DDR for time and it all adds up to him not rating De Jong.
Incidentally, does anybody think DDR was the missing piece of the jigsaw and just what we needed? (And that is a genuine question and not sarcastic point scoring.)

I think the ndj thing was as much about who his agent was than anything else. Remember we had lost tevez for 6 months and lost our Chief exec because of that cunts manouverings. This, I believe is the ultimate reason for city not offering a contract

He was also, ultimately one dimensional and we could have done better, but i dont see why we went ahead with the signings we did when we could have just let de jongs contract expire and been no worse off for it

Well that theory is fine, except, we are now supposedly talking to Handsome Carlito about a contract extension.

[Ted Hughes]

When assessing transfer targets & players we ha brought you look at them & think would any of the players get into the top sides in England & indeed Europe.

2012-2013 Main Transfers

Players in :- Nastisic might well get in a lot of the top teams squads, if not starting ( one for the future )
Garcia, Rodwell, Sinclair - Never & given his age and current fitness/speed Maicon no.
Richard Wright ??

Players out :- Balo & De Jong, at their best they would get in most teams in the Prem & are now playing for AC at present.

That's how rightly or wrongly have judged our transfers, if they are not going to get in other clubs's 1st teams how are they going to improve our team.
We have bought squad players who have no chance of playing in the 1st team barring a injury crisis, we needed player to give us options to overcome loss of form and to give us alternative tactics.
We have kept basically the same 1st team as last year, last year we may hit our maximum level with the players we have, so you bring in players to counteract loss of form and suitable cover for injuries.
We did neither, so bad planning or execution of plans ?
Or maybe the FFP People have got their wish?

When Khaldoon was asked about signings, he said 'we won't be doing much, just a little, maybe one or perhaps two players' .

When they asked Mancini 'five or six players'.

We signed five or six rather than selling Balotelli & signing the two.

[Im_Spartacus]

I was really hoping that this thread would be about our transfer policy rather than turning into yet another 'Mancini Out' - 'Who Do We Replace Him With' thread.

If the transfer policy is all about Mancini managing under a reduced wage bill for FFPR, and he is unable to do that, it all really becomes one and the same issue doesnt it?

If you believe that Mancini has total and complete control over which players come and go it does.

But I think we all know that isn't the case.

Did Mancini really want Sinclair (he doesn't use wingers) and Rodwell (who is always injured) or were they brought in because they are young and English? Did he really prioritise signing a right-back when we already had Micah and Zab at the club? Was he happy to see Mario go? His interviews and quotes in the press since would suggest that he wasn't.

The nature of a manager at the very top of world football is effectively that of a coach with a bit of a say. But that's it, its a "bit" of a say in matters, and even more so with the advent of FFP as restrictions come to bite.

The old way we are used to of the manager being in charge of scouting, transfers, training etc, as a mid table club is history, and we saw that as far back as with the "signing by committee" of Adam Johnson, which we all agreed at the time was unlikely to have been Mancini's choice, and which was confirmed by Cook/Marwood in an interview where they confirmed they had been watching Johnson for a couple of years.

I think the transfer policy last summer was frankly bollocks whoever was in charge - and amidst all the anger at Mancini over results, I won't get sucked into saying that it was his fault we signed Rodwell and Sinclair. I don't believe he wanted Rodwell or Sinclair - Maicon, I believe having worked with him before he thought he could do a job either as an auxiliary winger, OR the club knew that there was a longer term issue with Richards. I believe it's likely he did want Garcia as a 2nd choice to Martinez.

But, as per the opening of this post, it's the modern coach's job to work with what you have, and manage that group of players to its potential. Now regardless which side of the fence you sit on, it is clear to a blind man on a galloping horse that he has failed to manage this squad (whatever its shortcomings) to its potential in the current season which is why, his ability to do so is very much part of the same issue as the club''s transfer policy moving forwards.

[Blue Since 76]

Was planning on starting a similar thread, but never works properly on my phone.

The last two windows, summer in particular, almost look as if the club had lost faith in Mancini and didn't want to give him any money. However, since they ask have him a new contract, that doesn't make sense. He wanted more expensive players and they said no. Who/why inferior players were brought in is a different matter as we may as well have saved Sinclair's fee and wages for someone we actually wanted.

So are we in a different phase of the project? The key thing initially was to get into the top 4 before FFP so that we could get the income before the doors were shut. That's complete and we're now a solid top 4 team.

Are we therefore now trying to consolidate and reduce un-necessary overheads so we can move forwards again? We're still paying for the likes of Bridge and RSC. Kolo was probably the best paid defender until Kompany's new contract, despite being 4th choice. AJ was given a big pay rise and then didn't live up to it, so a cheap replacement was brought in, it's just not worked out. De Jong wouldn't take realistic wages for a player of his quality; so someone was brought in who would.

The problem for Mancini is that the expectations for performance could be different despite the lack of spending. We may have known that the squad wasn't good enough to win the CL, but it should get to say the quarters, this increasing revenue further and allowing the next step. Same domestically - may not be quite good enough to retain the title, but we'd accept second and within 5 points of first etc. Revenue wouldn't change massively because of that, so allows consolidation.

So Mancini could be doing exactly what the club want, Wenger style. Or he could be under achieving if they want someone to coach the best out of the resources he has rather than just scream that he needs new toys.

Summer will probably tell. None of that adds up to Mourinho for me, although the rumours of Moyes may make more sense, as he's seen as someone who gets cheaper players to over perform (not for discussion, just the general perception).

Despite what Mancio may say, has the club gone whole heartedly for FFP and we're doing whatever it takes to stay legal? Whilst it may mean a couple of years without a CL trophy or maybe a PL one, I'd accept that to make us sustainable and then grow again from there when the expanded stadium is available and other funding streams have come on.

[Alioune DVToure]

Can we clear this bollocks up once and for all:

Mancini tried to sign Rodwell two fucking years ago. He did his 'it is difficult, he is an Everton player' speech, then when we signed him this time, he said 'we have been following him for a long time'.

How much evidence do you need ? MANCINI SIGNED RODWELL

He signed Sinclair because he is English & there was a space available. We were clearly after someone else, perhaps Walcott, & Sinclair was hanging around on standby, then we couldn't get whoever it was & Mancini Signed Sinclair. We were talking to Garcia in June, probably as backup to DeRossi.

Brian Marwood does not go round forcing Mancini to sign players. Why the fuck would he ? I can totally agree with the concept that Marwood tries to curb his spending, as Txiki has just done, but signing players he knows Mancini won't play ? For what ? In order to get himself fucking fired ? Mancini goes to Khaldoon & says; 'Marwood made me spend £50 mil I didn't want to ?'

I suppose Marwood's long standing connections with Maicon are the reason he forced Mancini to sign him ?

Can we just stop with this nonsense.

Mancini signed Maicon because he was determined to fanny about with that 5-3-2/3-5-2 bollocks which was a bit of a disaster.

As for the others, Sinclair has been underused and I'm convinced Rodwell will come. But both were Mancini signings, of course. Perhaps not first-choice signings, but his signings nonetheless.

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

I was really hoping that this thread would be about our transfer policy rather than turning into yet another 'Mancini Out' - 'Who Do We Replace Him With' thread.

If the transfer policy is all about Mancini managing under a reduced wage bill for FFPR, and he is unable to do that, it all really becomes one and the same issue doesnt it?

If you believe that Mancini has total and complete control over which players come and go it does.

But I think we all know that isn't the case.

Did Mancini really want Sinclair (he doesn't use wingers) and Rodwell (who is always injured) or were they brought in because they are young and English? Did he really prioritise signing a right-back when we already had Micah and Zab at the club? Was he happy to see Mario go? His interviews and quotes in the press since would suggest that he wasn't.

Can we clear this bollocks up once and for all:

Mancini tried to sign Rodwell two fucking years ago. He did his 'it is difficult, he is an Everton player' speech, then when we signed him this time, he said 'we have been following him for a long time'.

How much evidence do you need ? MANCINI SIGNED RODWELL

He signed Sinclair because he is English & there was a space available. We were clearly after someone else, perhaps Walcott, & Sinclair was hanging around on standby, then we couldn't get whoever it was & Mancini Signed Sinclair. We were talking to Garcia in June, probably as backup to DeRossi.

Brian Marwood does not go round forcing Mancini to sign players. Why the fuck would he ? I can totally agree with the concept that Marwood tries to curb his spending, as Txiki has just done, but signing players he knows Mancini won't play ? For what ? In order to get himself fucking fired ? Mancini goes to Khaldoon & says; 'Marwood made me spend £50 mil I didn't want to ?'

I suppose Marwood's long standing connections with Maicon are the reason he forced Mancini to sign him ?

Can we just stop with this nonsense.

Ted, spot on as always. You manage to brush aside this misconception with wise words.
This is a nonsense perpetuated by the 'Mancini Lickers' as some kind of excuse for his generally poor efforts in the transfer market.
Why the fuck would Marwood be picking the players we wanted to buy? It does't even start to make sense.
But he is a handy scapegoat for Mancini's shortcomings.

[Ted Hughes]

I was really hoping that this thread would be about our transfer policy rather than turning into yet another 'Mancini Out' - 'Who Do We Replace Him With' thread.

If the transfer policy is all about Mancini managing under a reduced wage bill for FFPR, and he is unable to do that, it all really becomes one and the same issue doesnt it?

If you believe that Mancini has total and complete control over which players come and go it does.

But I think we all know that isn't the case.

Did Mancini really want Sinclair (he doesn't use wingers) and Rodwell (who is always injured) or were they brought in because they are young and English? Did he really prioritise signing a right-back when we already had Micah and Zab at the club? Was he happy to see Mario go? His interviews and quotes in the press since would suggest that he wasn't.

The nature of a manager at the very top of world football is effectively that of a coach with a bit of a say. But that's it, its a "bit" of a say in matters, and even more so with the advent of FFP as restrictions come to bite.

The old way we are used to of the manager being in charge of scouting, transfers, training etc, as a mid table club is history, and we saw that as far back as with the "signing by committee" of Adam Johnson, which we all agreed at the time was unlikely to have been Mancini's choice, and which was confirmed by Cook/Marwood in an interview where they confirmed they had been watching Johnson for a couple of years.

I think the transfer policy last summer was frankly bollocks whoever was in charge - and amidst all the anger at Mancini over results, I won't get sucked into saying that it was his fault we signed Rodwell and Sinclair. I don't believe he wanted Rodwell or Sinclair - Maicon, I believe having worked with him before he thought he could do a job either as an auxiliary winger, OR the club knew that there was a longer term issue with Richards. I believe it's likely he did want Garcia as a 2nd choice to Martinez.

But, as per the opening of this post, it's the modern coach's job to work with what you have, and manage that group of players to its potential. Now regardless which side of the fence you sit on, it is clear to a blind man on a galloping horse that he has failed to manage this squad (whatever its shortcomings) to its potential in the current season which is why, his ability to do so is very much part of the same issue as the club''s transfer policy moving forwards.

Why do people think he is allowed to sign players he wants but not allowed to not sign players he doesn't want ?

Can someone explain that to me ?

[bluebananamilksheikh]

When assessing transfer targets & players we ha brought you look at them & think would any of the players get into the top sides in England & indeed Europe.

2012-2013 Main Transfers

Players in :- Nastisic might well get in a lot of the top teams squads, if not starting ( one for the future )
Garcia, Rodwell, Sinclair - Never & given his age and current fitness/speed Maicon no.
Richard Wright ??

Players out :- Balo & De Jong, at their best they would get in most teams in the Prem & are now playing for AC at present.

That's how rightly or wrongly have judged our transfers, if they are not going to get in other clubs's 1st teams how are they going to improve our team.
We have bought squad players who have no chance of playing in the 1st team barring a injury crisis, we needed player to give us options to overcome loss of form and to give us alternative tactics.
We have kept basically the same 1st team as last year, last year we may hit our maximum level with the players we have, so you bring in players to counteract loss of form and suitable cover for injuries.
We did neither, so bad planning or execution of plans ?
Or maybe the FFP People have got their wish?

When Khaldoon was asked about signings, he said 'we won't be doing much, just a little, maybe one or perhaps two players' .

When they asked Mancini 'five or six players'.

We signed five or six rather than selling Balotelli & signing the two.

Mancini wanted a bigger squad to be competitive in all competitions and we have ended up with a worse squad that is now effectively left with the FA Cup and cementing a Champion's league place. If we carry on like yesterday the champions league place is no certainty.

[Ted Hughes]

When assessing transfer targets & players we ha brought you look at them & think would any of the players get into the top sides in England & indeed Europe.

2012-2013 Main Transfers

Players in :- Nastisic might well get in a lot of the top teams squads, if not starting ( one for the future )
Garcia, Rodwell, Sinclair - Never & given his age and current fitness/speed Maicon no.
Richard Wright ??

Players out :- Balo & De Jong, at their best they would get in most teams in the Prem & are now playing for AC at present.

That's how rightly or wrongly have judged our transfers, if they are not going to get in other clubs's 1st teams how are they going to improve our team.
We have bought squad players who have no chance of playing in the 1st team barring a injury crisis, we needed player to give us options to overcome loss of form and to give us alternative tactics.
We have kept basically the same 1st team as last year, last year we may hit our maximum level with the players we have, so you bring in players to counteract loss of form and suitable cover for injuries.
We did neither, so bad planning or execution of plans ?
Or maybe the FFP People have got their wish?

When Khaldoon was asked about signings, he said 'we won't be doing much, just a little, maybe one or perhaps two players' .

When they asked Mancini 'five or six players'.

We signed five or six rather than selling Balotelli & signing the two.

Mancini wanted a bigger squad to be competitive in all competitions and we have ended up with a worse squad that is now effectively left with the FA Cup and cementing a Champion's league place. If we carry on like yesterday the champions league place is no certainty.

With hindsight, he would have been better off selling Mario & buying a replacement, (it was not very likely we would sanction 5 strikers at the club) but Mario, and also Dzeko for that matter, won the league so deserved another chance.

Imo, his plan for improvement this season was 3 at the back. Rodwell & Garcia were both utility options for that (both can sit or play 3rd cb) Maicon is obvious, Sincair just a wild card. He has been moving toward it for a while. It was a mistake.

People prefer to pretend it was all random rather than see the bleeding obvious which is right under their noses.

[Beefymcfc]

I know a lot has been said about who buys what but one thing I'd suggest is looked at is the timings of the 6 signings. If you don't get an indication from that, then I'm sure you aren't seeing the whole picture.

12 August 2012

Jack Rodwell

30 August 2012

Richard Wright

31 August 2012

Scott Sinclair
Maicon
Matija Nastasić
Javi García

[Ted Hughes]

I know a lot has been said about who buys what but one thing I'd suggest is looked at is the timings of the 6 signings. If you don't get an indication from that, then I'm sure you aren't seeing the whole picture.

12 August 2012

Jack Rodwell

30 August 2012

Richard Wright

31 August 2012

Scott Sinclair
Maicon
Matija Nastasić
Javi García

Yep, the club didn't really want them & Bob argued & kicked up a fuss until he got his way.

[Beefymcfc]

I know a lot has been said about who buys what but one thing I'd suggest is looked at is the timings of the 6 signings. If you don't get an indication from that, then I'm sure you aren't seeing the whole picture.

12 August 2012

Jack Rodwell

30 August 2012

Richard Wright

31 August 2012

Scott Sinclair
Maicon
Matija Nastasić
Javi García

Yep, the club didn't really want them & Bob argued & kicked up a fuss until he got his way.

Well done Ted, you have just confirmed your stance.

[Im_Spartacus]

Why do people think he is allowed to sign players he wants but not allowed to not sign players he doesn't want ?

Can someone explain that to me ?

I mean his preferences. If Rodwell and Garcia were at the top of that list, we've got real fucking problems, but when you miss your targets, and the club sign the 2nd, 3rd or 4th choice, then everyone involved becomes culpable.

[Beefymcfc]

Why do people think he is allowed to sign players he wants but not allowed to not sign players he doesn't want ?

Can someone explain that to me ?

I mean his preferences. If Rodwell and Garcia were at the top of that list, we've got real fucking problems, but when you miss your targets, and the club sign the 2nd, 3rd or 4th choice, then everyone involved becomes culpable.

As listed above. The reason we made last minute signings was due to us not getting our 1st, 2nd or even 3rd choice. Many were brought in to make up the numbers and with many of them being fairly young we'd always get the sell-on value. That is, if they show their worth.

[Peter Doherty (AGAIG)]

When assessing transfer targets & players we ha brought you look at them & think would any of the players get into the top sides in England & indeed Europe.

2012-2013 Main Transfers

Players in :- Nastisic might well get in a lot of the top teams squads, if not starting ( one for the future )
Garcia, Rodwell, Sinclair - Never & given his age and current fitness/speed Maicon no.
Richard Wright ??

Players out :- Balo & De Jong, at their best they would get in most teams in the Prem & are now playing for AC at present.

That's how rightly or wrongly have judged our transfers, if they are not going to get in other clubs's 1st teams how are they going to improve our team.
We have bought squad players who have no chance of playing in the 1st team barring a injury crisis, we needed player to give us options to overcome loss of form and to give us alternative tactics.
We have kept basically the same 1st team as last year, last year we may hit our maximum level with the players we have, so you bring in players to counteract loss of form and suitable cover for injuries.
We did neither, so bad planning or execution of plans ?
Or maybe the FFP People have got their wish?

When Khaldoon was asked about signings, he said 'we won't be doing much, just a little, maybe one or perhaps two players' .

When they asked Mancini 'five or six players'.

We signed five or six rather than selling Balotelli & signing the two.

Mancini wanted a bigger squad to be competitive in all competitions and we have ended up with a worse squad that is now effectively left with the FA Cup and cementing a Champion's league place. If we carry on like yesterday the champions league place is no certainty.

We weren't properly prepared yesterday, so I don't think we'll see a repeat performance again this season.

[Ted Hughes]

Why do people think he is allowed to sign players he wants but not allowed to not sign players he doesn't want ?

Can someone explain that to me ?

I mean his preferences. If Rodwell and Garcia were at the top of that list, we've got real fucking problems, but when you miss your targets, and the club sign the 2nd, 3rd or 4th choice, then everyone involved becomes culpable.

That's how it works yes of course but we don't then say 'ah well you have to sign Garcia & Rodwell' he decides.

Imo he decided he wanted them as options for his 3 at the back plan. Originally that would have been DeRossi & Javi Martinez but they were too expensive/impossible.

Bob would have had those two plus Danny Alvez or similar but we couldn't get them due to not wanting to spend & having no transfer negotiation team because of Soriano/Tricky's imminent arrival.

Instead of leaving it & 'managing' he chose to sign that lot instead.

I'll just say here that I think Garcia is a near miss which could still be ok & Rodwell will be absolutely fine if he actually gets fit; which is my only worry. Most signings are a gamble. I'm delighted we didn't spunk millions on Javi Martinez & although I would have loved DeRossi, I'm not sure of his fitness.

[Ted Hughes]

I know a lot has been said about who buys what but one thing I'd suggest is looked at is the timings of the 6 signings. If you don't get an indication from that, then I'm sure you aren't seeing the whole picture.

12 August 2012

Jack Rodwell

30 August 2012

Richard Wright

31 August 2012

Scott Sinclair
Maicon
Matija Nastasić
Javi García

Yep, the club didn't really want them & Bob argued & kicked up a fuss until he got his way.

Well done Ted, you have just confirmed your stance.

I presume you mean the 'I believe Mancini gave the ok to sign those players' stance ? Yes 100%, count me in.

[Im_Spartacus]

That's how it works yes of course but we don't then say 'ah well you have to sign Garcia & Rodwell' he decides.

Imo he decided he wanted them as options for his 3 at the back plan. Originally that would have been DeRossi & Javi Martinez but they were too expensive/impossible.

Bob would have had those two plus Danny Alvez or similar but we couldn't get them due to not wanting to spend & having no transfer negotiation team because of Soriano/Tricky's imminent arrival.

Instead of leaving it & 'managing' he chose to sign that lot instead.

I'll just say here that I think Garcia is a near miss which could still be ok & Rodwell will be absolutely fine if he actually gets fit; which is my only worry. Most signings are a gamble. I'm delighted we didn't spunk millions on Javi Martinez & although I would have loved DeRossi, I'm not sure of his fitness.

We shouldnt be going that far down the list though should we? If I cant get the pieces of the jigsaw I want, I dont see the logic in Mancini pressing on, or the club backing him.

The logic of those signings as stated by Mancini at the time was to add some additional bodies into the squad to allow us to challenge on all fronts. That has been said by Mancini himself, you however are just speculating about 3 at the back. Whilst those players and the others on the list would have given us flexibility to play that way, I dont believe that 3 at the back was ever his big idea for this season, although it may have been for specific ties like European away games.

If it really was about adding numbers, then we go back to asking why, with the loss of Johnson and De Jong, who were bit part players last season, we suddenly lost so much ground on united.

[Blue Since 76]

We weren't properly prepared yesterday, so I don't think we'll see a repeat performance again this season.

Probably the wrong thread, but 'not properly prepared'? Are you basing that on the internationals? That we've known about for months? And which bit of yesterday just looked like poor preparation? I'd accept that if we'd been undone by a set piece routing they'd used before, but not from being given the run around by a bunch of players, not one of whom anyone would want in our squad