Soriano

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

Much of what you say there is true Kinky, most City fans, even quite short term ones have long since got used to the revolving door of managers, some loved, some hated.

Now that Mancini has gone, the point is moot. The past is the past and the future is what matters. I think some like Piccs have possibly been too busy celebrating on their bouncy castles to understand that the real issue has now moved from Mancini.

I do wonder just how much Piccs actually understands or knows about the guy who now controls football at City or the system that is being embedded at our club and will define it for the foreseeable future.

What I know is that Sheikh Mansour still runs the show. If The Spafia get it wrong, they will get the boot too. I know that I like the decision they have made and the reasons they have given for it. As Kinky says I don't truly get why you are so upset with them.
Of course the proof is in the pudding and it remains to be seen if it works, but a system whereby the club is run on the basis of every team within playing with the same style and values is hardly a new concept qnd is generally considered a sensible plan.

Oh and I don't believe it was a case of Mansour or Mancini. But to hear the criticism of the higher management for their decision does surprise me, and there are people suggesting that they don't like what the club is becoming under the Sheikh's guidance.
I was also trying to illustrate the point that Mancini is no great loss, the really important part is having the resources. Success will continue, it's just a case of how much, and in what style it's achieved. And with that in mind I believe launching Mancini was absolutely the correct course of action.

[john68]

Much of what you say there is true Kinky, most City fans, even quite short term ones have long since got used to the revolving door of managers, some loved, some hated.

Now that Mancini has gone, the point is moot. The past is the past and the future is what matters. I think some like Piccs have possibly been too busy celebrating on their bouncy castles to understand that the real issue has now moved from Mancini.

I do wonder just how much Piccs actually understands or knows about the guy who now controls football at City or the system that is being embedded at our club and will define it for the foreseeable future.

What I know is that Sheikh Mansour still runs the show. If The Spafia get it wrong, they will get the boot too. I know that I like the decision they have made and the reasons they have given for it. As Kinky says I don't truly get why you are so upset with them.

FFS Piccs, How many times do I have to tell you that I am NOT, repeat NOT, NOT< NOT< NOT fucking upset with them. I have clearly stated this this about a dozen times yet you persist in this STUPID accusation. I have clearly stated in basic English that I AM NOT AGAINST THEM....so why do you persist in this stupid accusation?

Of course the proof is in the pudding and it remains to be seen if it works, but a system whereby the club is run on the basis of every team within playing with the same style and values is hardly a new concept qnd is generally considered a sensible plan.

I have never suggested otherwise.

Oh and I don't believe it was a case of Mansour or Mancini. But to hear the criticism of the higher management for their decision does surprise me, and there are people suggesting that they don't like what the club is becoming under the Sheikh's guidance.
I was also trying to illustrate the point that Mancini is no great loss, the really important part is having the resources. Success will continue, it's just a case of how much, and in what style it's achieved. And with that in mind I believe launching Mancini was absolutely the correct course of action.

I left the issue of Mancini's dismissal behind long time ago. Again I clearly stated that too...several times...but you failed to get it. Personally, I couldn't give two fucks about it. My only recent references about Mancini were to actually say that.

Now then...having got that out of the way,what's your point?

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

I left the issue of Mancini's dismissal behind long time ago. Again I clearly stated that too...several times...but you failed to get it. Personally, I couldn't give two fucks about it. My only recent references about Mancini were to actually say that.

Now then...having got that out of the way,what's your point?

To be honest, the last paragraph was in response to Mancio.

My point is that there is everything to look forward to and the first step towards fulfilling our true potential have been taken. I think thats it anyway.

[Ted Hughes]

It's all about opinion and it's not clear that Mancini will be missed. In fact, I'm missing him already.

Ahh how touching. Ha ha
Anyway answer me this yer Sunday dinner type person, who would rather do without? Mansour or Mancini?

You really are a pathetic sod if You truelllllly think that anyone, bar Ted on his most egomaniac overflowing, can buy this "It had to The Holy Sheikh or Mancini"...

Find the post where I have suggested 'it had to be the Sheikh or Mancini'.


I'm fucking sick of you telling people I think or say stuff I haven't said.

Find it.

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

Find the post where I have suggested this.

Quote it.

I wasn't suggesting that either.

[john68]

I left the issue of Mancini's dismissal behind long time ago. Again I clearly stated that too...several times...but you failed to get it. Personally, I couldn't give two fucks about it. My only recent references about Mancini were to actually say that.

Now then...having got that out of the way,what's your point?

To be honest, the last paragraph was in response to Mancio.

My point is that there is everything to look forward to and the first step towards fulfilling our true potential have been taken. I think thats it anyway.

Does this mean that you will now finally stop telling me I am saying what I haven't said?

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

Does this mean that you will now finally stop telling me I am saying what I haven't said?

To be honest John, I've lost track of what you're saying.

[john68]

Does this mean that you will now finally stop telling me I am saying what I haven't said?

To be honest John, I've lost track of what you're saying.

TBH Roger, you never actually ever got on track of what I was saying.

[Ted Hughes]

Does this mean that you will now finally stop telling me I am saying what I haven't said?

To be honest John, I've lost track of what you're saying.

TBH Roger, you never actually ever got on track of what I was saying.

;)

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

;)

You're not wrong John. I have failed to grasp your boggle. (ooh err)

[daveh1962]

I have watched the documentary about the election of Laporta to the presidency of Barcelona and it is clear these guys are smart operators http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQPnbML1WFY

What I think they are trying to introduce is akin to a production factory than a traditional football club. They are putting processes and structures in place which means less reliance on individual managers. Hence the holistic approach. From the age of 8 onwards city will try to play the same way albeit allowing some leeway but the basic outline will be in place. That means that no matter who the manager is the team will know how to play

Maybe Mancini wanted to do things his way only which doesn't fit in to this type of philosophy he didn't seem to me the type of person who would have taken being told what to do very well

I think the good thing from a fans point of view is that the emphasis is on the stability of the team structure and hence why I dont think Mourinho would be our manager.

[Cocacolajojo1]

I'm still not convinced by Barcelona's youth setup that's so heralded.

They had a good crop with Xavi, Iniesta and Messi but these guys are all geniuses, I'm doubtful that they'll be able to replicate anything like that in the foreseeable future. AND, Xavi was heavily critized for a long while by many barcelona fans and was deffo not that popular before he became the player he is today. With the wrong chain of events he might have been sold or something and then what?

Puyol, Valdes, Busquets, Pedro. Sure, good players (except Busquets who's a mediocrity in a fantabulous midfield). But put them in another team, what happens then? How many players wouldn't thrive playing alongside Iniesta and Xavi?

Fabregas, Pique: nurtured and tought elsewhere. Catalans sure, but not Barcelona's products.

So meh... Imo the big test comes in a few years. If they manage to replicate what they have now then, then I'll have to eat my own hat on this one. But I just don't see it.

As for Barcelonas financial growth during Soriano.... I'm not overly impressed by that either. Europe experienced a pretty lengthy time of economic prosperity, football even more so. WIth the expansion of European clubs into foreign tv-markets, aided and also coupled with the revenues from the champions league AND the skewed TV-deal which is currently strangeling the Spanish league qualitywise, they were there in the right place at the right time. If Soriano and Trixi had been there say in the late seventies, early eightes, and would have achieved the same thing, that would really have been an evidence of their skills.

See, skeptiscism. It's great.

[Beefymcfc]

It's all about opinion and it's not clear that Mancini will be missed. In fact, I'm missing him already.

Ahh how touching. Ha ha
Anyway answer me this yer Sunday dinner type person, who would rather do without? Mansour or Mancini?

What's it got to do with the Sheikhy? What I mention is that it has been suggested that nobody will miss Mancini and although we always move on as supporters, it doesn't mean that we should forget the past. We also don't know what the future holds and if the new man isn't getting the results we think he should then it'll put him in the same boat that you put Mancini in.

On your point though, we've been informed that the Sheikh himself sacked Mancini; why is that? I remember Cook not having the balls to sack Hughes, waiting for Khaldoon to do the business and it seems that due to their friendship, Khaldoon used the Sheikh to cover his arse a little, under the guidance of our new spanish members.

I have no problem with what any of them have done, not one of them, it was the manner in which it was executed that fucked me off. Destabilising our chances of winning the FA Cup was a real 'Typical City' moment for me.

[Ted Hughes]

I'm still not convinced by Barcelona's youth setup that's so heralded.

They had a good crop with Xavi, Iniesta and Messi but these guys are all geniuses, I'm doubtful that they'll be able to replicate anything like that in the foreseeable future. AND, Xavi was heavily critized for a long while by many barcelona fans and was deffo not that popular before he became the player he is today. With the wrong chain of events he might have been sold or something and then what?

Puyol, Valdes, Busquets, Pedro. Sure, good players (except Busquets who's a mediocrity in a fantabulous midfield). But put them in another team, what happens then? How many players wouldn't thrive playing alongside Iniesta and Xavi?

Fabregas, Pique: nurtured and tought elsewhere. Catalans sure, but not Barcelona's products.

So meh... Imo the big test comes in a few years. If they manage to replicate what they have now then, then I'll have to eat my own hat on this one. But I just don't see it.

As for Barcelonas financial growth during Soriano.... I'm not overly impressed by that either. Europe experienced a pretty lengthy time of economic prosperity, football even more so. WIth the expansion of European clubs into foreign tv-markets, aided and also coupled with the revenues from the champions league AND the skewed TV-deal which is currently strangeling the Spanish league qualitywise, they were there in the right place at the right time. If Soriano and Trixi had been there say in the late seventies, early eightes, and would have achieved the same thing, that would really have been an evidence of their skills.

See, skeptiscism. It's great.

That's actually an astonishing list, not something to criticise. And more are on the way.

Fabregas & Pique are absolutely Barca players btw. They just holidayed elsewhere for a while.

But you don't need 10 world class players every few years, you just need to have a decent number of players coming through so that you don't have to spend huge wedges of money filling holes. We should produce our own Milner, Barry, Lescott, Zabba etc with an occasional, Silva & Aguero as icing on the cake.

Look at how much money we have spent on squad players since Frank took over, simply because we haven't produced our own players good enough even to sit on the bench. Rodwell could turn out a top player, but we should be producing & selling as good or better than Sinclair, Garcia, ancient Maicon, Wright, Kolarov etc, then one or two top players come through every few years. 5 years of that, & you have a squad containing several top quality home grown players, a host of decent quality home grown squad players, one or two highly promising home grown youngsters, & all your big money goes on signing world class players, not the workhorses.

Are you saying that Thiago Alcantara or Christian Tello or Pedro Rodriguez wouldn't have got a few games for City or Utd this season btw ?

[carl_feedthegoat]

It's all about opinion and it's not clear that Mancini will be missed. In fact, I'm missing him already.

Ahh how touching. Ha ha
Anyway answer me this yer Sunday dinner type person, who would rather do without? Mansour or Mancini?

What's it got to do with the Sheikhy? What I mention is that it has been suggested that nobody will miss Mancini and although we always move on as supporters, it doesn't mean that we should forget the past. We also don't know what the future holds and if the new man isn't getting the results we think he should then it'll put him in the same boat that you put Mancini in.

On your point though, we've been informed that the Sheikh himself sacked Mancini; why is that? I remember Cook not having the balls to sack Hughes, waiting for Khaldoon to do the business and it seems that due to their friendship, Khaldoon used the Sheikh to cover his arse a little, under the guidance of our new spanish members.

I have no problem with what any of them have done, not one of them, it was the manner in which it was executed that fucked me off. Destabilising our chances of winning the FA Cup was a real 'Typical City' moment for me.

Laughable blaming the hierachy for that performance.

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

Much of what you say there is true Kinky, most City fans, even quite short term ones have long since got used to the revolving door of managers, some loved, some hated.

Now that Mancini has gone, the point is moot. The past is the past and the future is what matters. I think some like Piccs have possibly been too busy celebrating on their bouncy castles to understand that the real issue has now moved from Mancini.

I do wonder just how much Piccs actually understands or knows about the guy who now controls football at City or the system that is being embedded at our club and will define it for the foreseeable future.

That's the thing. Reading posts here, very few people actually understand the whole Director of Football system. Especially the one that we are implementing with La eMe. I mean, very few people understood that Marwood was de facto leader of incoming and outgoing transfers. We are taking that thing to whole new level with Spaniards.

Is the system good or bad. Well that will be debatable. However the problem will be, as it is everywhere where this system has been run, that SUPPORTERS will always blame manager. If we bring some turds in, Pellegrini will shoulder the blame. If we sell some fan favourite, Pellegrini will shoulder the blame. I'm sure he gets to make suggestions and have some part in the process but in the club he isn't IN CHARGE of player transfers.

In fact, very few people will gain the access to kind of knowledge that will tell what exactly will be Pellegrini's role and what will be the roles of Beguiristain and Soriano. There has been suggestions of the actually playing system being chosen by Spaniards. It sounds outrageous and I personally don't think that will happen however it IS within boundaries of reality. It was basically the case with Barcelona when these people were there.

Of course there's the other side of the coin. If things really work out, see Guardiola, Pep, manager will get credit for lot of things he wasn't actually in charge of to begin with.

[Ted Hughes]

It's all about opinion and it's not clear that Mancini will be missed. In fact, I'm missing him already.

Ahh how touching. Ha ha
Anyway answer me this yer Sunday dinner type person, who would rather do without? Mansour or Mancini?

What's it got to do with the Sheikhy? What I mention is that it has been suggested that nobody will miss Mancini and although we always move on as supporters, it doesn't mean that we should forget the past. We also don't know what the future holds and if the new man isn't getting the results we think he should then it'll put him in the same boat that you put Mancini in.

On your point though, we've been informed that the Sheikh himself sacked Mancini; why is that? I remember Cook not having the balls to sack Hughes, waiting for Khaldoon to do the business and it seems that due to their friendship, Khaldoon used the Sheikh to cover his arse a little, under the guidance of our new spanish members.

I have no problem with what any of them have done, not one of them, it was the manner in which it was executed that fucked me off. Destabilising our chances of winning the FA Cup was a real 'Typical City' moment for me.

Laughable blaming the hierachy for that performance.

True, but also Soriano clearly states why Mancini was sacked. Why are people blaming Sheikh Mansour for it ?

Of course he would have to agree, but most rich owners would have sacked Mancini halfway through the Champions Lg group stages, to see if someone else could bail us out. He has been patient and allowed his appointed people to evaluate the situation & make a decision.

I'm a long term City fan, so am against sacking managers, but if I had just bought the club myself and was not used to seeing the problems of managerial change, I would have fired Mancini after the Dortmund game; he was clearly out of his depth.

Sheikh Mansour has been superb.

[Swales4ever]

It's really interesting to me how some people seem to be having absolute breakdowns since Mancini has gone and Sorry and Tricky have come to the fore ... must be something in the water. I'm not complaining mind you, it's great entertainment.

"Miss" for Mancini isn't the right word. I'm extremely thankful for the time and titles that Mancini gave us. He'll never be forgotten, and he is a modern City legend as far as Managers go, that final emergence from the dark after so many years.

There are a lot of posters here who agree with "the new 2" that Mancini wasn't the person to take us beyond that emergence, into a sustained period of success ... I'm among them.

I won't miss Mancini, but I will always have a special place for him and for the title winning team, and the way we played. Great stuff and Mancini deserves great thanks for that effort ... which is what i believe the newspaper ad was about; a Thank you, not a we miss you. The stuff that went down this past season is certainly not something to miss.

[highlight]If we elevate the team further, bring back some beautiful play and win something next year ... Mancini won't be missed by even the most ardent tricky and sorry hater.[/highlight]

Fair enough and damn right.
You never find many Germans bemoaning at Adolf for human rights WHEN/IF Deutschland ist uber alles.

Accordingly, I can promise You that I will be leading the "Candy and Icecream Army" when City will be ruling the football world, by playing breathtaking sparkling football, while plenty of Lionel Messi will be blossoming throughout the City Academy.

So far what we have seen is just a cynical removal of the obstacle to Ferran Soriano take of power, very carefully designed at a MCFC's FA Cup expense.
An awkwardly designed statement of dismissal upon an alleged total failure, followed, with just dozen days delay, by the content of a professionally advised interview, summing up all the mantra shared by people who have constantly moaned at Mancini for failing to deliver instant domination while struggling with the constant undermining of a couple of members of the Club hierarchy, concerned about their future if professionalism would ahve definitely took place at the Club.

Many people on here have been taunted as "happy clappers" for their predicaments of patient through stability in success, as ever experienced in the last four decades at the Club.
You will now allow almost the same people to stand awaiting - moderately concerned by facts witnessed so far, in addition to the bloke previous trading pattern - before joining the jubilant believer in the promise of the brightest future of astonishing domination.
when the such will come true, EVERY City fan will be clapping and devotely love the Bloke and His Right Arm.

[Mansour21]

Barcelona was never the team they are today, they were a good team with good history in spanish football. Actually their last trophy was in 1998-1999 with one champions league trophy won in 1992, before they appointed Soriano as vp in 2003, and guess what happened after that:

La Liga: 04-05, 05-06, 08-09 UCL: 05-06, 08-09

Not Xavi not Iniesta not Messi not Guardiola who made the big change for Barcelona, it was the management, Frank Rijkaard and the legend Ronaldinho.

So give them a chance to prove what they can do.

[Ted Hughes]

Much of what you say there is true Kinky, most City fans, even quite short term ones have long since got used to the revolving door of managers, some loved, some hated.

Now that Mancini has gone, the point is moot. The past is the past and the future is what matters. I think some like Piccs have possibly been too busy celebrating on their bouncy castles to understand that the real issue has now moved from Mancini.

I do wonder just how much Piccs actually understands or knows about the guy who now controls football at City or the system that is being embedded at our club and will define it for the foreseeable future.

That's the thing. Reading posts here, very few people actually understand the whole Director of Football system. Especially the one that we are implementing with La eMe. I mean, very few people understood that Marwood was de facto leader of incoming and outgoing transfers. We are taking that thing to whole new level with Spaniards.

Is the system good or bad. Well that will be debatable. However the problem will be, as it is everywhere where this system has been run, that SUPPORTERS will always blame manager. If we bring some turds in, Pellegrini will shoulder the blame. If we sell some fan favourite, Pellegrini will shoulder the blame. I'm sure he gets to make suggestions and have some part in the process but in the club he isn't IN CHARGE of player transfers.

In fact, very few people will gain the access to kind of knowledge that will tell what exactly will be Pellegrini's role and what will be the roles of Beguiristain and Soriano. There has been suggestions of the actually playing system being chosen by Spaniards. It sounds outrageous and I personally don't think that will happen however it IS within boundaries of reality. It was basically the case with Barcelona when these people were there.

Of course there's the other side of the coin. If things really work out, see Guardiola, Pep, manager will get credit for lot of things he wasn't actually in charge of to begin with.

Marwood wasn't the person who decided on transfers, Mancini was. He has made it clear time & again & Soriano has also made it clear that Mancini asked for & got all of those players last season. He also made clear that the ones we missed were down to factors such as budget etc.

The manager is supposed to meet with the directors & discuss signings. According to one 'insider' Mancini refused to take full part in such meetings. If true, that won't have made the job any easier.

As for supporters blaming the manager, how many on here are blaming the Spaniards for losing the cup final just by not talking to the press!!??

If the fans take to the manager, they will blame Soriano etc for things that go wrong. If they don't like the manager, they will blame him.