Kolarov

[Socrates]

the reason Silva is called Merlin is because he sees options that other players dont, he views things from a different perspective, I dont want Silva to take the safe option each time, I want him to continue to conjure and create. Where as Kolarov should keep it simple, he is limited in his ability in comparison to Silva.

Continue to defend Kolarov all you want BRF it just makes you look as stupid as he plays

SIlva hasn't done that for about 18 months now. And has mostly been shite. Yet he never ever gets criticised on here. There's a difference between trying to create and trying a ball which will never come off. Silva does the latter far more often. He tries threading a ball through and you know before he plays it that it won't come off. I don't view this as being 'creative', it's fucking stupid at times.

I'm not defending Kolarov, I don't rate him. I've not said I do. I said he's 'decent' option for a home game when we're gonna be on the attack the whole game.
I even said I wouldn't play him against a good side.
He did fuck all wrong against Hull and had it not been for his last ditch tackle we may well have not got all 3 points.
And again, you've said he got skimmed and gave the ball away. Can I have the facts to prove this please? How many times was he skimmed, how many times did he give the ball away?
Zabaleta was far, far worse against Cardiff.

I don't know why I bother with you. That's such fucking crap again. Silva is our creative force. It would be completely pointless discussion if someone started slagging Silva, we don't have anyone who does anything remotely similar to him.

You are consistently so lost on very basic football systems and how players should operate in them but I hope you at very least realise that Silva has never been asked to take the easy option in passing. Considering his amazing passing skills he could go all game without missing a pass. But obviously they are asking him to be adventurous which he is CONSISTENTLY IN EVERY SINGLE GAME. He has by far the most time on the ball in our attacking third and is our playmaker.

I know you love numbers. Did you know that Silva actually had MORE assists last season than in his debut season. And you consistently claim that he is "living off his debut season".

Our main problem is that we don't have anyone to take the creative pressure off him. Most teams are basically man marking him at all times. When some team tries to be daring and don't sacrifice someone to tail him at all times he always runs a riot.

Spot on, creative players are also dependent on those around them reading what they are likely to try to do and this has been something of a problem lately. Aguero's loss of form, in particular, has had an impact on Silva's results.

[Nige]

Fact- the amazing last ditch tackle was on a player running through the channel 13 is meant to protect. Had he been goal side and switched on he could have faced up to the ball easily without needing to almost give a penalty away.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

the reason Silva is called Merlin is because he sees options that other players dont, he views things from a different perspective, I dont want Silva to take the safe option each time, I want him to continue to conjure and create. Where as Kolarov should keep it simple, he is limited in his ability in comparison to Silva.

Continue to defend Kolarov all you want BRF it just makes you look as stupid as he plays

SIlva hasn't done that for about 18 months now. And has mostly been shite. Yet he never ever gets criticised on here. There's a difference between trying to create and trying a ball which will never come off. Silva does the latter far more often. He tries threading a ball through and you know before he plays it that it won't come off. I don't view this as being 'creative', it's fucking stupid at times.

I'm not defending Kolarov, I don't rate him. I've not said I do. I said he's 'decent' option for a home game when we're gonna be on the attack the whole game.
I even said I wouldn't play him against a good side.
He did fuck all wrong against Hull and had it not been for his last ditch tackle we may well have not got all 3 points.
And again, you've said he got skimmed and gave the ball away. Can I have the facts to prove this please? How many times was he skimmed, how many times did he give the ball away?
Zabaleta was far, far worse against Cardiff.

I don't know why I bother with you. That's such fucking crap again. Silva is our creative force. It would be completely pointless discussion if someone started slagging Silva, we don't have anyone who does anything remotely similar to him.

You are consistently so lost on very basic football systems and how players should operate in them but I hope you at very least realise that Silva has never been asked to take the easy option in passing. Considering his amazing passing skills he could go all game without missing a pass. But obviously they are asking him to be adventurous which he is CONSISTENTLY IN EVERY SINGLE GAME. He has by far the most time on the ball in our attacking third and is our playmaker.

I know you love numbers. Did you know that Silva actually had MORE assists last season than in his debut season. And you consistently claim that he is "living off his debut season".

Our main problem is that we don't have anyone to take the creative pressure off him. Most teams are basically man marking him at all times. When some team tries to be daring and don't sacrifice someone to tail him at all times he always runs a riot.

Firstly I didn't say 'living off his debut season'. More so the second half of his debut season and first half of our title winning one. Where without doubt he was one of the very best in the world. And I'll maintain last season he got absolutely nowhere near that form.

And yes sometimes i'd like to see him take the 'easy' pass rather than trying something ridiculous which won't come off and give the ball away. Yes he needs to be adventurous and creative, but there's a limit to that and he just isn't making his passes as well as he used to. Also, so many times in a game , about 20 yards out space opens up for the shot and you're screaming for him to shoot and he instead tries to thread a ball through which most of the time doesn't come off because the intended target is being marked by 3 defenders.
And he does have the ability to shoot, for us he has a 1 in 7/8 scoring record, for Spain it's better than 1 in 4.
When was the last time that Silva looked truly world class? Where he absolutely dominated a game like he did in the 6-1? It's been a long time since he's been that good. Yes he has spells and moments where he reminds us of what a great player he is but he just doesn't do it consistently enough and opponents are increasingly starting to mark him out of games.

But some players like him are immune to criticism when they fuck up yet others get absolutely hounded.
I'll argue Kolarov had as good a game as Silva at the weekend yet he gets a thread criticising him.

[Wonderwall]

Well miscontrolling the ball, giving it away with silly passes means you think he is decent, then I am lost for words

Well you must think both Silva and Aguero are shit too though because both of them miscontrolled the ball more and gave away more silly passes than Kolarov in that game.
Oh wait those two are immune from criticism. My bad.[/quote]

Silva had a 78% pass success rate against Hull
Kolarov had a 70% pass success rate against Hull giving the ball away almost a 1 in 3 passes!

Gael Clichy had a 91% successful pass rate in the previous two games

I'm not defending Kolarov, I don't rate him. I've not said I do. I said he's 'decent' option for a home game when we're gonna be on the attack the whole game.
I even said I wouldn't play him against a good side.
He did fuck all wrong against Hull and had it not been for his last ditch tackle we may well have not got all 3 points.
And again, you've said he got skimmed and gave the ball away. Can I have the facts to prove this please? How many times was he skimmed, how many times did he give the ball away?
Zabaleta was far, far worse against Cardiff.

Zabba had a 75% success rate v Hull but his season overall is 86% for the 3 games so far, so that leads me to believe that Cardiff was significantly better.

You asked for FACTS

[Bridge'srightfoot]

Well miscontrolling the ball, giving it away with silly passes means you think he is decent, then I am lost for words

Well you must think both Silva and Aguero are shit too though because both of them miscontrolled the ball more and gave away more silly passes than Kolarov in that game.
Oh wait those two are immune from criticism. My bad.

Silva had a 78% pass success rate against Hull
Kolarov had a 70% pass success rate against Hull giving the ball away almost a 1 in 3 passes!

Gael Clichy had a 91% successful pass rate in the previous two games

I'm not defending Kolarov, I don't rate him. I've not said I do. I said he's 'decent' option for a home game when we're gonna be on the attack the whole game.
I even said I wouldn't play him against a good side.
He did fuck all wrong against Hull and had it not been for his last ditch tackle we may well have not got all 3 points.
And again, you've said he got skimmed and gave the ball away. Can I have the facts to prove this please? How many times was he skimmed, how many times did he give the ball away?
Zabaleta was far, far worse against Cardiff.

Zabba had a 75% success rate v Hull but his season overall is 86% for the 3 games so far, so that leads me to believe that Cardiff was significantly better.

You asked for FACTS[/quote]
I thought you had wasted too much energy on me...
Or Zabaleta had a bad game...? Oh wait he's another immune from criticism.
This whole fuckign debate is stupid because it comes off me criticising Kolarov saying he isn't good enough to play against decent teams because he's shite defensively.

But against shite teams at home when we're going to be on the attack the whole game he is a decent option to give Clichy a rest. Yes he's shite defensively but he's half decent going forward and poses more of an attacking threat.

I watched the whole Hull game and to me he didn't do anything that bad. He didn't cost us any goals, he didn't have any major fuck ups. There have been games in the past where he's been utter shite and cost us points, fair enough and he's been rightly slated but I really didn't feel he was the worst player on the pitch against Hull. Aguero had far worse a game.

[Wonderwall]

I have had a sleep so have renewed energy!!!

You say Aguero had a worse game, he had a 95% pass completion rate an 100% shot accuracy on target! These are all the FACTS you keep asking for!

However, FACTS can mean nothing in the grand scheme of things and can just be used to back up an argument with SPIN.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I have had a sleep so have renewed energy!!!

You say Aguero had a worse game, he had a 95% pass completion rate an 100% shot accuracy on target! These are all the FACTS you keep asking for!

However, FACTS can mean nothing in the grand scheme of things and can just be used to back up an argument with SPIN.

That's what they mostly are used for as you say.
I did think Aguero had a poor game too as he did against Cardiff. He's a world class player though so even when he has bad game he'll produce one or two moments of quality but he hasn't been performing close to what he's capable of.

There does seem to be a group of players who have guaranteed places and these are , Aguero, Silva, Toure, Kompany, Hart.
I don't think that's always healthy as they know they can get away with playing poorly and still get picked week in week out. That imo explains the dip in form of Aguero, Silva and Hart.

[Wonderwall]

I have had a sleep so have renewed energy!!!

You say Aguero had a worse game, he had a 95% pass completion rate an 100% shot accuracy on target! These are all the FACTS you keep asking for!

However, FACTS can mean nothing in the grand scheme of things and can just be used to back up an argument with SPIN.

That's what they mostly are used for as you say.
I did think Aguero had a poor game too as he did against Cardiff. He's a world class player though so even when he has bad game he'll produce one or two moments of quality but he hasn't been performing close to what he's capable of.

There does seem to be a group of players who have guaranteed places and these are , Aguero, Silva, Toure, Kompany, Hart.
I don't think that's always healthy as they know they can get away with playing poorly and still get picked week in week out. That imo explains the dip in form of Aguero, Silva and Hart.

We are there!!!!!!! I agree!

[Niall Quinns Discopants]

I have had a sleep so have renewed energy!!!

You say Aguero had a worse game, he had a 95% pass completion rate an 100% shot accuracy on target! These are all the FACTS you keep asking for!

However, FACTS can mean nothing in the grand scheme of things and can just be used to back up an argument with SPIN.

That's what they mostly are used for as you say.
I did think Aguero had a poor game too as he did against Cardiff. He's a world class player though so even when he has bad game he'll produce one or two moments of quality but he hasn't been performing close to what he's capable of.

There does seem to be a group of players who have guaranteed places and these are , Aguero, Silva, Toure, Kompany, Hart.
I don't think that's always healthy as they know they can get away with playing poorly and still get picked week in week out. That imo explains the dip in form of Aguero, Silva and Hart.

Yeah, well you need to have better fucking options then, don't you? Replacing that group with Guidetti, Nasri, Garcia, Demichelis, Pantilimon isn't going to exactly improve us, now is it? Wait, don't answer.

[Bridge'srightfoot]

I have had a sleep so have renewed energy!!!

You say Aguero had a worse game, he had a 95% pass completion rate an 100% shot accuracy on target! These are all the FACTS you keep asking for!

However, FACTS can mean nothing in the grand scheme of things and can just be used to back up an argument with SPIN.

That's what they mostly are used for as you say.
I did think Aguero had a poor game too as he did against Cardiff. He's a world class player though so even when he has bad game he'll produce one or two moments of quality but he hasn't been performing close to what he's capable of.

There does seem to be a group of players who have guaranteed places and these are , Aguero, Silva, Toure, Kompany, Hart.
I don't think that's always healthy as they know they can get away with playing poorly and still get picked week in week out. That imo explains the dip in form of Aguero, Silva and Hart.

Yeah, well you need to have better fucking options then, don't you? Replacing that group with Guidetti, Nasri, Garcia, Demichelis, Pantilimon isn't going to exactly improve us, now is it? Wait, don't answer.

We do have options.

[london blue 2]

When players almost get past Kolarov does that mean he gets semi-skimmed?

[Burt]

When players almost get past Kolarov does that mean he gets semi-skimmed?

I'm like this so much that I nearly creamed:o)

[Ted Hughes]

Wheras 'shite of 18 months' is over the top, Silva hasn't been playing at anywhere near his best for a long time & does pick the wrong option in key situations on numerous occasions. He also 'sees' Aguero sometimes but misses better runs by others & has already this season missed the opportunity to set up several playersfor tap ins by basically not noticing their position.

At his best, he would pick them out with his eyes shut.

Kolarov was absent from his position & failed to do his job for much of the Hull game, causing nightmares for the cbs. This is normal.

[kinkylola]

seems like for the type of game we want to be playing ... we will be in for a player like baines in winter or next summer. We cannot let the rags get him and he would suit us to a t.

I think the problem for kolarov is that he is not suited for the prem as a fb, and he is also not suited to our style of play as a fb. That's a double whammy for him. I don't think he is a bad player, and I like his toughness and his rocket left foot. He would be (was) quite solid in italy, or even spain ... but I think the nature of the prem isn't a great mesh with him.

Some fans are going to have real animosity towards him because of the incident that happened previously. To be perfectly honest, I think that should be let go, and I can only imagine how some of the personalities on here would react to people in the stands slagging him off. Wrong choices from both sides on that one.

He simply isn't good enough, but there is no malice in it and I hope he can move on and be successful ... soonish.

[Im_Spartacus]

IT isn't fucking okay. It's not okay if he tries stupid passes which very rarely come off and gives the ball away.Why can Silva play shit and get away with it? How many times did someone get past Kolarov on Saturday? And how many times did he give it away?

I'm with you 100% on this.

Silva and Aguero have largely been poor, or at best way below their excellent best over the last 12 maybe 18 months.

But they do have the tools to do the job when it's needed, whereas kolarov is just basically a poor player (or perhaps not really suited to what we need, which is a fullback who can attack and defend).

This place makes me mad with the endless tossing off of Silva and Aguero regardless of how many really poor performances they put in, but we know that if we play our cards right these will come good again, whereas kolarov never was, and never will be the standard of player we require.

[Original Dub]

As far as I know Silva in the last year and a half has provided the 7th most assists in world football, while being a regular in the Spain side that won the world cup.

And I think he scored in that world cup final?

He has spells where his passing is off, but players of his ilk are normally either on fire or anonymous.

At least he is constantly on the ball. Never anonymous.

[Pretty Boy Lee]

As far as I know Silva in the last year and a half has provided the 7th most assists in world football, while being a regular in the Spain side that won the world cup.

And I think he scored in that world cup final?

He has spells where his passing is off, but players of his ilk are normally either on fire or anonymous.

At least he is constantly on the ball. Never anonymous.

I'm with you, to me the only change is the attention he gets means he can't dribble much these days.

A lot of us fondly remember the goal at Blackpool or the one he set up v Everton both off slick feet, but he doesn't get that space anymore and plays the ball a lot earlier. He still gets assists and does more running than most players of similar style. The amount of times he provides a passing option each match is really something special.

[Mase]

Kolarov is better than Silva. FACT!

[Bridge'srightfoot]

As far as I know Silva in the last year and a half has provided the 7th most assists in world football, while being a regular in the Spain side that won the world cup.

And I think he scored in that world cup final?

He has spells where his passing is off, but players of his ilk are normally either on fire or anonymous.

At least he is constantly on the ball. Never anonymous.

I'm with you, to me the only change is the attention he gets means he can't dribble much these days.

A lot of us fondly remember the goal at Blackpool or the one he set up v Everton both off slick feet, but he doesn't get that space anymore and plays the ball a lot earlier. He still gets assists and does more running than most players of similar style. The amount of times he provides a passing option each match is really something special.

But he's not playing as well as he was though. In the first half of our title winning season he was on another planet. In games like the 6-1, the 5-1 V spurs, the 3-2 v Bolton, the Everton and Wigan home games amongst others. He was absolutely unplayable and he was dominating games. I don't think he's been close to that recently.
I'll admit 'shite' was an overstatement. It's just that we know he's capable of much more.

But if he's not getting the same space then it's upto him to make that space and find another level. I remember one particular dribble in the 6-1 when he took the ball on the edge of their area and about 5 of them stormed in trying to get the ball off him and he just kept it. Look at Messi, opponents are on him like a rash at times and he finds a way through.

His main problem is decision making now adays as Ted said.
One thing I don't get is his scoring record for Spain is superb, better than 1 in 4 but for us it's closer to 1in 8. If he can do it for Spain he can reach that level for us.

[Original Dub]

As far as I know Silva in the last year and a half has provided the 7th most assists in world football, while being a regular in the Spain side that won the world cup.

And I think he scored in that world cup final?

He has spells where his passing is off, but players of his ilk are normally either on fire or anonymous.

At least he is constantly on the ball. Never anonymous.

I'm with you, to me the only change is the attention he gets means he can't dribble much these days.

A lot of us fondly remember the goal at Blackpool or the one he set up v Everton both off slick feet, but he doesn't get that space anymore and plays the ball a lot earlier. He still gets assists and does more running than most players of similar style. The amount of times he provides a passing option each match is really something special.

But he's not playing as well as he was though. In the first half of our title winning season he was on another planet. In games like the 6-1, the 5-1 V spurs, the 3-2 v Bolton, the Everton and Wigan home games amongst others. He was absolutely unplayable and he was dominating games. I don't think he's been close to that recently.
I'll admit 'shite' was an overstatement. It's just that we know he's capable of much more.

But if he's not getting the same space then it's upto him to make that space and find another level. I remember one particular dribble in the 6-1 when he took the ball on the edge of their area and about 5 of them stormed in trying to get the ball off him and he just kept it. Look at Messi, opponents are on him like a rash at times and he finds a way through.

His main problem is decision making now adays as Ted said.
One thing I don't get is his scoring record for Spain is superb, better than 1 in 4 but for us it's closer to 1in 8. If he can do it for Spain he can reach that level for us.

Messi does indeed find a way out.