Central Defence

[Im_Spartacus]

Sorry, posted this in the VK thread but probably more appropriate here.........................................

Is it time to admit that the desire for a footballing centre half is a failed experiment and that Vince was a one off? If we are having full backs steaming forwards, we need at least two players in the team who can fucking defend without making it look like the Benny Hill show! Our record of conceding 2 at home in the last 5 champions league home games is nothing short of a disgrace

We've been through half a dozen replacements for Lescott now, and none have been a match for steady, reliable defending that a DEFENDER brings to the party. It seems the guys we've signed since Joleen left are all kinda failed/not-quite midfielders, and lack the basic composure and positioning sense to do the basic job at hand, stopping cunts scoring.

I really feel we would be better sticking with Kompany, Otamendi and Mangala, but bringing in at least one reliable centre back in the mould of a Gary Cahill in place of Demichelis when he finishes, nothing spectacular but does a steady job week in week out.

[Hazy2]

Sorry, posted this in the VK thread but probably more appropriate here.........................................

Is it time to admit that the desire for a footballing centre half is a failed experiment and that Vince was a one off? If we are having full backs steaming forwards, we need at least two players in the team who can fucking defend without making it look like the Benny Hill show! Our record of conceding 2 at home in the last 5 champions league home games is nothing short of a disgrace

We've been through half a dozen replacements for Lescott now, and none have been a match for steady, reliable defending that a DEFENDER brings to the party. It seems the guys we've signed since Joleen left are all kinda failed/not-quite midfielders, and lack the basic composure and positioning sense to do the basic job at hand, stopping cunts scoring.

I really feel we would be better sticking with Kompany, Otamendi and Mangala, but bringing in at least one reliable centre back in the mould of a Gary Cahill in place of Demichelis when he finishes, nothing spectacular but does a steady job week in week out.

We have that many changes at the back through injury, rotation, I mean on that we are tired I get the 15 or so used week in week out are, but that points more to the fact Pellers plays one way with different fullbacks. All of which are the 30 ish age, what I noticed on Saturday was when they subbed Briton and pushed Ki on with a number 10 role, we were hanging on, City have to respect the space just over the half way line that the Likes of Ozil work from behind your MF , Monday night and we do not do that we will get punished.I also do not see one defensive minded MF player who is good enough or allowed to do it properly without being out numbered. All centre halfs need to warriors and Shawcross id good at the nitty gritty, forget his pace he is as quick as any of ours in mind and body, Juve have always had readers at the back, Barca the same. The set up allows it ours is a design fault, which has them exposed in every game for the past 3 months. Gonna come home to roost big time.

[iwasthere2012]

Sorry, posted this in the VK thread but probably more appropriate here.........................................

Is it time to admit that the desire for a footballing centre half is a failed experiment and that Vince was a one off? If we are having full backs steaming forwards, we need at least two players in the team who can fucking defend without making it look like the Benny Hill show! Our record of conceding 2 at home in the last 5 champions league home games is nothing short of a disgrace

We've been through half a dozen replacements for Lescott now, and none have been a match for steady, reliable defending that a DEFENDER brings to the party. It seems the guys we've signed since Joleen left are all kinda failed/not-quite midfielders, and lack the basic composure and positioning sense to do the basic job at hand, stopping cunts scoring.

I really feel we would be better sticking with Kompany, Otamendi and Mangala, but bringing in at least one reliable centre back in the mould of a Gary Cahill in place of Demichelis when he finishes, nothing spectacular but does a steady job week in week out.

We have that many changes at the back through injury, rotation, I mean on that we are tired I get the 15 or so used week in week out are, but that points more to the fact Pellers plays one way with different fullbacks. All of which are the 30 ish age, what I noticed on Saturday was when they subbed Briton and pushed Ki on with a number 10 role, we were hanging on, City have to respect the space just over the half way line that the Likes of Ozil work from behind your MF , Monday night and we do not do that we will get punished.I also do not see one defensive minded MF player who is good enough or allowed to do it properly without being out numbered. All centre halfs need to warriors and Shawcross id good at the nitty gritty, forget his pace he is as quick as any of ours in mind and body, Juve have always had readers at the back, Barca the same. The set up allows it ours is a design fault, which has them exposed in every game for the past 3 months. Gonna come home to roost big time.

I agree about the design fault and having been saying similar for a while. We don't have players that can comfortably play the game they are being asked to play and that includes midfield and our fullbacks being too old or slow to recover.
I don't know what the answer is, as I sometimes find it hard to see what Pellegrini is asking them to do.
One thing for sure though. When we get a full team effort with everyone knowing and doing their jobs, it does work. We just don't see that as often as we would like.

[Hazy2]

Sorry, posted this in the VK thread but probably more appropriate here.........................................

Is it time to admit that the desire for a footballing centre half is a failed experiment and that Vince was a one off? If we are having full backs steaming forwards, we need at least two players in the team who can fucking defend without making it look like the Benny Hill show! Our record of conceding 2 at home in the last 5 champions league home games is nothing short of a disgrace

We've been through half a dozen replacements for Lescott now, and none have been a match for steady, reliable defending that a DEFENDER brings to the party. It seems the guys we've signed since Joleen left are all kinda failed/not-quite midfielders, and lack the basic composure and positioning sense to do the basic job at hand, stopping cunts scoring.

I really feel we would be better sticking with Kompany, Otamendi and Mangala, but bringing in at least one reliable centre back in the mould of a Gary Cahill in place of Demichelis when he finishes, nothing spectacular but does a steady job week in week out.

We have that many changes at the back through injury, rotation, I mean on that we are tired I get the 15 or so used week in week out are, but that points more to the fact Pellers plays one way with different fullbacks. All of which are the 30 ish age, what I noticed on Saturday was when they subbed Briton and pushed Ki on with a number 10 role, we were hanging on, City have to respect the space just over the half way line that the Likes of Ozil work from behind your MF , Monday night and we do not do that we will get punished.I also do not see one defensive minded MF player who is good enough or allowed to do it properly without being out numbered. All centre halfs need to warriors and Shawcross id good at the nitty gritty, forget his pace he is as quick as any of ours in mind and body, Juve have always had readers at the back, Barca the same. The set up allows it ours is a design fault, which has them exposed in every game for the past 3 months. Gonna come home to roost big time.

I agree about the design fault and having been saying similar for a while. We don't have players that can comfortably play the game they are being asked to play and that includes midfield and our fullbacks being too old or slow to recover.
I don't know what the answer is, as I sometimes find it hard to see what Pellegrini is asking them to do.
One thing for sure though. When we get a full team effort with everyone knowing and doing their jobs, it does work. We just don't see that as often as we would like.

The idea teams will get after us on such a regular basis with so much success, must have players thinking, what is the plan now, I see us carrying 10 squad players and the rest will get flogged. Planning for games must be with an eye on the opos danger players we seem to think no worries we will adapt during, which like at Stoke and the dippers had us all over the shop. lucky to have not shipped double figures v the scousers

[john@staustell]

What will we do after this season?

MDM is obviously off, but from what I hear Denayer is not exactly tearing it up in Turkey.

Hush your mouth. Heretic. Blasphemer!

Dont you know he is from the academy and must therefore be ten times better than Mangala and Otamendi, because the club staff have never seen him in training and know fuck all compared to keyboard warriors?

[phips]

was the Mangala that started the season and became "undroppable" just a flash in the pan? was it because Vincent was next to him?

[Sister of fu]

Another lumbering centre back who will not improve the defence at all.

Didn't do much lumbering around when we played them last week. I don't think Stoke have conceded while he's been on the pitch this season. He's no nonence and knows the prem inside and out. Defo a better option that MDM or Mangala IMO.

[john@staustell]

was the Mangala that started the season and became "undroppable" just a flash in the pan? was it because Vincent was next to him?

The only thing that works now is Kompany and Otamendi. Everything else is all to shit. Lets hope he can stay fit for once.

Why bother another 30M + International CB which wont work out either?

[Foreverinbluedreams]

Another lumbering centre back who will not improve the defence at all.

Didn't do much lumbering around when we played them last week. I don't think Stoke have conceded while he's been on the pitch this season. He's no nonence and knows the prem inside and out. Defo a better option that MDM or Mangala IMO.

You think he could cope playing in our high line? I wouldn't be so sure.

[carl_feedthegoat]

What will we do after this season?

MDM is obviously off, but from what I hear Denayer is not exactly tearing it up in Turkey.

He cannot be doing that badly seeing as the club are allegedly going to offer him double his salary.

Denayer has enjoyed his time in Turkey but has also told members of his circle that he is ready to make the step up with the Citizens, despite Galatasaray already indicating to his representatives that they are willing to double his present £25,000 a week pay packet. - See more at: https://www.clubcall.com/manchester-cit ... khatu.dpuf

Read more at: https://www.clubcall.com/manchester-cit ... 92145.html?

[Foreverinbluedreams]

was the Mangala that started the season and became "undroppable" just a flash in the pan? was it because Vincent was next to him?

The only thing that works now is Kompany and Otamendi. Everything else is all to shit. Lets hope he can stay fit for once.

Why bother another 30M + International CB which wont work out either?

Don't think that's fair John, Vinnie and Mangala have performed well together this season, conceding just 1 ( the 2nd against Juve came when Vinnie went off injured ) in the 6 games they've played together.

[Tokyo Blue]

What will we do after this season?

MDM is obviously off, but from what I hear Denayer is not exactly tearing it up in Turkey.

Hush your mouth. Heretic. Blasphemer!

Dont you know he is from the academy and must therefore be ten times better than Mangala and Otamendi, because the club staff have never seen him in training and know fuck all compared to keyboard warriors?

Equally, it would be wrong to write him off without giving him a chance.

[Nick]

Sorry, posted this in the VK thread but probably more appropriate here.........................................

Is it time to admit that the desire for a footballing centre half is a failed experiment and that Vince was a one off? If we are having full backs steaming forwards, we need at least two players in the team who can fucking defend without making it look like the Benny Hill show! Our record of conceding 2 at home in the last 5 champions league home games is nothing short of a disgrace

We've been through half a dozen replacements for Lescott now, and none have been a match for steady, reliable defending that a DEFENDER brings to the party. It seems the guys we've signed since Joleen left are all kinda failed/not-quite midfielders, and lack the basic composure and positioning sense to do the basic job at hand, stopping cunts scoring.

I really feel we would be better sticking with Kompany, Otamendi and Mangala, but bringing in at least one reliable centre back in the mould of a Gary Cahill in place of Demichelis when he finishes, nothing spectacular but does a steady job week in week out.

Bang on the money and was just about to post this.

We have 3 'rash' 'ball playing' CB's who have the desire to 'rush out' (people seem to be forgetting this is Vinnie's downfall. Vinnie was average last year and Ota and Mangla were great together until Mangala was dropped for the Derby.

We need a Lescott 'type' rather than having 3 CB's who all have similar traits. I think we need to look at the system and do more training ground work, as the lads we have should do the job. Might be a good shout that Ota will grow his leadership when he's bed in, as that is Vinnie's main quality.

[iwasthere2012]

What will we do after this season?

MDM is obviously off, but from what I hear Denayer is not exactly tearing it up in Turkey.

Hush your mouth. Heretic. Blasphemer!

Dont you know he is from the academy and must therefore be ten times better than Mangala and Otamendi, because the club staff have never seen him in training and know fuck all compared to keyboard warriors?

This is where I miss the regular discussions that used to take place on the EDS/Academy players. Doug, WW, Twosips ansd Neville Kneville (Sorry, I meant Ted), used to post regularly about what they saw and give us a good insight into whether they believed we had anything coming through that actually might make it. I watched what I could online but you only get a taste of what these players are like.
Players like Barker, who seems to be having a bad time of it at Rotherham and Fofana who is playing well abroad I believe. I like hearing how these players are progressing in the hope that we may see some youth injected into the team next year.
Sorry, I'm not trying to hijack the thread, as I think it is relevant to the point made by John, but these regular posters seem to have gone to Bluemoon as there is still plenty of discussion there about the academy and other good prospects in it that are shining at lower age groups.

Getting back on thread, I always liked the look of Denayer and hope there is a place for him at the club, whether it be CB, Right Back or Defensive Midfielder. I would also love to know what the future is likely to hold for Maffeo and Angelino who is back training with us. Can they step up?

[zuricity]

Sorry, posted this in the VK thread but probably more appropriate here.........................................

Is it time to admit that the desire for a footballing centre half is a failed experiment and that Vince was a one off? If we are having full backs steaming forwards, we need at least two players in the team who can fucking defend without making it look like the Benny Hill show! Our record of conceding 2 at home in the last 5 champions league home games is nothing short of a disgrace

We've been through half a dozen replacements for Lescott now, and none have been a match for steady, reliable defending that a DEFENDER brings to the party. It seems the guys we've signed since Joleen left are all kinda failed/not-quite midfielders, and lack the basic composure and positioning sense to do the basic job at hand, stopping cunts scoring.

I really feel we would be better sticking with Kompany, Otamendi and Mangala, but bringing in at least one reliable centre back in the mould of a Gary Cahill in place of Demichelis when he finishes, nothing spectacular but does a steady job week in week out.

Sort of loses all sense of normality when Cahill is used as an example for defending.

[Ray78]

Another lumbering centre back who will not improve the defence at all.

Didn't do much lumbering around when we played them last week. I don't think Stoke have conceded while he's been on the pitch this season. He's no nonence and knows the prem inside and out. Defo a better option that MDM or Mangala IMO.

A mid table defender at best. Part of our problems is we are missing our leader and best defender and signing another one will not solve our problems at all. We are better working with what we got and see how Denayer has developed and take it from there.

[Douglas Higginbottom]

In the current academy we have 2 very promising center backs in Tosin Adarabyio and Cameron Humphreys Grant. Promising but not ready yet. Cameron played in the pre season tour and is still only 17 and developing well.Tosin I have very high hopes for but is just too raw to thrown in just yet.

Bear in ming that Denayer is well ahead of both of them yet we decided to ship him out on loan and you can see there is no chance of one of the other two being thrown in.

The best defender in the EDS imo is Pablo Maffeo ( very good again in tonight's EDS game and playing at center half) and I think he played his first senior game when he was 15 in the Spanish 2nd division. Is he ready or good enough? Well I would have him in before MDM at center back the way he has been playing and I do feel he wouldn't let us down playing full back.

[Tokyo Blue]

Which do you think is his best position, Doug?

[Wonderwall]

For me maffeo is a RB. He has a fantastic energy and an engine that would give opposition wide men and full backs a good work out. He is first and foremost a very good defender that can get forward. I agree with Doug that he is ready, I actually thought he was ready last season.

[sheblue]

^^ Good.