Red Rom to sabotage for City

[mcfc1632]

The balance of power firmly lies with the ex G14 cartel. They have the financial clout and own the product. Platini and UeFA may be the ruling body but they fall over if the cartel simply say they are withdrawing and going it alone. As happened when the Premier League was set up, the FA and FL laid down and capitulated. The real threat comes from the cartel.

No matter what UeFA say, if the cartel want to go it alone, they will do so. It looks as though it will be by invitation only and the way things seem to stacking up, City may not be invited to the party. If that happens, we will be pretty powerless, despite our money and I don't expect any help from the media.

I don't think any of the major European clubs are too bothered whether we are in or not because we pose little or no financial threat to them. I believe this has been probably instigated by our own domestic top four, who stand to lose the most if we are successful. The question arises...Are the rags at the bottom of this? Are they the club with the most to lose, including their very existance?

Of all the comments - this is the one on the money!!!

All this talk of law suits is probably fanciful - who would we be suing? on what grounds?

If a football association want to amend their rules of competition - what is wrong with that the courts would say

There is no issue of which they would be interested - e.g. constraint of trade - which led to the Bosman ruling - it might be massively unfair - but that is not going to stop the cartel - I think the chances are very good that Platini will either get his way and stop us - which he will be very keen to do because otherwise the cartel walks and sets up its own competition and his reason for existing is gone

There will have been discussions amongst the 'established order' of how to stop CITY and I think that it is for these reasons that Cook has been seeking to gain friends in powerful places such as his meetings with Barca

For me this is the scum behind this - Platini has talked to Abromovich because they are not part of the G14 but would now be invited and certainly Liverpool would support it

It is their (Uefa) competition they can make what rules they like and they will think up every which way of protecting the interests of their chosen members - if the qualification positions are at risk they will think of others

We need a multi-tiered approach and thankfully our owners probably have the nous to do this

1/ We must qualify for the CL and do it for 2 - 3 years before these rules can come in
2/ We must act to increase our revenue in a number of ways that ensure that our wage bill is met by our revenue
3/ We must go all out to make friends in the important places - such as Barca, RM and other top clubs and dirty as it will feel:
4/We must work closely with UeFa and find ways to influence their plans - if we can sweeten things in a number of ways and get some top clubs on our side then we might be able to isolate the Scum, Chelski and Liverpool - otherwise I am very worried!!

If you start telling people how they run their businesses & start imposing sanctions on them when they haven't broken any laws, it's a matter which is outside the normal remit of sport & will almost certainly end up in court. Whatsmore there may be quite a few clubs who'd be on our side. One or two in Russia for a start.

Also if you look around the worlds media I recon you'll find the Sheikh has influence in, shares in or owns a fair bit of it, including the company that transmits football to the middle East & if I'm not mistaken, the company that owns AC Milan as well as a percentage of Ferrari. Will they really want to piss this bloke off?

Ted - I agree with you on most things and not disagreeing here in the main - bit there is not a vote on this from the majority of clubs that could counter the old G14 - and the courts would not be interested in the 'imposing sanctions' issue unless it became a constraint of trade - which Uefa would be careful to ensure was not how it was presented

But your other comments are spot on - we need to use all the Sheik's influence in every way to put pressure on that would be stronger than the Scum's etc

[Ted Hughes]

The balance of power firmly lies with the ex G14 cartel. They have the financial clout and own the product. Platini and UeFA may be the ruling body but they fall over if the cartel simply say they are withdrawing and going it alone. As happened when the Premier League was set up, the FA and FL laid down and capitulated. The real threat comes from the cartel.

No matter what UeFA say, if the cartel want to go it alone, they will do so. It looks as though it will be by invitation only and the way things seem to stacking up, City may not be invited to the party. If that happens, we will be pretty powerless, despite our money and I don't expect any help from the media.

I don't think any of the major European clubs are too bothered whether we are in or not because we pose little or no financial threat to them. I believe this has been probably instigated by our own domestic top four, who stand to lose the most if we are successful. The question arises...Are the rags at the bottom of this? Are they the club with the most to lose, including their very existance?

Of all the comments - this is the one on the money!!!

All this talk of law suits is probably fanciful - who would we be suing? on what grounds?

If a football association want to amend their rules of competition - what is wrong with that the courts would say

There is no issue of which they would be interested - e.g. constraint of trade - which led to the Bosman ruling - it might be massively unfair - but that is not going to stop the cartel - I think the chances are very good that Platini will either get his way and stop us - which he will be very keen to do because otherwise the cartel walks and sets up its own competition and his reason for existing is gone

There will have been discussions amongst the 'established order' of how to stop CITY and I think that it is for these reasons that Cook has been seeking to gain friends in powerful places such as his meetings with Barca

For me this is the scum behind this - Platini has talked to Abromovich because they are not part of the G14 but would now be invited and certainly Liverpool would support it

It is their (Uefa) competition they can make what rules they like and they will think up every which way of protecting the interests of their chosen members - if the qualification positions are at risk they will think of others

We need a multi-tiered approach and thankfully our owners probably have the nous to do this

1/ We must qualify for the CL and do it for 2 - 3 years before these rules can come in
2/ We must act to increase our revenue in a number of ways that ensure that our wage bill is met by our revenue
3/ We must go all out to make friends in the important places - such as Barca, RM and other top clubs and dirty as it will feel:
4/We must work closely with UeFa and find ways to influence their plans - if we can sweeten things in a number of ways and get some top clubs on our side then we might be able to isolate the Scum, Chelski and Liverpool - otherwise I am very worried!!

If you start telling people how they run their businesses & start imposing sanctions on them when they haven't broken any laws, it's a matter which is outside the normal remit of sport & will almost certainly end up in court. Whatsmore there may be quite a few clubs who'd be on our side. One or two in Russia for a start.

Also if you look around the worlds media I recon you'll find the Sheikh has influence in, shares in or owns a fair bit of it, including the company that transmits football to the middle East & if I'm not mistaken, the company that owns AC Milan as well as a percentage of Ferrari. Will they really want to piss this bloke off?

Ted - I agree with you on most things and not disagreeing here in the main - bit there is not a vote on this from the majority of clubs that could counter the old G14 - and the courts would not be interested in the 'imposing sanctions' issue unless it became a constraint of trade - which Uefa would be careful to ensure was not how it was presented

But your other comments are spot on - we need to use all the Sheik's influence in every way to put pressure on that would be stronger than the Scum's etc

Their only course of action would be to impose sanctions; ie ban us from the Chump's League. I would suggest that anyone taking that action is costing us millions of pounds therefore it would be a constraint of trade & yet we wouldn't have broken any kind of law or been guilty of any kind of unfair trading. It would purely be an action taken to stop us from competing with the favoured clubs. We could point to other clubs having set a precedent in the past & quite rightly say that we're being treated unfairly. I honestly don't think UEFA would have a leg to stand on. I can't imagine any circumstances that a court wouldn't find in our favour.

Their only way to get this through imo will be to find a way of making it acceptable to us & other clubs in a similar position ie; those owned by rich Russian owners who's clubs would have no chance of growing if this comes through.

[Piccsnumberoneblue]

John 68 is bang on again with his analysis. However there is one other factor to consider. The ex G14 clubs and Chelsea have soaked up most of the money from European football and spent it. The next pot of gold in their sights is FIFA's World Cup money. There have already been moves made by the biggest clubs to get their greedy hands on this. The theory being that they supply the majority of the top players and therefore are entitled to a rake of cash. Problem is FIFA use the money for development of football throughout the world. It is their cash cow.
Expect more feisty collisions and sneaky manouveuring from Uefa, FIFA and G14 clubs as this battle unfolds. How strong are Uefa? Have they got the balls to call the bluff of G14 and leave them to breakaway in a League that is more likely to fail than succeed.
They have to have the nuts to say, fine go and play your Euro League, but your players will not play in FIFA or Uefa competitions and your clubs will not play in any F.A.'s competitions. Now fuck off.

[patrickblue]

Mark Hughes view.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/ ... 814430.ece


Michel Platini called to account by Mark Hughes over cash backers

Mark Hughes, the Manchester City manager, has questioned the motives behind Michel Platini’s proposals to place financial constraints on clubs and has cast doubt on the feasibility of imposing such measures.

The Uefa president wants to introduce rules to reduce the rising culture of huge debts in football and curb the lavish spending of billionaire owners, such as Sheikh Mansour at City, to ensure that clubs “break even” on their budgets.

Hughes has spent almost £200 million on transfers since the Arab’s takeover at City in September last year, but that would not have been possible under Platini’s proposals, which aim to prevent clubs spending more than they earn from tickets sales, television rights, sponsorship and prize money come the 2012-13 season.

For clubs with ambitions of Champions League football, there is a danger that Platini’s proposals would turn the European game’s premier cup competition into a closed shop because, without significant investment, there would be little prospect of Hughes’s team challenging for a top-four place.
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“He [Platini] has come with this without really discussing it with clubs across the board,” the City manager said as he prepared for his team’s Barclays Premier League match away to Portsmouth tomorrow. “It’s just a discussion at the moment and we don’t really have a view on it as a club. It looks like it is at the stage of somebody throwing it out there to see what the reaction is.

“Maybe it’s the will of Platini, but whether or not it is manageable or will come into being, who knows?”

As the recipient of a billionaire Arab’s cash, Hughes accepts that his views are biased, but he believes that it is preferable for a club to be owned by a wealthy benefactor, rather than be in heavy debt, and believes that investors such as Sheikh Mansour may be driven away if Platini’s plans become a reality.

“It seems he [Platini] was talking about it being better to borrow money and service the debt rather than having somebody with a real desire to build the club from within and make it prosper,” Hughes said. “Who is to say who is right or wrong? If you have a huge amount of debt, some people view that as being the incorrect way to run a business.”

Nonetheless, Hughes is hoping that City’s spending will be in tune with their turnover in the near future. “We are trying to drive the turnover to a different level, so in three years’ time, if we are successful then, we might be in a situation where our turnover is as big as some of the so-called bigger teams,” he said.

City have yet to concede a goal in three matches this season, all of which they have won, and Hughes is likely to name an unchanged team from the one who beat Crystal Palace 2-0 at Selhurst Park in the Carling Cup second round on Thursday.

[Trautmann]

UEFA would have to come up with a watertight set of accounting principles for football clubs. That could take years, and it would likely be undermined by lack of co-operation between countries, and clubs and owners gaming the rules.

[Dameerto]

I dont see any way that this could legally be implimented - and Im sure we would be challenging it in the European courts as anti-competitive. At the very least Im sure we could slow down it's deployment for a decade or two with constant legal actions.

[Abu Dhabi]

Eh, Al-Jazira will buy all City Players and loan them back on a free.

300M profit and no wages to pay..

[john68]

From Hughes's comments, it is obvious that City are aware of what is going on and of the possible dangers of such moves to block our upward progress. It seems we won't be cuaght our unawares at least.

It does seem to explain why our player investment levels were brought forward as I thought and also gives a clue to the club's future investment strategy to allay the problem.
By buying quality now, we are hoping to achieve success much sooner. This earlier time schedule should allow City to use the earlier success in the global market to increase our turnover to acceptable levels....

It also explains the new academy strategy. Investment in a "Global Academy" to ENSURE that we develop the BEST talent available in the World. We will be the club that is producing the next generation of Etoos, Kakas and Messis.
This will negate the need to enter the transfer marke, except for that extra special player and our transfer spending will decrease. We will have access to the World's best, because we are producing it.....
...and Hey presto...the increased marketting takes care of the increased turnover.

If all that sounds simple, It is ONE HELLUVA GAMBLE...The time scale under discussion makes it paramount to qualify for the CL THIS SEASON...(Which as a side issue, also tells us what the club's target is for this season...It MUST BE TOP FOUR.)

JEEZ...IF MY THEORY IS ON THE BUTTON...WE ARE IN FOR THE FOOTBALL RIDE OF A LIFETIME...CUMMON YOOO BLOOOS!!!

Well, that is my theory...I am quite sure that Ted and a few others will have plenty to add (or subtract) from it.

[Abu Dhabi]

I always love reading your posts John, but let me add something to it...... never gonna happen..

[john68]

I always love reading your posts John, but let me add something to it...... never gonna happen..

Thank you AD. It is only a theory I am shoving forward for discussion and am happy and open for it to be ripped apart.
Please clarify...which bit won't happen...The decreasing rate of player investment? The increased Academy investment? The increased marketting to match out turnover? Or that City will make the top four?
Because of your location, you may have far better info than I. I am only adding together what I know and what I can deduce mate.

I'll leave it with you, Been up working all night and need sleep.

[Trautmann]

Ain't gonna happen. Too many loopholes, too many independent actors....would take years to implement standardized accounting and audit procedures to ensure a level playing field...can you see Real Madrid bowing to the will of the "lesser clubs"?

[Slim]

Ain't gonna happen. Too many loopholes, too many independent actors....would take years to implement standardized accounting and audit procedures to ensure a level playing field...can you see Real Madrid bowing to the will of the "lesser clubs"?

Can you imagine real madrid breaking even without 3rd party assistance?

[blootoof]

4 cans of gold spray from Halfords. Spray out one of the boxes.
1 manikin dressed in head gear
Box for the sheik for 200 million a season

SORTED!

[Slim]

City play an exhibition game in Abu Dhabi every year as part of the preseason, the cost of bringing the City side to Abu Dhabi....200 million.

City make some special limited edition shirts, shockingly the same number as the Sheikh's extended family...price, 10 million per shirt.

Platini needs a fucking clue.

[blootoof]

Hit man from Fallowfield = £ bag of weed

Have him shot

^^^that was a joke if the old bill are readin

[mcfc1632]

Ain't gonna happen. Too many loopholes, too many independent actors....would take years to implement standardized accounting and audit procedures to ensure a level playing field...can you see Real Madrid bowing to the will of the "lesser clubs"?

Can you imagine real madrid breaking even without 3rd party assistance?

But (and I am not paranoid) - this drive is supported by the RMs and Scums of the world - I would suggest that Platini is acting undersome 'direction' and needs to get this right to stop a renewed threat of a breakaway league.

The 'emerging' proposals are all specifically aimed at the CITY situation and also all sepecifically aimed at protecting the RM / Scum situation.

This is clear on the examples given to on the one hand:

specifically focusing on prevent gifts / donations / revenues associated with rich owners etc - creating a body to review and is in their opinion club revenue is not all 'pure football generated' to apply sanctions - predominately exclusion from the CL

On the other hand:

specifically accommodating hugh transfer fees paid for from bank loans where the club can generate revenue to pay the loans - the RM situation

also the scum adn Liverpool are accommodated by not specifically focussing on the amounts of debt - this would be the real indicator of if a club is at risk and one look at the scums and Liverpool would show that a loss of CL money would put them under - but this is all aimed at protecting them

We can make as many posts as we like quoting this or that way around the issue - but when CITY are the focus of the initiative and UeFA can adapt their plans to block any loopholes - it will be very hard

Also - I have previously expressed doubt on all this 'legal challenge' posting:

I do have some idea of what I am talking about and have called a friend who is a specialist in European law - it is not a simple restraint of trade at all:

An appointed organising body publishes its rules for entry into a competition and requires compliance - happens all the time - Olympics - F1 etc - nothing wrong with it. If you do not want to comply - then do not enter - if they say that qualification is the top 4 clubs from a national league that comply - then that is it - unless the conditions contravene established European law.

Also the established top order will not be against it and what interest will any court have in a club that has not ever taken part in the competition seeking to challenge the entry rules

The legal challenge will depend upon contravention of established European laws - just like the Bosman ruling did - this simply would not be the case - you cannot take a situation to the European courts if the situation does not contravene European legislation

I am not trying to be alarmist - just we should take this very seriously - it is the start of an orchestrated attempt to stop it - thankfully we have some very clever people in charge

[Ted Hughes]

City play an exhibition game in Abu Dhabi every year as part of the preseason, the cost of bringing the City side to Abu Dhabi....200 million.

City make some special limited edition shirts, shockingly the same number as the Sheikh's extended family...price, 10 million per shirt.

Platini needs a fucking clue.

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about. If they really want to make this ridiculous claptrap work, they'd have to stop us from receiving money from any kind of creative means we may come up with. If the Sheikh wants to pay us x amount of money for a particular job, Platini is suggesting that they'll stop him. How could they stop him from doing that whilst, at the same time, allowing Utd etc to be paid for playing a friendly in China for example? What if his brother pays us?

They would have to say to us that we're not allowed to use such money, because it could've come from our owner but Utd, Madrid etc can do as they please. Platini may think he'd get away with doing that to us but I don't think he's got a chance in Hell, so IF this does come to fruition, it'll be a watered down piece of window dressing. What's to stop the Sheikh from paying players money in Abu Dhabi, tax free provided they work for City for lower wages? How do UEFA stop him? Will he just let them?

As regards a breakaway league. If it did happen, someone would have to finance it. There's a fair chance that the Sheikh would have connections with such a person, or if they piss him off, BE that person. Either way there's no way someone's going to finance a Super League whilst leaving out the most glamourous club in world football at the time ie; us.

[david yearsley]

If we qualified, the P.L. who want absofuclinluely NO truck with guff the likes of which Platallini is espousing, would have to bat for us, no queston! Where would that leave the relationship between us and (W)UEFA(L) then?

[avoidconfusion]

Seriously guys... look at our owners... they know how to run a business... I fairly certain that even IF this rule comes in in 3-4 years - which I don't believe it will - our owner, the chairman and Cook will have transformed our club into a club with a high enough turn over so that this rule won't really affect us.

[Beefymcfc]

Does anyone know if there is a vote on this by say, all the Top Tier clubs across Europe,the current CL/Europa Clubs or just brought in by UEFA?

The reason I ask is that I cannot see any teams below the 6 signing up for it as it realistically relegates them to non-Euro football with no chance of making the grade.